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Uploading NetMD (SP) from MZ-RH1

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sfbp

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Hi folks. Please feel free to correct me, if I got it wrong. I want to be wrong!!

I am the proud owner of a brand new MZ-RH1 (and a good pair of ears). I was busy uploading all sorts of stuff from MD's to my computer when I noticed that the sound was unusually flat, dull and lifeless.

Let me give a little bit of background - until now I have been recording via the analog input of a JE 5xx or 6xx deck from my stereo system, then walking the MD to another deck in my computer room, and playing back the optical output into the digital input of my sound card. This works perfectly but it's a bit slow - I have to play through the music (at least) twice. The advantage is I can use a wave editor easily before burning the results to CD. I love the sound I get, and eventually I will be able to retire all my old equipment. So I thought perhaps "eventually" might become "soon" if I could do fast uploads using the new technology in the MZ-RH1.

Back to the results of my uploading. I took the first 20 seconds of a recording that I made using the old method, and frequency-analysed it using CoolEdit (now Adobe Audition). The music source is a Rachmaninov Piano Concerto - piano music with orchestra is probably one of the best things for testing listenable sound. The result is shown in the first attached graphic.

post-58665-1184519507_thumb.jpg

Then I repeated the procedure with the USB upload from my new MZ-RH1. The result is dramatic. There is a loss of high frequency so bad that on the default setting of the wave display (0 to -120dB) there is nothing showing above 16 kHz. I expanded the scale to -160dB just to show that it is apparently still there but hugely attenuated.

post-58665-1184519519_thumb.jpg

Please can anyone try to confirm this? Is there anything I can do?

NOTE: I also tried changing the upload setting in SonicStage to "PCM-1411Khz" and the result appears to be unchanged.

Thanks to all you MD experts for your advice on this. I am getting a bit ticked at Sony - it looks like they convert the "NetMD" tracks before uploading them and the conversion kills the sound. I haven't yet tried recording from HiMD as I don't yet have an optical cable to plug INTO the MZ-RH1 as a source of "good" sound, and of course I cannot record Hi-MD's with a JE630.

Edited by sfbp
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Be sure to delete the old version of the file if you change the upload setting, otherwise SonicStage may still use the file that was uploaded as Hi-SP.

This is rather curious though. Unfortunately I no longer have a deck with optical output to try to recreate your scenario.

EDIT: Here are a couple comparisons I did a few weeks ago of various recording modes that you may find an interesting read: http://forums.minidisc.org/index.php?showtopic=19276

Edited by raintheory
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I deleted the post that was here and I now replace it with:

Grrr! I managed to get the wrong frequency analysis to look at, the one of the "right" file.

It's still broken. If you read my previous post, please ignore where I say it got fixed.

Edited by sfbp
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I deleted the post that was here and I now replace it with:

Grrr! I managed to get the wrong frequency analysis to look at, the one of the "right" file.

It's still broken. If you read my previous post, please ignore where I say it got fixed.

Ok, to recap; it looks to me as if Sony is not delivering on its promise to provide uploadable ATRAC (which it knows is the Holy Grail of its possessions - anyone who can really decode ATRAC can wipe the floor with any other compressed format).

I thought I had found a solution but it turned out when I looked really closely I was analysing background noise initially. The portion to the right of 16kHz is essentially just noise, then.

There seems to be an absolute cut off at about 16KHz, more dramatic than in your post in the other thread but nonetheless around the same frequency. (does 16384 sound a possible number? hehehe that is 14 bits of resolution)

Does anyone, familiar with the specs of OpenMG audio format, know if there is a limit on what frequencies it will try to encode?

I can't wait to try out the LinearPCM upload when I get a TosLink input cable in the next few days. Now if *that* is broken, do we (and Sony) ever have a problem!!!!!!!

Cheers

S

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sfbp , welcome to MD community .

You will find a lot of audiophiles here , a few recording studio guys ( I am one of them ) and some tech knowledgeable as well .

Now to revert to my id

the ways of the source , learn you must , frequency analysis , bit rates , and debates , the way of the Dark Side this is . The way of the Source is clean , and sometimes , Analouge it is , consider it not we must from where the Source comes , but always Listen to the source we must hmmmm.

Software to Edit noise , we have , use we will , But the Source , it is all powerfull , it is everywhere , it binds us together , i gives generously to those knowing the source , Whether Digital or Analouge , of the Microphone , it is the Source .

Learn .... hmmmmm The Way of the Source , Happiness , Bring you it Will ........hmmmm , rest ... must rest

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Thank you, most gracious.

As I mentioned at the start I have a good pair of ears, and only to back up the ear conclusions go to the data, I did.

I would be most intrigued if you can provide a counter example - as this would tend to suggest a defective unit as one possibility.

One very weird thing I noticed - Sonic Stage (indeed Windows itself) treats the RH-1 as a different type of device if you change from MD to HiMD, going to far as to uninstall the USB driver (di-duh) and then load up the other one (duh-di). But there appears to be a dropdown box marked "mode" over on the right of the menu panel, above the area occupied by NetMD or Hi-MD listing - and this seems never to operate. Maybe this is something to do with it - I can't easily imagine why this would be there an inoperative, yet the system makes an automatic mode switch by changing device drivers.

All enlightenment gratefully received, it is.

S

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