Using the NW-E00x Series in Aircrafts?

[adrifted]

Hi,

I have been planning to buy a NW-E002 player and have been doing some background search. I was taken aback, when I found the following short sentence in the user guide: "Do not use the player on an aircraft."

In fact, I have no intention of listening the tunes while on board, but I want to use the player mostly in the journey to the airport and during the long wait there. And then I would be happy to pack the player in and get on the plane. But as it seems, there is no way of switching the player completely off - one can put it on the stand-by mode only. Does the player being on the stand-by during the flight qualify as "use" and could that infterfere with the mechanisms of the plane? If that's the case, I really would go for some other brand that has an "off" switch and opt for a life without ATRAC.

Note that the NWE002 model does not have FM capabilities either, so this should not be a cause for concern.

Have any you travelled by plane with this player ?

[imagine_]

I have been on 7 flights (international and local) in the past two months, and listened for most of the flight.. was never a problem. It was clearly visible and the attendants didn't say anything. With the little amount of power these things use, even if everyone on board was listening, I don't think there would be any problem at all. It is just a safety precaution to shut off all devices, since some ppl may have old devices such as old cell phones which emit a lot of radiation.

Edited August 26, 2006 by imagine

[pata2001]

I never see an airline preventing portable audio players to be used on-board. Probably only during take-off/landing. Of course, with today's paranoia that a hair-gel can blow up a plane, I don't know. Funny that a hair-gel is considered more dangerous than a drunk pilot.

[adrifted]

Thanks.

However, the point that I was concerned about was exactly the issue that since one cannot switch the player off completely at all, one cannot switch off the player during take-off and landing. Or is the standby modus "off" enough?

[imagine_]

It is 'enough'.. there is nothing to worry about

[Damage]

The biggest issue with this player and airplanes is probably due to FM Transmitter. AS so long as you don't use that feature, then you should be OK in using the unit on board.

[JustAnUnCoolCat]

Preferably, and in practise, you should NEVER use unauthorised transmitters in an aircraft.

If i was to own a device with a VHF FM transmitter (it's not an FM transmitter, it's an FM mode VHF transmitter .. FM is a modulation method.. not a transmission band or frequency allocation), and was to use one on an aircraft...

Since i am a radio operator, i would respect the safety and EMC compliancy safeguards and not use the Tx equipped device on an aircraft unless i was 100% certain that the 'Tx off/disabled' mode (dunno how they refer to it on the equipment in the original post) literally did shut the TX off (aka no output, no ERP, literally switched off.. no output and hence no Tx emission creating an additional EM field beyond any basic fundemental one the player itself generates if any).

Regulations vary around the world, clearly, but regardless of regs (i always abide by legislative regs with Tx equipped devices whereever i am) - even if the regs allow for 'flight mode' use (that's where a Tx is permitted to be active in an ultra-low output mode.. we are talking an output in RF terms a bit like luminous paint is to visable light emmision) - i still think of others first and not use the TX.

Remember this...

When on board a ship or aircraft, ANY use of radio equipment is subject to the discretion of the master of the vessel (to use a maritime term) - aka the captain of the aircraft or captain/skipper of the martime vessel.

Technically, and this predates any legislative regs over radio equipment, to bring anything on board is permissable according to the skipper's discretion or tolerence.. as ultimately, they carry the blame and responsibility if anything goes wrong.

If they give permission for the use and passage of a piece of equipment that later proves to contribute to a contributory issue in the event of an accident.. guess who carries the can when the dung get slung..

Not you, not the airline/operators of the vessel, just the poor b*stard in charge aka the captain/skipper.

Sorry to get all detailed like that - but when you can see some insight into why the regs exist, you can start to appreciate any prohibitions or restrictions that may get put into place.

Dunno about anywhere else in the world, but after the Dunblaine incident and more recently 9/11, the restrictions and prohibtions that existed became a heck of a lot more enforced in the UK over boarding an aircraft with electronic kit.. especially those with Tx's on board/embedded.

However, to those of us who are radio ops and generally in the know, we tended to play safe... noone can take you to task legally where you acted with the interest of public safety by abiding to legislation and regs..

'Tom Kat'

[adrifted]

Thanks for this Tom Kat,

still it was not completely clear for me. What's Tx?

Let it be clear that the NWE-002 plays no radio. The stick with FM is NWE-002F.

I do not want to use the player on board, but I want to transport it from point A to point B. That is, I want to put the player into my pocket or bag while in plane and use it after I have landed abroad. It would be hard to believe that this can be prohibited. I wonder how did the items get into my country in the first place - in truck?

[JustAnUnCoolCat]

Tx = transmitter, TxCr = Transceiver (receiver and transmitter used in simplex config), TxRx = Transmitter/Receiver combination where the two exist as independent electronic entities and can be set and used independently, but can be slaved (if set up to do so) to keep both Tx and RX relatively or exactly tracking to a common frequency or band/freq split for duplex and cross band duplex operation.

Well, the basis of the prob comes down to...

1. If it's got a radio transmitter on board (aka the (as often mistermed) 'FM Transmitter', then it really should be used in transmitter disabled mode when on an aircraft (this equates to either a total shutdown of the Tx side) or where permitted.. use it's flight mode to enable Tx suppression/attentuation.

2. At the end of the day, regardless of law, if the airline operator sets out a no audio players etc policy for whatever reason, it's a no-win situation to argue freedom and law vs their policy - after all, when you fly with them... it's at their discretion all the way that you are permitted to fly with aircraft under their lease/ownership or charter.

There was never an issue about radio-equipped equipment being air-shipped commercially for distribution - after all, the equipment is not 'active' during shipping so technically if it's got an embedded TX.. it's either disabled when the equipment is in it's 'off' mode... or heavily supressed sufficiently that the field strength is probably not of any notable level much past a foot or two distance from the kit.

If the player in question has no Tx onboard, just a receiver, then there is legally (in most cases) no compliancy issues to worry about.

It then comes down to any regs in place over hand luggage and what you are permitted to carry on your person when on a commercial airliners (like over here, recently, when a high threat potential cropped up.. laptops and cellphones got banned for hand luggage and personal carried possession when flying).

And like i said before, there is the discretion factor with the airline operators too - after all, if they do ban (as policy) DAPs and suchlike personal entertainment kit..., it's probably in their interest to force you to use the in-flight entertainment they provide (and i often find that's a contradiction in terms, what they provide).

When i go abroad, i often take a handheld VHF radio transceiver as well as one of my DAP's and a digital recorder and a laptop - the laptop is 802.11x and BT equipped as is the digital recorder. The radio has a BT facility to allow wireless audio and remote vox operation link on it too.

As that all equates to a laptop bag sized bit of luggage (all fits into a substantial laptop bag with the associated chargers etc), i simply take out all battery packs and separate them into a sep bag (each individually wrapped and sealed and labelled for ID). This ensures that no piece of kit can come to lift or be triggered to an active state when it's in transit.

That works sufficiently for me, works well for hand luggage aspect storage too - subject to security and policy issues, but as has proven at times, i'm usually way ahead of the game in respect of security and policy restrictions.

The only time i'd want a DAP to listen to, in flight, would be a medium to long haul flight (six hours or more), otherwise.. i'm happy to take a good book with me

'Tom Kat'

[pata2001]

Thanks for this Tom Kat,

still it was not completely clear for me. What's Tx?

Let it be clear that the NWE-002 plays no radio. The stick with FM is NWE-002F.

I do not want to use the player on board, but I want to transport it from point A to point B. That is, I want to put the player into my pocket or bag while in plane and use it after I have landed abroad. It would be hard to believe that this can be prohibited. I wonder how did the items get into my country in the first place - in truck?

Stop worrying about it. Just put the player in your pocket, turn it off during landing/takeoff, use it however you like during flight.