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Analog Recording level on Sony decks

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trott3r

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Hello,

I am recording from an old tape to minidisc using a jb980 minidisc recorder.

The recording level is set to +12 but it is not getting near the 0 db level.

Does anyone remember/or can briefly test if the ja20es or jb920 had a greater analogue recording level than +12db.

They are in the loft so it will be a pain to dig them up if they are the same (+12db) as the 980

and my 940 i normally use.

thanks for your time

Martin

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It's more likely an impedance mismatch Martin. See if you can find the output level specs of the tape deck, and compare the peak signal level in mV to what the 980 is expecting (125mV to 500mV). Off the top of my head I would expect most decks to be about the same. Certainly all the ones you mention appear to have identical specs in this regard.

Either that or the tape was recorded at low level.

The beauty of the ATRAC format is that it can survive digital amplification quite well because it's a floating point amplitude instead of fixed point (as in CDs).

If you have (as I do) a B&O or similar DIN-standard deck, you'll need a special cable with some resistors soldered inline. Either that, or you already have inline resistors when the MD deck doesn't exactly need them :)

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I am afraid i dont know what impedance,mV are.

If its the same across all MD decks then ok i will just have to accept it at the lower level.

The tape deck is a sony wmdc6 walkman pro ie arguably on of the best tape decks available :)

The tape was recorded at a low level sadly.

Digital amplification?

I am recording from the analog input of the jb980, is that still digitally amplified?

Not old enough to have DIN equipment :)

thanks

Admin note: I think the model is WM-D6C (predecessor was WM-D6).

Edited by sfbp
correction to model number
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Then you have got the ability to change the level using Scale Factor Edit.

I don't know exactly what this will do to the noise level.

If it were me, I would be sucking it into the PC (by uploading something recorded on MD) and beating the sound to death mercilessly using CoolEdit/Audition/Sound Forge. Of course as you amplify you may find you need to remove background. Tape hiss is actually quite a good candidate for noise removal, but you have to learn how.

You'll need an MZ-RH1 to upload, or you can use WAVEREC on the PC to capture the optical out from the 980, assuming you have a sound card with optical in. If you do not, you can buy one for $15 or so.

FInally, is it possible that ALL tape recordings appear to be "attenuated"? If so you may need to demagnetize the tape heads and/or adjust the azimuth. I assume you keep the heads clean - or even playing things may wreck treasured recordings.

(A few minutes later). Aaaah I see, this is a walkman. Are you using Line Out, or Headphone (two separate jacks)? If the latter, this is the source of your problem. That model has a dedicated line out 4.7KOhms with 250mV signal. Should be plenty.

But second hand cassette decks are easy to find, for 50 quid or less. That may be safer for your precious recording, now we are 30 years on. (I know, my B&O is now almost 40 years old but so it goes).

Stephen

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"Then you have got the ability to change the level using Scale Factor Edit."

I dont even know what that does.

Its not present on the 980 but is on the 940 though.

"If it were me, I would be sucking it into the PC (by uploading something recorded on MD) and beating the sound to death mercilessly using CoolEdit/Audition/Sound Forge. Of course as you amplify you may find you need to remove background. Tape hiss is actually quite a good candidate for noise removal, but you have to learn how"

Not really familiar witj PC editing which is why i still like my Minidisc decks :)

"FInally, is it possible that ALL tape recordings appear to be "attenuated"? If so you may need to demagnetize the tape heads and/or adjust the azimuth. I assume you keep the heads clean - or even playing things may wreck treasured recordings."

Thats something i havent done for a while so I think i will try and do that thursday as i am pretty busy for the next couple of days.

"(A few minutes later). Aaaah I see, this is a walkman. Are you using Line Out, or Headphone (two separate jacks)? If the latter, this is the source of your problem. That model has a dedicated line out 4.7KOhms with 250mV signal. Should be plenty."

Using line out.

"But second hand cassette decks are easy to find, for 50 quid or less. That may be safer for your precious recording, now we are 30 years on. (I know, my B&O is now almost 40 years old but so it goes)."

Oddly the mechanical button walkman plays a few tapes fine while the touch button sony 611 and technics 465 all seem to chew the edges of the tape.

Martin

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"Then you have got the ability to change the level using Scale Factor Edit."

I dont even know what that does.

Its not present on the 980 but is on the 940 though.

It's on my 980. There's no separate button for it, but it's there on the edit menu. Even for LP tracks.

Oddly the mechanical button walkman plays a few tapes fine while the touch button sony 611 and technics 465 all seem to chew the edges of the tape.

A 3-motor full-sized deck has several advantages, just as the MD decks do over MD walkmen:

a. more stability than any portable, for speed, wow etc,

b. ability to adjust the pitch to compensate for original recording speed being off

c. better frequency response and ability to deal with different types of tape

d. better line output (sometimes with gain included) - your problem.

e. stronger dedicated motors to wind and rewind the tape (although I haven't examined the Sony in question in great detail).

f. ability to adjust quite easily for tracking and alignment issues.

a. above is the important one, though, I believe. Going through my own K7 collection I found there were tapes that only my best deck would play properly. b. can be solved by an MD deck with pitch control (note that the 980 and 940 cannot increase the speed+pitch, only your 920 and some other SP-only decks can do this - they can all LOWER the pitch+speed).

Stephen

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