mgdimo Posted February 19, 2005 Report Share Posted February 19, 2005 Battery Box or separate microphone preamp:Please tell what you use, how and why, and what results you get from your recordings.I kind of already tried this here:http://forums.minidisc.org/index.php?showt...indpost&p=37315...and a surprisingly small number of people came forward. Is it possible that far fewer folks than I thought actually utilize a battbox or preamp? Huh!I have been keeping up with the robust discussion going on here which has helped prove to me, once and for all, that I need to add a mic preamp (most likely) to my arsenal. OK, fine, but which one?I play drums. At times I play bombastically loud. I want a device that can go between my mics and my NH900 which will allow my recorder to capture every nuance of my playing, be it bombastically loud or subtley sweet, without distortion or clipping or audible compensation, then get the polite applause of an audience, then crickets chirping and wine glasses tinkling in the background. Know whatta mean? I want to listen back as if I'm there...withoutdistortionclipping,etc...So........If you have an answer to my question, please provide a testimonial. GREGBattery Box or separate microphone preamp:Please tell what you use, how and why, and what results you get from your recordings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guajiro74 Posted February 23, 2005 Report Share Posted February 23, 2005 Hey There! Well, I'll tell you about my experience. I run Mic Madness High End mini mics into a cheap batt box/preamp made my chuch audio and sold on ebay for about $50. I'd have to say that it works excellently for me. I've recorded a couple of shows both loud and soft and neither the preamp nor mics have overloaded enough to cause distortion. THe only problem w/ this preamp is that it has a selectable gain, +/- 20db, I'd prefer to see a slide gain selector. In any case, all of my shows are recorded at -20db b/c the mics are extremely sensitive and pick up a lot! I've never had a problem w/ distortion.... other problems w/ my minidisc, yes, but never a sound quality issue....hope this helps!ricardo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgdimo Posted February 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted February 28, 2005 Ricardo, thanks for your reply.Anybody know of any other places/forums on the 'net where I might get more of a response to this query? Obviously, I ain't gettin shee-it from here.....except for you Ricardo! Thanks again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewakko Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 MM-Combo3Mic:MM-BSM- 1Batterbox:MM-EBM-1I use it to record my band at shows. I also recorded one rock concert I have attended. I haven't had a chance to experiment much, mostly just plug and play.I have never had a problem with distortion, but my recordings aren't that loud. That's why I'm here trying to figure out what I am doing wrong. I also need to work on mic placement.here are some mp3s I made using the conversion too for himd, I think I only recorded using the hi mode. If you want the wav version of anything, I have also done recording using pcm mode.to be honest I love the sound quality, but with some more work, i'm sure it could come out alot better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shermy Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 Hey Mgdimo, Great Topic!!I personally hope more chime in.I use the MM-COMBO-2 (Stereo Cardioids MM-MCSM-4 and MM-EBM-1 Battery Box). I have almost exclusively recorded via line in with the manual recording levels set at around 24/30 to 27/30. The results have been PHENOMENAL!!!! However, like ewakko, they are not that loud (with the exception of audience members clapping around where the mics are placed). The mics SPL is pretty large at 130db with batt box, so I haven't experienced any distortion. Some simple track editting in Audacity resolves the low volume with no audible reduction in sound quality.I'd like to see what the difference is if a pre-amp is used with a batt box, or on its own in comparison to the batt box or built in pre-amp.Hey ewakko, I clip my mics on a cheapo radioshack standard mic clip so they are in an X-Y pattern much like a Rode NT-4 and put it on a mic stand extended to about 6 feet about twenty feet in front of the band. Stereo separation is excellent. However, your set-up may need to be a bit different since your mics are omni-directional. Perhaps make yourself a jeklin disc. They're very easy to make. Do a search on jeklin disk in this forum for ideas. Google it as well. There's plenty of stuff out there.I personally made one out of a 10" circle of 1/4" plywood with 3/4" foam glued to either side. I then cut an equalateral triangle of 1/8" melamine (about 6" wide on all sides) with a 2" by 1/4" perpendicular slit in the middle of one of the sides. I then cut a 4" by 1/8" slit in the disk for the triangle to slide into. I mounted the base of a microphone clip to the bottom of the disk (so the 4" slit is parallel to the ground when mounted) and mounted it to a mic stand. I clipped the mics onto the tips of the triangles facing forward and slightly out from the disc (about 10 degrees). I wasn't too impressed with the results. I think it's because of my mics being cardioid rather than omni. The results are no center presence. Thats why I now use the X-Y pattern almost exclusively.I'll post some clips of some drums I've recorded with my set-up that have a wide dynamic range if I can find the time to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewakko Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 Shermy,What exactly do you do to your tracks to make them louder?I was messing around with Cool Edit Pro and decided that the Hard Limiter sounded the best. It increased everything by 6db. I haven't had a chance to listen to it on a stereo yet to see if that's the way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shermy Posted March 1, 2005 Report Share Posted March 1, 2005 I use Audacity. There's an Amplify feature in the TONs of available effects. I select the whole track, specify how many decibels I want to amplify and click on OK. I've been using between 15 and 20 db on most of the recordings I've done with excellent results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minispecs Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 (edited) Hey, I use the slimline battery pack with bass rolloff and the level selection from Sound Professionals with the in ear Binaurals...it's great, when it works (that is with my current http://www.minidisc.org/part_Sony_MZ-R37.htmlSony MzR37 :-) but I have a problem figuring the switches when I need to set it to specifics...I don't know anything but "loud and then louder" and "farther and closer to the source" which could be an arena, a small venue or an old theatre that seats approx. 3,000, not what kinds of dBs these situations each produce. When it works, it works great! I've had great recordings from countless places. Then when I don't have it set right, it just gets all distorted and bad :-( Ah well, that's the stuff of live recording :-) But tell me, do they have a listing of the settings that would work for different venue sizes and different loudness requirements? That'd be the bees knees for an amateur like myself :-)Specs Edited March 3, 2005 by minispecs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A440 Posted March 3, 2005 Report Share Posted March 3, 2005 Do you plug into mic-in or line-in with that battery module? And do you use the bass roll-off or just the level control? By the way, here's a link to a decibel scale, though not specifically for music: http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:jlpKM...bel+scale&hl=en Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minispecs Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 Mic In, bass roll-off set to like the second rolloff usually for loud situations, *and* level control in combination, therefore my: "so many variables and me not able to look at the level or audit the recording while it's going happening" :-) I figured out why when I used my MZ-R700 it didn't work from an article online (due to a pre-amp that frequently distorts recordings). However whilst using my older R-37, I still have trouble determining how sensitive to set my battery box and how much bass rolloff to use for each situation. I guess I've been lucky in the past, at times getting excellent recordings just based on intuition, but I want to know what it is I'm doing when I get good results and not just guessing and hit or miss recordings. Precious stuff, my music! :-) I'll check that link out and see if it will help. My recordings range from small clubs with low ceilings and loud music (creating distortion and muffled at best recordings) to larger venues, loud to soft music (general admission) but close to the front (I don't want to be in the back :-)), and then there are the larger, older venues with seats, they are sometimes so cavernous the recordings sound as if they are a little echoy and not at all "what I heard". The music played at each of the larger venues ranges from Piano and unmic'd voice (probably a range of 70 dB to 125 dB! looking at that chart) to full on 4 piece band with drums and bass and electric guitar and mics, all in the same show. I guess I'll have to look into a degree in acoustics and sound engineering as well as a little electronic engineering while I'm at it ;-) I've found that not using the battery box I get major distortion (of course) and I'm afraid to use the line-in option because recordings my friends have done using these settings sound so low, and not at all as rich (after they amplify them digitally) as mine with the batt. box! So this chart you've linked me to (thanks!) will at least help me figure relative sounds to dBs so I know a little better how much I am rolling off in the future. I think my instructions for the box were clear as they could be for how much rolloff you get per setting but I didn't know what the numbers meant! :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A440 Posted March 6, 2005 Report Share Posted March 6, 2005 If you haven't already, try the Radio Shack Headphone Volume Control. It will lower the incoming signal, including the bass that causes most of the distortion, so you'll have to use a higher level in mic-in, but it might help. Try it with or without the battery box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minispecs Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Yes, I've just been reading the specs at the yahoo group, seeing how people are using their mics and machines and settings, etc and how you've acheived loud recordings with your MD with the low sensitivity mics and the attenuator. I'll pick one up on my way home from work today and try it out with a manual setting and my old stereo lapel mics from Radio Shack...those should be low sensitivity without the little battery pack...no? I just pray for hopes of recording with my MZ-r700 as I'd love not to have to switch discs and I can't afford one of the new toys just yet. Even if I can get my R-37 to work without a battery box, that'd be superb! I just wish there were a way to test recording in loud situations without paying for a rock concert! Minispecs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LowMD Posted March 7, 2005 Report Share Posted March 7, 2005 Use your good binaural mics. The RS attenuator will lower the sensitivity enough. I used binaural mics--RS--MZ-R700 at LP2 for many a decent recording. If it's ultraloud and may overload the mics, you could also try Mics-Battbox--RS--Mic-In and see how that comes out.For a tryout: How loud can you blast your stereo at home? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minispecs Posted March 11, 2005 Report Share Posted March 11, 2005 Woo! Thanks LowMD for your testimonial! I will try that (and blast my upstairs neighbor right back...they produce music at home and don't care about my living quality). I'll try with both the batt box and without, maybe I'll blast some Beastie Boys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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