Best MD for recording under $150?

[mandara]

Hey,

I have been trolling the internet and ebay looking at the various recording devices for concerts (mp3, minidisc, DAT) and have found minidisc recorders to be the best (unless you want to spend a lot of cash). I know VERY little about MD recorders and have been trying to find the best recorder (most likely used) to record concerts. I'm not interested in a MD for any other reason so storage capacity, etc is not a concern. Thus far, the recorders of choice amongst tapers have been MD-MS722 and the hard-disk recorder Creative Labs Nomad Jukebox 3, though on this forum everyone keeps talking about the Sony MZ-NH600. Can anyone point me in the right direction? I really can't spend over $150 (hence looking at used models).

I am also looking at older models such as the Sony MZ-900 MD LP...is this now horribly under-quality compared to the newer versions?

Everyone seems so knowledgeable here I'd appreciate any advice,

thanks so much!

[Ishiyoshi]

*thread moved to "Find Your Minidisc".

[A440]

You're trolling old information. The Nomad JB3 is no longer made, line-in only (needs a battery module or preamp), and not universally beloved. It's the size of a CD player, not palm-sized like MD, and I have read about problems with reliability and software. The MS722 is very old and obsolete, and had some firmware problems, not to mention that it's kind of ugly. Whoever recommended that is living in 1998.

For your own peace of mind, ease of use and excellence of recording, spend your $150 on a new MZ-NH700.

http://www.minidiscaccess.com/item.html?PRID=1553220

It is a high-quality recorder and it will upload recordings to your computer. It also has a mic-in jack. The NH600 is line-in only--battery module again, although you'll probably want to get one anyway--and hard to find. Don't confuse it with the NH600D (for Downloader), and don't get sold the wrong one, because the NH-600D has no recording input. The NH-600D is for use as a portable music player. If you do find a good NH600 under $100, jump on it and get a battery module (see below).

Here are all the MD units (look under Recorders). Remember, the entries were written when each unit was new and the latest thing.

http://www.minidisc.org/equipment_browser.html

No unit made before 2004, when Hi-MD (MZ-NH* or MZ-RH*--H for Hi-MD) was introduced, will upload recordings to your computer. Also, units made before Hi-MD recorded only in compressed formats, while you can record CD-quality sound to a Hi-MD (up to 90 minutes per 1GB disc).

Older units will give you decent recordings, but the the music is stuck on the disc unless you want to record them from the headphone jack in real time. If you are willing to do that, you should still at least get a NetMD unit (MZ-N*), like the MZ-N707, because you can have your computer control the playback and separate the tracks through the NetMD interface. But NetMD will not upload, no matter how tempting its USB connection seems: it's one-way, computer to MD.

The MZ-N* units are fairly old, and the MZ-R* units (before NetMD, no computer connection) are getting mighty old, and you would be very lucky to find one that is not wearing out.

I hope you have mics. If not, the ever-reliable Sound Professionals BMC-2.

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-BMC-2

You occasionally find them about $10 cheaper on ebay, because sometimes Sound Professionals sells them there.

For just about any amplified music, you also need a battery module, like this one, to make recordings through line-in:

http://www.microphonemadness.com/products/mmcbmminminc.htm

or at the very least an attenuator ($7), the Radio Shack Headphone Volume Control, shown in my avatar, to record through Mic-in.

I know that adds to your budget. But if you get an old unit, you'll end up replacing it, probably sooner rather than later. I have been knocking around my MZ-NHF800 (just like the NH700, but with a radio remote I never use) for two years, and it just keeps going.

[raintheory]

If you plan to use the unit for live recording, you will most likely want a Hi-MD recorder. Hi-MD will not only record in uncompressed PCM, but will also allow you to upload your recordings digitally to PC faster than realtime via USB. NetMD and older units can only record at the highest quality of SP (292kbps), and there is no way to upload to PC with those older units.

The NH600 is a Hi-MD unit with only a line-in (no mic-in), but be wary of the USA model NH600D which has no inputs and is a downloader only unit.

You might want to look into either the NH700 or NHF800. You should be able to find these for fairly cheap (definitely under $150 USD) and they are almost identical, the only difference is that the NHF800 comes with a radio remote.

Here is some basic info on the units.

NH700 - http://www.minidisc.org/part_Sony_MZ-NH700.html

NHF800 - http://www.minidisc.org/part_Sony_MZ-NHF800.html

EDIT: Guess you beat me to it A440

Edited September 27, 2006 by raintheory

[mandara]

A440 & Raintheory,

Wow, ok, thanks for the info!

So the question now becomes do I need the NH700 or will the NH600 do the job. One thing I'm not particularly clear on is the relative importance of having a mic-in jack as opposed to a line-in only. Do I understand correctly that the line-in only will allow me to record (but I have to make the decision of whether to plug a battery module OR mic into it) whereas having a mic-in eliminates this problem? Would you say that is that is the main difference between the 2 and is it a significant one?

I checked out the mic you recommended (no I don't have any recording materials so any 'peripherals' advice would be handy as well) and it looks like there are components that combine a mic/battery module into one unit. Is that what would be required with the NH600?

I did see a used NH600 on ebay, wondering right now if I should go for that or if it is a better venture to wait for a NH700...

thanks again!

[sector001]

A440 & Raintheory,

Wow, ok, thanks for the info!

So the question now becomes do I need the NH700 or will the NH600 do the job. One thing I'm not particularly clear on is the relative importance of having a mic-in jack as opposed to a line-in only. Do I understand correctly that the line-in only will allow me to record (but I have to make the decision of whether to plug a battery module OR mic into it) whereas having a mic-in eliminates this problem? Would you say that is that is the main difference between the 2 and is it a significant one?

I checked out the mic you recommended (no I don't have any recording materials so any 'peripherals' advice would be handy as well) and it looks like there are components that combine a mic/battery module into one unit. Is that what would be required with the NH600?

I did see a used NH600 on ebay, wondering right now if I should go for that or if it is a better venture to wait for a NH700...

thanks again!

the mic in jack would definitely eliminate the need for a battery module if u want to record from a mic. the line in allows u to record from other sources such as a CD player. with the line in u can also record with a mic but u would need to use the battery module.

if live recording is not important, i just get one that has a line input only.

Edited September 28, 2006 by sector001

[bobt]

Spend the extra and get the 700 (800), the extra flexibility of mic/line in is well worth having, if you have access to the mixing board, you can plug right in, if stealth or lack of access to mixing board, mics are the answer. Spend as much as you can afford, and let us know what happens.

Take care and welcome,

Bob

[raintheory]

Be extra sure that the NH600 isn't the NH600D which as mentioned earlier has no actual physical inputs (except USB) and is a downloader only unit.

But I do agree that the mic-in is definitely worth the extra cash.

Edited September 28, 2006 by raintheory

[A440]

Mic-in has a preamplifier behind it. That boosts the small signal from the mic for unamplified sounds like speech or unamplified music. However, with amplified music the preamp tends to overload, hence the alternative of mic--battery module--line-in to bypass it.

Line-in has no preamplifier, so it requires a battery module for loud sounds and a preamplifier (nearly as expensive and just about as large as the MD unit) for quiet ones. A mic jack gives you a lot more flexibility.

Look very closely at the listing for any "NH600" on Ebay. Nine times out of 10, they're the NH-600D.

Edited September 28, 2006 by A440

[sector001]

Mic-in has a preamplifier behind it. That boosts the small signal from the mic for unamplified sounds like speech or unamplified music. However, with amplified music the preamp tends to overload, hence the alternative of mic--battery module--line-in to bypass it.

Line-in has no preamplifier, so it requires a battery module for loud sounds and a preamplifier (nearly as expensive and just about as large as the MD unit) for quiet ones. A mic jack gives you a lot more flexibility.

Look very closely at the listing for any "NH600" on Ebay. Nine times out of 10, they're the NH-600D.

yeah, even the picture of the unit is the 600d though the seller says NH600

[mandara]

Hey all,

Thanks for all of the advice, I did go with an NH-700 and am in the process of trying to figure things out. I bought a 1GB Hi-MD as suggested and am now trying to upload what I recorded onto the computer. I have a few questions concerning file types and how how to get away from ATRAC software. Right now I have the songs I recorded uploaded into My Library (all are OMA files ATRAC3 Plus) but am having trouble finding how to convert them to MP3s, WAVs or any other file type that will let me burn them to a CD. Is there a different software interface I should be using? I was under the impression that these recordings could be converted to usable media and were not limited to either a MD or an ATRAC cd.

Thanks in advance!

Mamdara

[greenmachine]

Make sure you use Sonicstage v3.2 or later [v4.0 linked in the software section of these forums], then right-click the track in the library window -> "save in wav format" and use an external application of your choice to convert to a format of your choice [like mp3]. Or use HiMD-Renderer [in the software/downloads section of these forums].

[King Ghidora]

You made the right decision on MD recorders. The mic jack is always there for recording music events where the sound level isn't rock concert style. There are other types of music in the world. Of course you could still record to a line in recorder with a mic pre-amp but that's usually more money than just moving up to a recorder with a mic in jack. Maybe the quality is better on some add on pre-amps but IMO the difference is minimal. The unit you chose will do great for you in just about every situation you get into.

You didn't say what mics you bought. Another popular choice are Giant Squid products especially the powered omnis but the Sound Pro mics have a great reputation. The GS would cost you more than the Sound Pro too.

There are still other choices depending on exactly what you want to do. I think people have pointed you toward stealth type mics because you mentioned concerts. There are other types of mics though and some of them are great.

If you use Sonicstage 4 it will ask you if you want to convert to wav files when you upload from the MD recorder. It's a simple process once you figure it out which won't take you long. People tend to complain about the software issues with Sonicstage but I don't have any problems with it. I'd prefer it worked like some of the other stuff on the market where it would just look like a hard drive and you could download easily but it really isn't all that much trouble the way it is.

BTW there were other choices for recording devices IMO. I know you already bought yours but someone else might be interested. A Rockboxed iRiver hard drive based recorder can be a good unit to have but you don't have a mic input so of course it's a battery box or pre-amp. Plus hard drives are fragile so one good drop and your unit is dead. I prefer MD myself. If you had more money an Edirol R-09 would be a very good choice but it costs quite a bit more than your budget.