digitally recorded files not transferring on mac

[btovsky]

hi all

i posted a response to another frustrated mac user and thought i would make a general post about this issue to see if anyone has had any luck getting an answer from Sony. i recently did recordings of some of my live performances using my MZ-M100 HiMD deck by plugging directly from my M-Audio FW410 firewire audio interface into my MZ-M100 using an optical digital cable so that the recording would stay in the digital domain. i recorded in PCM mode onto a 1 gig HiMD disk in HiMD mode. after the show i checked the recording, which played back fine. however, when i got home and attempted to import the file using the Sony HiMD Music Transfer v2 software it showed the "single note" icon which identifies a non-compatible file. i searched through the software manual and only found a reference to these "one note" files as "non transferrable." i decided to do some tests, and did recordings on a new disk digitally using both an optical source and a SPDIF source through a SPDIF-to-optical converter; an analog recording from the FW410 to the line in of the MZ-M100; and using a mic into the mic in. everything but the digital recordings transferred fine. to be clear: these digital recordings were sourced from my g4 powerbook running os x 10.4.9, and the audio was generated from live audio i was feeding from Ableton Live, the music software i use when performing. no pre-recorded audio was used. both the HiMD Music Software and Sonic Stage docs state (Sonic Stage says this specifically) that digitally recorded files are transferrable if recorded in PCM, HiMD SP and HiMD LP modes. i have tried several times to talk to Sony tech support about this issue, but have been stymied trying to get past Tier 1 tech support to someone i don't have to enlighten about how recordings are made. ;-) the last time i tried, kindly and with great patience and tact, they hung up on me. i am assuming that this is somehow related to digital piracy issues, but since these are original digital recordings i am stumped as to why Sony would block these as it stops any musician who has a relatively modern setup from recording their music digitally. this was the reason i bought the HiMD in the first place!

anyone else have issues with this?

cheers

bruce

[Strungup]

. i recorded in PCM mode onto a 1 gig HiMD disk in HiMD mode. after the show i checked the recording, which played back fine. however, when i got home and attempted to import the file using the Sony HiMD Music Transfer v2 software it showed the "single note" icon which identifies a non-compatible file. i searched through the software manual and only found a reference to these "one note" files as "non transferrable." i decided to do some tests, and did recordings on a new disk digitally using both an optical source and a SPDIF source through a SPDIF-to-optical converter; an analog recording from the FW410 to the line in of the MZ-M100; and using a mic into the mic in. everything but the digital recordings transferred fine. to be clear: these digital recordings were sourced from my g4 powerbook running os x 10.4.9, and the audio was generated from live audio i was feeding from Ableton Live, the music software i use when performing. no pre-recorded audio was used. both the HiMD Music Software and Sonic Stage docs state (Sonic Stage says this specifically) that digitally recorded files are transferrable if recorded in PCM, HiMD SP and HiMD LP modes. i have tried several times to talk to Sony tech support about this issue, but have been stymied trying to get past Tier 1 tech support to someone i don't have to enlighten about how recordings are made. ;-) the last time i tried, kindly and with great patience and tact, they hung up on me. i am assuming that this is somehow related to digital piracy issues, but since these are original digital recordings i am stumped as to why Sony would block these as it stops any musician who has a relatively modern setup from recording their music digitally. this was the reason i bought the HiMD in the first place!

anyone else have issues with this?

cheers

bruce

Welcome to the DRM /SCMS nightmare, I am also on a Mac ....Second gen Optical copies are forbidden,period , no matter what the source is. If you record from line in ,you still get a Nice wav file ( that is Sony's way around Copyright Laws, while still imposing them )

I had a CD that I made on the Macbook , put it in a seperate CD Player , tried to make an optical copy to the RH1 , no dice.

I have Live as well.

In order to sell in other Countries or to have an international market Sony has to abide by EVERYONES copyright laws, which differ from Country to Country. So to avoid Lawsuits of ANY kind ,and to have to market open to them , this is what they have to do , because it is classed as a "Consumer Product" not Pro Audio ( the taxation is different.)

To bolster this thought , on the first MD recorder, which I have one, you have Optical in AND out , and its the ONLY portable sony made that does. they stopped very soon after because of Copyright violation possibilties.

sux doesnt it.

[raintheory]

You can upload optical recordings to PC just fine with SonicStage.

Go figure.

[Strungup]

You can upload optical recordings to PC just fine with SonicStage.

Go figure.

Yeah but PCM gets converted to Atrac, on the Mac it all gets converted to Wav , so a PCM file doesnt change at all (which is the optimum choice ) and as that it doesnt , it represents a chance for violations, because digital is digital , and inumerable copies can be made at that quality. So that show the difference between Mac and Windows , the audio quality of the Mac Core audio is straight up studio grade audio. So they put the design restriction in the program .

I will eventually figure out a way around it.

[btovsky]

Welcome to the DRM /SCMS nightmare, I am also on a Mac ....Second gen Optical copies are forbidden,period , no matter what the source is. If you record from line in ,you still get a Nice wav file ( that is Sony's way around Copyright Laws, while still imposing them )

understandable, except in my case i am making FIRST GENERATION digital recordings not copies. is Sony saving me from myself?

b

[A440]

Sony is under the impression that anyone making an optical recording of anything is a bootlegger. This is what happens when an equipment manufacturer also owns record labels and a film studio.

Guitarfxr, are you sure that PCM gets converted to ATRAC? As far as I know, those are supposed to be uncompressed uploads. It's encrypted when it's PCM and then unencrypted to .wav--no quality loss.

[Strungup]

Sony is under the impression that anyone making an optical recording of anything is a bootlegger. This is what happens when an equipment manufacturer also owns record labels and a film studio.

Guitarfxr, are you sure that PCM gets converted to ATRAC? As far as I know, those are supposed to be uncompressed uploads. It's encrypted when it's PCM and then unencrypted to .wav--no quality loss.

When you load from PCM into SS what does it do ? Since I am on a Mac I might be in the Drak on the Windows side of things about SS , so forgive me. On the Mac side even if it is in HIlp mode it gets converted and loaded as a Wav file so that it will go straight into an Audio editor,( can you see the conflict there ?????? They encrypt the crap out of it on one side then completely open it on the other !!!!!)

[A440]

With SonicStage on a PC, everything goes into My Library as its original quality. Then you can Convert to .wav, which preserves whatever the original quality was--including PCM. Or you can use Marcnet's Hi-MD Renderer to convert anything in My Library to .mp3, .ogg, or other formats. But PCM recordings never get compressed.

[Strungup]

With SonicStage on a PC, everything goes into My Library as its original quality. Then you can Convert to .wav, which preserves whatever the original quality was--including PCM. Or you can use Marcnet's Hi-MD Renderer to convert anything in My Library to .mp3, .ogg, or other formats. But PCM recordings never get compressed.

Oh ok , gotcha . I have never used SS, Although I know it will load under Parrallels for Mac. I havent done it .

[otter]

I too am experiencing this frustration. After looking through both the RH1 and Hi-MD Transfer for Mac manuals, I see nothing mentioning a limit on optical transfers to the Mac. Seriously annoying!! I have Parallels and the transfers work fine (though agonizingly slow), which makes no sense if it's a DRM issue.

I'm using a Korg Triton Extreme with the RH1 via optical cable to record musical ideas and the sync feature is wonderful for pausing the recording when there's no sound. But I don't see the point of having to jump through the extra hoops when those hoops are made available on the PC. So much for that better-late-than-never Mac support.

[raintheory]

I'm using a Korg Triton Extreme...

Wonderful machine there... Very intimidating though, we've had ours for over 2 years and have barely scratched the surface of it's possibilities.

Edited August 22, 2007 by raintheory

[Strungup]

I too am experiencing this frustration. After looking through both the RH1 and Hi-MD Transfer for Mac manuals, I see nothing mentioning a limit on optical transfers to the Mac. Seriously annoying!! I have Parallels and the transfers work fine (though agonizingly slow), which makes no sense if it's a DRM issue.

I'm using a Korg Triton Extreme with the RH1 via optical cable to record musical ideas and the sync feature is wonderful for pausing the recording when there's no sound. But I don't see the point of having to jump through the extra hoops when those hoops are made available on the PC. So much for that better-late-than-never Mac support.

That thing is a full recording studio , Full .wav import /export , via the drive ..... Have you tried mixing down to wav file dropping on a disc then to the Mac?

Ahhh , but the Idea catching of the Live session that your doing , there is a way to record to the hard drive in it , but a few menu steps , so that kills the fun I guess

[otter]

Wonderful machine there... Very intimidating though, we've had ours for over 2 years and have barely scratched the surface of it's possibilities.

I hear ya. I'm nowhere near figuring it all out.

[otter]

That thing is a full recording studio , Full .wav import /export , via the drive ..... Have you tried mixing down to wav file dropping on a disc then to the Mac?

Ahhh , but the Idea catching of the Live session that your doing , there is a way to record to the hard drive in it , but a few menu steps , so that kills the fun I guess

Yes, I have done that, but only when working on something more complete. The TE really is an amazing machine. It's at the beginning stage that I wanted to find a way to capture ideas.

What I've started doing is recording with the sequencer (metronome off since it's a free-form idea dump) and saving the performance as a standard MIDI file since I really only want the performance data. I can then write it to CF card, or plug my RH1 into the USB port as a drive (awesome that it works!) and copy it to my Mac. From there I can drag the MIDI file into Garageband to get a rough display of the notation. Sometimes I don't get back to these ideas for weeks or months, so if I forget what notes I played I can reconstruct/refresh my memory from looking at the notes.

After recording with the sequencer I can also hook up the RH1 via optical cable or Line In and play the sequencer recording into it - essentially what I did before, but now I also have the data saved. Best of both worlds.

Another cool thing I discovered, though it's probably common knowledge, is that the sync play also works via audio cable into Line In. It won't pause the recording like optical does, but it will start a new track as soon as you begin playing again. I can always chop off the blank spaces later with Audacity.