Using Himd For Live Recordings - Questions + Statements

[Taco]

Hello Mini-discers,

I am a sound recordist with special interest in film and video. Additionally, I am interested in recording vocals at clubs either via a mic or from the sound-board.

I am considering buying an nh700 HiMD or better and the following questions about specifications arise:

Q1 - Does the minidisc display recording levels while recording?

Q2 - Is there a trim to control the sensitivity of the recording?

Q3 - Are there built-in limiters?

Q4 - Can one monitor the recording with headphones?

Q5 - Can the minidisc overcome slight bumps without ceasing, corrupting or dropping-out the recording?

Q6 - Using "Total Recorder," or some other similar program, can I plug in my MD, hit a couple of buttons and go to sleep, then arise the next morning to find all of my unique recordings real-time transferred to my computer so I can safely try the "high-speed" transfer?

- Will this result in dead MD batteries?

- Will the computer program stop recording automatically when the MD finishes playing back?

Q7 - Assuming I have a safety backup, how long does it take from when I sit down at my computer with a 90-minute HiSP unique recording to when I have all of that data properly broken up, xferred and converted to usable .WAV files on my computer?

Please correct me if the following statements are false. The actual statements, not a quick glance at them:

S1 - In order to rule out the possibility of losing a recording to a corrupt disc, one must test each 1GB disc before using it in the field.

S2 - In order to ensure that one doesn't lose a unique recording due to SS mess-ups, it is necessary to real-time record each disc before attempting rapid transfer.

S3 - Sony thinks that it's DRM will prevent music piracy even the age of the ubiquitous iPOD. C'mon Sony.. get real. Your MD market is high-quality recordings on the cheap.

S4 - No one has experienced troubles recording from a stereo-pair on a mixing board using simple radio shack adapters using the line-level setting on the HiMD's analog-in. Anyexperiences?

S5 - In order to turn live recordings into a usable .WAV file, one must jump through many hoops. These hoops are often on fire, but have been known to work well.

S6 - "High-speed" transfer takes upwards of 30 minutes for a 90 minute CD-quality life recording.

S7 - While the audio may be recorded at Stereo 44.1 kHz, it is compressed unless recording in PCM mode. In PCM mode, a "1GB" disc only holds ~25 minutes. On a computer, a 1GB PCM wave holds 96 minutes. Is this "1GB" designation reflective of reality?

I'm going to stop as I know I'm getting too specific. Please let me know where I'm mistaken. Also, help me decide whether a HiMD might do this trick (albeit laboriously) for live recording until I can afford a piece of REAL EQUIPMENT at 10x the cost. Please let me know of any other issues that I may not be aware of as Sony seems to magically create problems every step-of-the-way in their MD-line.

Thanks in advance for taking care to read and understand the questions before posting information that can be read in the FAQS. I read the FAQS and would rather not see them rehashed. What I would like is people's responses to these statements and questions so that I can decide whether it is worth my money before buying it.

Thanks everyone,

-Taco

[dex Otaku]

Q1 - Does the minidisc display recording levels while recording?

Yes. It has a 9-segment, 2-channel meter with one mark at -12dBfs and another above the "top" mark at 0dBfs.

As it uses a non-backlit LCD display, all of the pros and cons of LCD come into play, i.e. slow response when cold, difficulty seeing it in dim light, &c.

Q2 - Is there a trim to control the sensitivity of the recording?

Two answers to this:

First, there is a mic sensitivity setting, either 'sens high' or 'sens low'. 'sens high' adds more gain, though to be honest I don't know what the actual gain of both are. In 'sens high' you can start to hear preamp hiss and it's quite easy to run out of [preamp] headroom if things get too loud.

Second, there is a manual record level mode, which is adjustable on-the-fly while recording, though you have to [by menu options] enable this after every 'stop' while recording.

Q3 - Are there built-in limiters?

The units have AGC built in with two settings, 'normal' or 'loud music'. The two do not measure significantly different; I suspect that 'loud music' has a longer sustain/release time.

In my experience with MD and most other equipment, AGC tends to be a bad thing. The AGC on my NH700 sounds quite natural in most environments with an "average" average SPL [if that makes sense to you].

The combination of the sensitivity of my mics [sP-TFB-2 in-ear binaurals] and the AGC on the unit is such that I tend to use the AGC in most situations, which I never would have done with any of the previous MD equipment I'd used.

Q4 - Can one monitor the recording with headphones?

This depends on what you mean by monitoring. The line/mic inputs get routed out the headphone amp, yes, and the amp's EQ is disabled when recording. So yes, you can hear what you're recording.

Neither MD nor HiMD do actual confidence monitoring.

Q5 - Can the minidisc overcome slight bumps without ceasing, corrupting or dropping-out the recording?

I have had few few defects while recording, even with the unit in a loose shirt-pocket while walking around.

It doesn't take too much of a bump to cause glitches, though. The worst I have experienced in terms of this were tiny clicks that sounded similar to a CD skipping, and a loss of <1sec of audio.

Q6 - Using "Total Recorder," or some other similar program, can I plug in my MD, hit a couple of buttons and go to sleep, then arise the next morning to find all of my unique recordings real-time transferred to my computer so I can safely try the "high-speed" transfer? 

Yes, this is exactly how I do things.

     - Will this result in dead MD batteries? 

HiMDs are powered by USB, so this is not an issue.

     - Will the computer program stop recording automatically when the MD finishes playing back?

TR has a timer mode that shuts the recording off and saves the file automatically, which is useful for this.

Q7 - Assuming I have a safety backup, how long does it take from when I sit down at my computer with a 90-minute HiSP unique recording to when I have all of that data properly broken up, xferred and converted to usable .WAV files on my computer?

There is no accurate way to answer this.

Transfer times from the HiMD itself are lengthened by the number of tracks recorded, for instance. i.e. 90 tracks at 1-minute each will take a great deal longer than 1 track of 90 minutes to transfer.

It also depends on what disc type you use. Legacy MDs in HiMD mode are slower than 1GB discs by almost half for read speeds. I do not recall how fast the average HiSP transfer goes, but if you do a search for this on the fora you are likely to find one of our old posts discussing it.

Overall, I'd estimate that my own turnaround time for a 90-minute recording.. Noting that I never use the trackmarks as they were when recording and transferring - I always split things up in editing after.. From the beginning of transfer to writing a finished CD [with no editing other than marking tracks taking place] would be anywhere between 25 and 60 minutes, depending on how complicated the track marking is.

[dex Otaku]

Please correct me if the following statements are false.  The actual statements, not a quick glance at them:

S1 - In order to rule out the possibility of losing a recording to a corrupt disc, one must test each 1GB disc before using it in the field.

I have had no problems whatsoever with the 1GB disc that came with my NH700.

I can't really express any more on this than the above line. 1GB discs are still not available where I live, so I constantly recycle MD80s, and only use the 1GB disc for longer PCM recordings.

S2 - In order to ensure that one doesn't lose a unique recording due to SS mess-ups, it is necessary to real-time record each disc before attempting rapid transfer.

Only one user has reported botched tracks with SonicStage 2.3.

I tested this myself with over 500 downloads one day and lost no tracks. I lost several tracks, including sections of important recordings, using SS 2.1 and 2.2.

Incidentally, I was the one who started pushing the real-time backup idea here in the first place. While I have not lost tracks with v2.3, I still do it as a matter of course. Better safe than sorry.

S3 - Sony thinks that it's DRM will prevent music piracy even the age of the ubiquitous iPOD.  C'mon Sony.. get real.  Your MD market is high-quality recordings on the cheap.

The only ways in which DRM affects me are those related to recording, and they do make certain things a hassle. If you're accustomed to following procedures like those of a broadcast environment, they don't really become an issue, though.

Otherwise, you can't copy music downloaded from SonicStage. The DRM works in this regard, so far, though it's important to note that there are much more efficient [especially in terms of speed] ways to copy music from point A to point B than HiMD [even in data mode].

S4 - No one has experienced troubles recording from a stereo-pair on a mixing board using simple radio shack adapters using the line-level setting on the HiMD's analogue-in.  Any experiences?

I have never had difficulty with this with any MD equipment, nor my HiMD recorder. Plug it in, set the levels, use it.

S5 - In order to turn live recordings into a usable .WAV file, one must jump through many hoops.  These hoops are often on fire, but have been known to work well.

There are hoops, but they're worth going through in terms of how inexpensive MD and HiMD are compared to the results you can get with your recordings. In terms of recording quality, my NH700 has consistently exceeded my expectations.

Also - again, if you're used to following studio-type procedures of any kind, those hoops won't even seem like hoops. They're simply steps in the process. The extra 75 seconds it takes to open Wave Converter, select your tracks, and convert them to WAV files seems like a pretty small price to pay, IMO.

S6 - "High-speed" transfer takes upwards of 30 minutes for a 90 minute CD-quality life recording.

PCM data transfers at between 2.5-3x real-time, so yes, this is accurate. Add more time if the recording is split up into a lot of tracks.

S7 - While the audio may be recorded at Stereo 44.1 kHz, it is compressed unless recording in PCM mode.  In PCM mode, a "1GB" disc only holds ~25 minutes.  On a computer, a 1GB PCM wave holds 96 minutes.  Is this "1GB" designation reflective of reality?

Where the hell did you get this one from?

1GB HiMDs hold 94:55 of PCM audio. An MD80 formatted as HiMD holds about 28.

Cheers.