Now I'm starting to Understand - thanks to MDs!

[md user]

Right, so now I've 'perfected' my MD setup ., my attention has now turned to Headphones!

You see, it all started when I generated a test frequency pass from audacity onto MD, and then profiled my different headphones ...

Then I realised that flat frequency curves and 0.01% THD are not everything. I mean, have you seen a frequency profile of some seriously good headphones? See here if not, it was a revelation to me! (It seems to me to be more about tonal balance, construction, and bespoke designing me-thinks, rather than 'cold numbers'!)

This exercise certainly helped me understand the strengths/weaknesses of my (far cheaper) headphones, in comparison.

Just thought I'd share this with you - this MD-thing has really started to improve my understanding of 'audiophile' quality (previously beyond my reach).

Regards all.

mdmad.

[bobt]

Right, so now I've 'perfected' my MD setup ., my attention has now turned to Headphones!

You see, it all started when I generated a test frequency pass from audacity onto MD, and then profiled my different headphones ...

Then I realised that flat frequency curves and 0.01% THD are not everything. I mean, have you seen a frequency profile of some seriously good headphones? See here if not, it was a revelation to me! (It seems to me to be more about tonal balance, construction, and bespoke designing me-thinks, rather than 'cold numbers'!)

This exercise certainly helped me understand the strengths/weaknesses of my (far cheaper) headphones, in comparison.

Just thought I'd share this with you - this MD-thing has really started to improve my understanding of 'audiophile' quality (previously beyond my reach).

Regards all.

mdmad.

Good realization, as I and others have pointed out, in the end it is how you perceive and how you like it, rather than the numbers. Numbers may tell us that a $200 a foot interconnect or speaker cable is better, but our ears tell us better. As to headphones, or earphones, everyone's ears, and ear canal, as well as eardrum integrity, and the closeness of the driver tp the ear, and the relationship between frequency and perception of volume, means that liberties have to be taken to make them "sound" good.

Bob

[Modernaire]

I'm also looking into ear/headphone choices over the stock ones that come with our MDs.

I've also realized that our ears and listening perceptions adapt and thus you have to assure yourself as with your conclusions MDmad and Bobt's that one's got the best sound happening with what you're listening with. Probably then the first step is initial wow-factor. Does it from the first play of a song through the ear/headphones sound stellar then thats it. But if there is any doubt, dont' just accept it because you want to hear the music or dont want to invest time and money in auditioning, trying out higher quality headgear.

Once you accept the mediocre or perhaps substandard quality, then your ear will adapt and accept that as the norm. Thats why there's a market for cheap, mediocre head/earphones. And new brands with trendy styles are popping up all over from China competing with the established greats like Sony, JVC, Denon and so on.

So if you've always spent very little in earphones and never listened to higher end products, then you simply are not pushing up your quality because you may have accepted so-so quality as the norm. I know I repeated myself there but you get the picture.

Good post.

[md user]

Good realization, as I and others have pointed out, in the end it is how you perceive ,,,

Bob

Following on, from your experience, what's your opinion of Koss Porta Pros? (Or another phone of similar price/quality/type.)

I'm looking for a replacement of my lightweights, ones that are of good 'accuracy' (i.e. not over-enhanced bass, but yet still 'weighty') for my portables. I especially don't want too much in the very-highs (I have RP-F500s for that). $40-50 budget.

[Yes, I know about EEPROM tweaks for bass, treble and X-sound - whatever I buy I will optimise to my taste.]

I just wanted to check from someone who may appreciate Sony or Sharp MD amps (as most reviewers usually match to iPods, it seems.)

Also, I know that there are many other makers of good quality lightweights, it's just that I've got to choose some pretty soon, and their frequency profile looks to about my taste.

Thanks to anyone who knows a little to pass on.

Regards all,

mdmad.

[A440]

I have both PortaPros and Sennheiser PX-100 (not 200, they are quite different). I prefer the Sennheisers. For me, the Koss push the midrange a little more, while the Sennheisers are smoother. Neither is particularly shrill. The Sennheisers have a puffier bass than my better headphones, but for portable use they are extremely comfortable and sound great for the price.

[md user]

I have both PortaPros and Sennheiser PX-100 (not 200, they are quite different). I prefer the Sennheisers. For me, the Koss push the midrange a little more, while the Sennheisers are smoother. Neither is particularly shrill. The Sennheisers have a puffier bass than my better headphones, but for portable use they are extremely comfortable and sound great for the price.

Thanks A440 - that's very helpful of you.

With Regards,

mdmad.

[bluecrab]

Thanks A440 - that's very helpful of you.

With Regards,

mdmad.

I have the Sennheiser PX-200. They are indeed different form the '100.

The '200 sounds great, once you find the right position to use them (lower on the ear for me).

I find them fairly comfortable for 3-4 hours, occasionally longer. I use them at work and when flying.

They fold up into a fairly small size and come with a hard plastic case. Mastering the folding, encasing, and de-casing is somewhat of an art form.

If you like something that fits ON the ear - not over, not in, they might be worth checking out.

Good luck!

[Modernaire]

Anyone tried Bose In-Ear's? I'm breaking some in now, at first the sounded harsh in the mids and bassy, after already a few hours, they are sounding very, very natural. I hope the soundstage opens up a bit though. I'm really impressed by them, I usually am not a Bose aficionado as I've always been SONY dedicated.

[md user]

I have the Sennheiser PX-200. They are indeed different form the '100.

The '200 sounds great, once you find the right position to use them (lower on the ear for me).

I find them fairly comfortable for 3-4 hours, occasionally longer. I use them at work and when flying.

They fold up into a fairly small size and come with a hard plastic case. Mastering the folding, encasing, and de-casing is somewhat of an art form.

If you like something that fits ON the ear - not over, not in, they might be worth checking out.

Good luck!

Thanks to you too bluecrab! Now I have three to choose from! - all of them seem good - can't go wrong can I?

Thanks to everyone for the 'quick guide' to my choice. :thank_you2:

mdmad.

[md user]

Good realization, ... and the closeness of the driver tp the ear, ... means that liberties have to be taken to make them "sound" good.

Bob

Yes, and, in the case of 'on-the-ear' types, where and at what angle they press - I find greater treble if pressing on the lobe; i.e. I am finding that there is actually a 'sweet spot'.

I am actually starting to 'mod' an old pair to optimise them! (I know, a bit obsessive ... ); changing proximity, position and angle.

Still, I've never enjoyed the quality of music this good !

MDs R Great!

mdmad.

[md user]

I'm also looking into ear/headphone choices over the stock ones that come with our MDs. ....

Once you accept the mediocre or perhaps substandard quality, .... Thats why there's a market for cheap, mediocre head/earphones. ..... I know I repeated myself there but you get the picture.

Yes! And what a pity! (I know, to sell more headphones ...). But really, when MD units were expensive, they should at least have RECOMMENDED (their own brand) headphones in the manual (or in an enclosed leaflet).

I mean, they go on about buying their own brand rechargeable batteries ... yeah right, makes a BIGGER difference!

And don't say that everyone knows about headphones - most of my friends/family still use stock phones for bought players! (Normally because they aren't bothered and/or just haven't experienced quality phones.)

mdmad.

[bobt]

In addition to my post, I should have added that I have the buds that MD's came with as well as some upper end Son's that I got a while ago, model number escapes me, they have the angled ear pieces and open back, very smooth and open sounding, worth a try. I haven't tried the expensive Koss's, but the ones I have listened to seem to acentuate the midrange too much for my liking.

Bob

[Modernaire]

I recently added an MZ-M100 to my MD collection, I love this MD by the way, and it came with OEM Sony earphones. Since my last post here I was breaking in those in ear Bose earbuds and found that the stock Sony's sound so much better. I listened repeatedly with the Bose and found they had narrow sounstage, good bass though, but not clear and or crisp, even with EQ tweaking. The sony's that came with the M100 sound clearer, I can hear more detail, the soundstage sounds wider, the bass nice and tight, I think their great! I would not hesitate to buy another pair. So there you go, perhaps in the higher end portables, the earbuds were better. I will say also that the stock earphones that came with an S1 MD I bought also sound pretty darn great....to my ears at least.

[md user]

I recently added an MZ-M100 to my MD collection, ... I listened repeatedly with the Bose and found they had narrow sounstage, good bass though, but not clear and or crisp, even with EQ tweaking. The sony's that came with the M100 sound clearer, I can hear more detail, the soundstage sounds wider, the bass nice and tight, I think their great! I would not hesitate to buy another pair. ...

Unlucky!

Wow! I would have thought that It takes some doing to buy HQ branded phones worse than stock ones! And from Bose!

[i presume that those Bose's weren't fakes?]

Mind you, the M100 does deserve a good phone, perhaps the EX500,700 ... &c.? (if one can afford these!)

What model were they? Perhaps they are a bad match to non-ipods?

Would like to know more ...

Regards,

mdmad.

[Tom in RI]

I have had a pair of Sennheiser PXC 250's that I have been pretty happy with, although the extra cord due to the battery pack can be annoying. But since I am often using the phones in public I do use the noise canceling quite a bit. For my home system I just got Grado 325i's, the first piece of home equipment I have sprung for in quite awhile.

[md user]

mdmad; don't think of Bose as HQ. It's not because ...

OK. [Haven't had anything by Bose myself. A presumption like many another - "high price=HQ"].

It DOES annoy if a manufacturer is mostly hype and not substance ...

Thx for your experience - it may help another.

Mdmad.

[md user]

Yes, and, in the case of 'on-the-ear' types, where and at what angle they press - I find greater treble if pressing on the lobe; i.e. I am finding that there is actually a 'sweet spot'.

I am actually starting to 'mod' an old pair to optimise them! (I know, a bit obsessive ... ); changing proximity, position and angle.

Still, I've never enjoyed the quality of music this good !

MDs R Great!

mdmad.

Now, furthermore, I am finding that there is a 'sweet spot' at a PARTICULAR VOLUME. Have you noticed?

I used to TURN UP the volume when I enjoyed my music - MISTAKE!

By using audacity, and profiling, I am finding that because the human ear responds to bass (relative to treble) differently as volume goes up, that, according to taste, you will find an optimum ratio at a certain volume. (Depends on mood &c.)

Maybe this is why higher quality phones can present better balance at higher volumes - due to power handling at the lower frequencies?

Hope it helps,

MDmad.

[md user]

.... . I listened repeatedly with the Bose and found they had narrow sounstage, good bass though, but not clear and or crisp, even with EQ tweaking. The sony's that came with the M100 sound clearer, I can hear more detail, the soundstage sounds wider, the bass nice and tight, I think their great! I would not hesitate to buy another pair. So there you go, perhaps in the higher end portables, the earbuds were better ...

I have just managed to make a an old pair of cheap (£10!) sports clip-ons sound 'as good as' my £40 Technics! - by Equaliser tweaking in Audacity.

This pair had very little Bass response (as expected), but after whamming up the low frequencies, and compensating for 'holes' - they really are getting my toes tapping! I mean they really ARE convincing now (relatively, of course, according to type of phone). Soundstage is excellent - I can even 'feel' the producers adjusting the song's balance, and one percussion event I even thought was in the room on one song! (They already had great mid-range accuracy.)

There you go - you may be able to rescue flawed phones - to some extent - thanks to MDs (and Audacity)!

(Mind you, this does mean that my MDs become specific to an headphone setup.) Bespoking indeed!

Hope this gives you some, err ... hope. If not, I'll rescue the Bose's if they're going cheap!

Just thought I'd pass this on - they really are cheering me up [thought that they were no use anymore]; might help someone.

mdmad.