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CD to NetMD Program

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BearBoy

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Came across this on the r/minidisc Reddit the other day: https://github.com/Jo2003/cd2netmd_gui#readme

 

cd2netmd_gui

 

Quote

Features

  • reads CD using libcdio
  • supports CDDA paranoia
  • reads CD-TEXT
  • requests track title from CDDB (gnudb.org)
  • supports on-the-fly MDLP encoding on SHARP IM-DR4x0, Sony MDS-JB980, and Sony MDS-JE780
  • support external MDLP encoding for other NetMD devices
  • supports track-, group-, and disc rename / erase on NetMD (context menu)
  • supports simple group management on NetMD (context menu)
  • supports gapless audio in LP2 mode using external encoder and disc-at-once transfer.
  • It is a portable app. No installation needed. Extract it where you like and start it.

Usage

  • Make sure you have installed WebUSB driver through Zadig tool.
  • Start the program by executing the file CD2NetMDGui\QCD2NetMD.exe .
  • Place a CD-Audio in your CD-Drive, place a NetMD in your NetMD drive and press button (Re-)load CD and (Re-)load NetMD.
  • When both discs are displayed, chose tracks from CD, set the transfer settings to your needs and press the Transfer button.
  • In case you want gapless audio (e.g. for live CD or project records), press button DAO Transfer.
  • DAO Transfer will rip the CD into one track, encode the audio through external encoder and transfer the split encode to NetMD.
  • Track management on NetMD is done through context menu.

 

Anybody tried it yet?

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Well, I decided to give it a spin.

 

Really simple to use. Put a CD in your PC and connect up your (NetMD) MiniDisc recorder. The CD and MD appear on the different sides of the window and then you can transfer all or some of the tracks across. You can also edit the titles on either side and create groups etc on the MD side.

 

I did some tests with a 4 track EP (total runtime of 14 minutes and 6 seconds) using an MZ-N910:

  • SP mode took 5 minutes and 56 seconds
  • LP2 mode took 8 minutes and 35 seconds

When transferring in SP mode, each track went through two stages: CD-Rip and then MD-Transfer. In LP2 mode there was an additional "External-Encoder" stage in the middle.

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  • 2 months later...

I'm still confused - and sadly I don't have a deep understanding of the netmd protocol itself.

 

Why is it possible to do a completely gapless transfer with LP2, but not with SP ("supports gapless audio in LP2 mode using external encoder and disc-at-once transfer.")?

What's the difference concerning the encoding of the tracks and setting the correct track marks (or track length in TOC) - presuming I would transfer a proper live CD or maybe Pink Floyd's "Dark Side of the Moon", which has merge tracks all over the place?

 

It would be nice if someone could explain this a bit further.

 

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Actually, I say it worked "fine" but I think I can hear an ever so slight "blip" on the transition between the two tracks I did the test with. I've just done a realtime SP recording using a CD player into a MiniDisc deck and that is absolutely seamless.

 

I'll give Web MiniDisc a try this evening.

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Yeah, I tried it a few times. I mostly get some annoying minimal gaps between files. I'm listening through headphones most of the time and the gaps are clearly audible. Every now and then the transition between tracks comes out gapless, but this is probably just a coincidence because of the sector length of the audio tracks. Most tracks on almost any CDs I tested didn't come out gapless in SP mode.

 

This would be a real shame because I sometimes get skips and errors when copying directly from CD (sometimes my CD player couldn't read a CD sector here and there). If recording would be gapless with netmd and SP quality then (audio) life would be so much easier.

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15 hours ago, BearBoy said:

I'll give Web MiniDisc a try this evening.

 

Tried with Web MiniDisc and got the same very slight "blip" that I got with CD to NetMD. It's not a really gap (i.e. silence) but more a very slight, but audible, stutter at the point of transition.

 

I don't have SonicStage but maybe one of the guys who uses it could advise how that performs with gapless albums.

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14 hours ago, Alfred Stuckmann said:

This would be a real shame because I sometimes get skips and errors when copying directly from CD (sometimes my CD player couldn't read a CD sector here and there). If recording would be gapless with netmd and SP quality then (audio) life would be so much easier.

 

Does your PC have a digital output? If so, you could record to MD from rips of your CDs in realtime.

 

Have you tried cleaning the laser lens on your CD player to see if that stops the skips/errors?

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Thanks for your tests and time.

 

I have four devices with digital output to record in realtime, so that's not my point.

I just like to be on the save side when transfering my stuff to the minidisc. And therefore netmd would be the (!) best solution, if it would let me record gapless in SP mode.

I hoped that this last md limit had been crossed.

 

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23 hours ago, BearBoy said:

 

Tried with Web MiniDisc and got the same very slight "blip" that I got with CD to NetMD. It's not a really gap (i.e. silence) but more a very slight, but audible, stutter at the point of transition.

 

I don't have SonicStage but maybe one of the guys who uses it could advise how that performs with gapless albums.

 

Sonic Stage has always done gapless. I believe WebMD doesn't do it becuase it is built around open source NetMD libraries which had never implemented it (as opposed to the Sony code). Downside of course is that Sonic Stage doesn't do true old school SP.

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10 hours ago, Richard said:

Sonic Stage has always done gapless. I believe WebMD doesn't do it because it is built around open source NetMD libraries which had never implemented it (as opposed to the Sony code).

 

Ah, good to know. Thanks @Richard. There seems to be a fair amount of MiniDisc development activity going on if the r/minidisc Reddit is anything to go by. Maybe someone will be able to crack this.

 

10 hours ago, Richard said:

Downside of course is that Sonic Stage doesn't do true old school SP.

 

Yes, I did recall this after I'd posted the above. Looks like the best solution for now is old school real-time recording.

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vor 12 Minuten schrieb BearBoy:

Looks like the best solution for now is old school real-time recording.

 

Yes, this seems to be the only way for real SP and gapless recording of CD sourced material.

 

I tried my Sony BluRay player because he has a digital coax output and can play WAV files from usb.

Sadly, in this case the scms copy protection forbids the recording with my md recorder.

And later I found out that the playback of the files isn't seamless or gapless. The BD player sends a gap before playing the next track.

 

Maybe another media player with optical or coax output would do the trick. But I guess, one of the issues would occur: no trackmarks, scms, gaps.

 

I think I'll stick with my good old PS2 - seems to be the most reliable CD player that I own.

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I had some issues copying (CDs) from Blu-ray players (tried a Sony BDP-S580 and a Marantz UD7007) but the issues were different from what you have experienced. I had no problem with copy protection or gaps being inserted, quite the opposite: the music came over as one uninterrupted track. Details here if you're interested at all:

I haven't ever tried copying files from a USB device via a Blu-ray or CD player.

 

I am pretty sure I remember copying some tracks I streamed from a NAS via a Sonos Connect (which has optical/coaxial digital outputs) successfully. I probably didn't try any gapless music at the time though.

 

 

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I looked through your other thread. Seems your BD-Player isn't sending PQ-subcode information over digital out e.g. S/PDIF.

So your MD-Recorder doesn't get the track change information it needs to recognize when a new track is playing.

Some "normal" CD-Players have the same limits with digital output. I'm glad that the Sony PS2 (as well as my other drives) do deliver the correct subcode data.

Maybe I'd try a software music player on the PS2 to check if it's able to send gapless data and (!) send the track change information.

 

 

I'll keep my eyes open for other players with USB support and digital output. Meanwhile MD recording with my PS2 will keep me busy.

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On 4/13/2022 at 7:06 PM, BearBoy said:

 

Ah, good to know. Thanks @Richard. There seems to be a fair amount of MiniDisc development activity going on if the r/minidisc Reddit is anything to go by. Maybe someone will be able to crack this.

 

On 4/13/2022 at 7:06 PM, BearBoy said:

Yes, I did recall this after I'd posted the above. Looks like the best solution for now is old school real-time recording.

 

Yes, there is a lot of dev going on the Minidisc Wiki Discord server. Reverse engineering remote protocols, developing WebMD pro version, dumping firmware etc.. 

 

I guess for "old school" gapless SP indeed real-time is the way to go (that's what I do if I want SP, for Atrac 3+ I use Sony Software (X-App)). 

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And again what a shame...

Tried only one CD (in pristine condition), it stutters half way due to read errors and boom ... a ruined recording on MD.

I copied it three (!) times to get a decent one on MD without flaws.

 

Maybe I'd give MD Rec (Windows version) a try. Though it's still real-time, at least the stutters and errors of reading a CD wouldn't mean a thing if you rip the CD before you record to MD.

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On 4/15/2022 at 11:32 AM, Richard said:

Yes, there is a lot of dev going on the Minidisc Wiki Discord server. Reverse engineering remote protocols, developing WebMD pro version, dumping firmware etc.. 

 

Saw this over on the r/minidisc Reddit today. Not usable yet but seems like a promising development: 

 

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  • 2 months later...

For now my solution is the following:

Copying all tracks of one CD as one long track (or one long track for each side of a vinyl LP) , transfer all with Platinum MD (which takes about a third to a half of the toal playing time.

Afterwards I divide the track (or tracks) with my Sony MDS-JE530 and get a perfect gapless Minidisc. Still hoping for an update which can automatically divide the tracks after the transfer to Net MD - but meanwhile for me this is quite a useful way to record complete CDs, LPs etc.

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  • 1 year later...

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