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SonicStage 3.2, Initial Impressions

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Ishiyoshi

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Ishiyoshi Newbie

Ishiyoshi

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Download Sony's official Sonicstage v3.2 Installer (requires Internet to install and registration at the forums), at ATRACLife Downloads:

http://www.atraclife.com/downloads/details.php?file=2

First of all, thanks to alanisrox69 for the link. I never thought I would be testing SonicStage 3.2 this weekend since its official release date was set on July 27, 2005. Nonetheless, here's my brief evaluation:

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The most pleasant change or improvement to version 3.2 is stability and speed. The interface itself remains unchanged but one will feel that it's somewhat smoother than version 3.1. However, I won't say it's less bloated so to speak. Its memory usage hovers around 6,500 K to 7,000 K with initial startup; and it will increase to about 10,000 K during conversion of CD --> ATRAC3plus.

Are you guys ready for the next addition? We will never see ATRAC3plus the same again as a format that only offer three bitrates: 256kbps, 64kbps and 48kbps. SonicStage 3.2 expands its band to 320kbps! Right now, we can convert CDs into ATRAC3plus in the following bitrates: 320kbps, 256kbps, 192kbps, 160kbps, 128kbps, 96kbps, 64kbps and 48kbps. (* in reference to conversion speed, converting a track (WAV format) of 4:10 min to ATRAC3plus 320kbps takes about 9 secs.) However, the new bitrates cannot be used with current HiMD, HDD and Flash based device. However, all of these bitrates work for the PSP.

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Another notable mention is the removal of DRM restriction on .oma files. However, I have yet to test if this is true.

Overall, the new version is indeed a welcome improvement.

SonicStage 3.2 Module Version

SonicStage : 3.2.00.06071

SonicStage Add-on for Personal Audio Upgrade : 3.2.00.06030

OpenMG Secure Module : 4.2.00.06070

MagicGate Memory Stick Device : 4.2.00.06070

NW-E2, NW-E3, NW-E5 and NW-E8P : 4.2.00.06070

OpenMG CD : 4.2.00.06070

M.S. PRO : 4.2.00.06070

CD Walkman : 4.2.00.06070

Hi-MD : 4.2.00.06070

Music Clip, NW-S4, NW-E7 and NW-E10 : 4.2.00.06070

HDWM : 4.2.00.06070

Net MD : 4.2.00.06070

EMD Plug-in : 1.2.0.9

CD-R 書き込みモジュール(Audio CD/ATRAC CD/MP3 CD) : 3.2.00.06030

Px Engine : 2.0.60.500

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Christopher Grand Master

Christopher

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I have a feeling the PSP will be the first to have the ability to play back these new bitrates - simply because the new firmware v2.0 specifically mentions the necessity of Sonicstage 2.3 to load ATRAC3/plus for most of the memory sticks. I imagine Sony's other ATRAC devices (except Hi-MD) should get some sort of firmware upgrade to facilitate these new offerings.

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Max Spider X Newbie

Max Spider X

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In Ver 3.1, when I click to import folders, I wasn't given the option to import any folder of my choosing. Instead, it had to scan my whole drive and auto sorted the files according to their unorganized ID3 tags. I was wondering if 3.2 will allow me to import individual folders like the old ver 2.3?

BTW Ishi, is that Mac or Windows with the Apple theme? If it's the latter, what theme program you use?

Edited by Max Spider X
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Ishiyoshi Newbie

Ishiyoshi

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In Ver 3.1, when I click to import folders, I wasn't given the option to import any folder of my choosing. Instead, it had to scan my whole drive and auto sorted the files according to their unorganized ID3 tags. I was wondering if 3.2 will allow me to import individual folders like the old ver 2.3?

BTW Ishi, is that Mac or Windows with the Apple theme? If it's the latter, what theme program you use?

You can definitely import a specific folder or a file individually with SonicStage 3.1. This is applies to SonicStage 3.2 as well.

I employ StyleXP with Panther theme, MilkToolbar, Yz' Dock and Konfabulator.

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D-EJ915 Newbie

D-EJ915

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DUDE!! THAT ROCKS!!!!

I so want 320 on the HD3 although not likely to happen :(...

Yeah, Max X, you can't import whole folders at once, but you can "import files" and select all the stuff in a folder...that's what I do...or you could set the scan thing to search a specific folder but that's pointless.

Anyway, lol, 10k of memory isn't bad...I mean with good computers these days having like 300 free at any given time, haha

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auvi_joe Newbie

auvi_joe

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Additional resolutions to ATRAC3 devices will be the most welcome news for current and future ATRAC3 device owners/users. I hope Sony will give us a treat by releasing the appropriate firmware updates about the same time they send out the NorthAmerican version of SS3.2, for Hi-MD as well as HD/flash players.

I can imagine the power and impact of being able to record in high quality 320Kbps on Hi-MD portable recorders, instead of just 256kbps and PCM(?) at the present time.

Relaxing DRM restrictions is also a very welcomed news.

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pete_w Newbie

pete_w

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Well i now have a 192 option on my HD3 :ol_biggrin: - works nicely.

Didn't have any initialisation problems after the SS upgrade either luckily (although i have in the past with other SS upgrades) :ol_biggrin:

Sadly no extra bitrates available on my NH600 Hi-MD :ol_sad:

Edited by pete_w
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Damage Newbie

Damage

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Nuts, none of the extra ATRAC3plus bitrates are availble for non-HD/Flash devices. This includes burning to ATRAC CD Players. History would suggest, however, that the Atrac CD players are probably capable of playing all of the new bitrates (I'm going by, of course, D-NE series. The first generation D-NEs were able to play the HiSP tracks before the HiMDs were out, and there by giving a sneak peak at HiSP, so to speak).

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Beethovenian Newbie

Beethovenian

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Very nice to see this new forum. And even nicer to see that Sony seems to be doing the right thing to keep Atrac as an alternative. If the removal of DRM restrictions is confirmed, that's great news. I like the format, but I hate how you can lose all your files if your computer crashes and you hadn't backed up using the awful SonicStage backup utility. If it wants to protect against piracy, I think Sony should, instead of DRM'ing each file, encrypt the folder in the player where it puts the files. And I'm eager to see the new bitrates.

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maxthrusters Newbie

maxthrusters

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Hello, my first post!

Using SonicStage 3.2 I was able to import MP3 files at 192kbs, convert to the new 128kbs ATRAC3plus format (with no DRM), and transfer to my Sony NW-MS70D flash player. The songs play and sound great in headphones and from personal speakers, much better than ATRAC3plus 64kbs.

On another note, I was sad to see that SonicStage 3.2 still does not transfer ATRAC3 to Memory Stick Pro, for use in Clié PDA. I guess the upgrade only applies to Memory Stick Duo Pro, or was just for PSP and not Clié. Given that Sony stopped making Clié I suppose this is not much of a surprise.

Edited by maxthrusters
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Ishiyoshi Newbie

Ishiyoshi

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Hello, my first post!

Using SonicStage 3.2 I was able to import MP3 files at 192kbs, convert to the new 128kbs ATRAC3plus format (with no DRM), and transfer to my Sony NW-MS70D flash player. The songs play and sound great in headphones and from personal speakers, much better than ATRAC3plus 64kbs.

On another note, I was sad to see that SonicStage 3.2 still does not transfer ATRAC3 to Memory Stick Pro, for use in Clié PDA. I guess the upgrade only applies to Memory Stick Duo Pro, or was just for PSP and not Clié. Given that Sony stopped making Clié I suppose this is not much of a surprise.

Welcome to ALC, Max!

So, you can confirm that you can utilize ATRAC3plus 128kbps with the NW-MS70D? This is great; I will need to check it this with the MS90D. If there's not too much trouble, can you verify if you’re able to transfer the existing non-DRM ATRAC3plus file from your MS70D to another computer with SonicStage 3.2? Thanks.

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maxthrusters Newbie

maxthrusters

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Welcome to ALC, Max!

So, you can confirm that you can utilize ATRAC3plus 128kbps with the NW-MS70D? This is great; I will need to check it this with the MS90D. If there's not too much trouble, can you verify if you’re able to transfer the existing non-DRM ATRAC3plus file from your MS70D to another computer with SonicStage 3.2? Thanks.

Hi, and thanks! Unfortunately I have only one computer and SonicStage...and no one I know uses SonicStage. Everyone around here seems to be an I-POD fan heh.

I'm using DRM-less ATRAC3/ATRAC3plus now because awhile back I had to format my system drive and of course that meant the .oma files were encrypted to my old installation of Windows. Now that SS3.2 allows for non-DRM CD rips and file conversions I might trust it enough to rip any new CDs I might get.

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Ishiyoshi Newbie

Ishiyoshi

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Hi, and thanks! Unfortunately I have only one computer and SonicStage...and no one I know uses SonicStage. Everyone around here seems to be an I-POD fan heh.

I'm using DRM-less ATRAC3/ATRAC3plus now because awhile back I had to format my system drive and of course that meant the .oma files were encrypted to my old installation of Windows. Now that SS3.2 allows for non-DRM CD rips and file conversions I might trust it enough to rip any new CDs I might get.

Thanks Max. My current ATRAC3plus library has DRM restriction. I definitely need to conduct tests with non-DRM ATRAC3plus to determine if one can transfer the existing non-DRM ATRAC3plus file from the ATRAC device - especially the VAIO Pocket and MS90D - to another computer with SonicStage 3.2.

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Giant Rabbit Newbie

Giant Rabbit

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Hello. Sonicstage 3.2 looks like a decent improvement. I was wondering if any of you could confirm for me whether or not I would be able to use the new atrac plus bitrates with my new NW-HD5 which will be sent to me soon. Will I need new firmware to use them? thank you very much. :)

The reason I ask is that I am preparing to rip all my CDs and need to make up my mind as to what bitrates I should use.

Edited by Giant Rabbit
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Ishiyoshi Newbie

Ishiyoshi

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Hello.  Sonicstage 3.2 looks like a decent improvement. I was wondering if any of you could confirm for me whether or not I would be able to use the new atrac plus bitrates with my new NW-HD5 which will be sent to me soon.  Will I need new firmware to use them? thank you very much. :)

The reason I ask is that I am preparing to rip all my CDs and need to make up my mind as to what bitrates I should use.

Welcome to ALC, Rabbit.

Among the new ATRAC3plus bit rates, you can only utilize the 192kbps with the NW-HD5. It is plausible to state that a new firmware is required for the HD5 to utilize all the new ATRAC3plus bit rates. Hopefully, Sony will provide us with the necessary firmwares.

If you have the PSP, you can use any of the newly available bit rates.

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Damage Newbie

Damage

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On another note, I was sad to see that SonicStage 3.2 still does not transfer ATRAC3 to Memory Stick Pro, for use in Clié PDA. I guess the upgrade only applies to Memory Stick Duo Pro, or was just for PSP and not Clié. Given that Sony stopped making Clié I suppose this is not much of a surprise.

Depends on your model and such, but I know my Clie (NR-70U, before MSPro) doesn't play back ATRAC3plus files (though it can handle ATRAC3 and MP3 files). Considering that most Clies were made before ATRAC3plus bitrates were introduced, I'd say the chances of your Clie playing back ATRAC3plus files are slim to none.

And yes, all Connect tracks are 132kbps ATRAC3. That's just the way they were encoded for distribution in the first place, so it'd be more of a "Connect Issue" than a SonicStage issue...

More like Sony/BMG, Time Warner Music, EMI, and all other music label issue, but that's beyond the scope of this forum.

Edited by Damage
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Giant Rabbit Newbie

Giant Rabbit

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Welcome to ALC, Rabbit.

Among the new ATRAC3plus bit rates, you can only utilize the 192kbps with the NW-HD5. It is plausible to state that a new firmware is required for the HD5 to utilize all the new ATRAC3plus bit rates. Hopefully, Sony will provide us with the necessary firmwares.

If you have the PSP, you can use any of the newly available bit rates.

Thanks for the welcome!

Unfortunately I do not have a PSP and to be honest I'm unlikely to ever have one since repetitive strain injury has put an end to my gaming. I think 192 atrac plus will do me just fine for my very best albums such as Dark Side of the Moon and OK Computer. I'm considering LP2 or 64 bit atrac plus for the majority of my music in order to save some space and principally to increase the battery life of the unit although I am unsure as to how much the bitrates influence battery life.

I suspect that each of these bitrates beats 128kbps MP3 even though Sonicstage now does allow you to rip directly into MP3.

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Ishiyoshi Newbie

Ishiyoshi

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Thanks for the welcome!

Unfortunately I do not have a PSP and to be honest I'm unlikely to ever have one since repetitive strain injury has put an end to my gaming. I think 192 atrac plus will do me just fine for my very best albums such as Dark Side of the Moon and OK Computer.  I'm considering LP2 or 64 bit atrac plus for the majority of my music in order to save some space and principally to increase the battery life of the unit although I am unsure as to how much the bitrates influence battery life.

I suspect that each of these bitrates beats 128kbps MP3 even though Sonicstage now does allow you to rip directly into MP3.

If you are interested, I've included a frequency analysis between ATRAC3plus 192kbps and Mp3 192kbps CBR in this thread. However, please note that the result is by no means a conclusion to sound quality.

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Giant Rabbit Newbie

Giant Rabbit

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If you are interested, I've included a frequency analysis between ATRAC3plus 192kbps and Mp3 192kbps CBR in this thread. However, please note that the result is by no means a conclusion to sound quality.

Thanks for the link. However, from there I did find a link to a thread on hydrogen audio which slaughtered atrac. I am beginning to think that the subjective approach might prove more fruitful than the admirably complex objective analyses that you and others have provided. You have to take into account that my £17 earphones will probably not register the comparatively small differences in quality. I think I will now consider the Panasonic HJE50 or the Sony E71 canalphones or difficult to come by E888 phones that I came across on eBay a while back. When I finish my degree and start working, then I will buy me some £100 beauties but for now I am stuck at the budget section :ol_biggrin:

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Leon Newbie

Leon

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Unforutnately the PSP appears to be the only thing through which SS 3.2 supports MSProDuo. Saw a note on one of the news sites, saying that the update doesn't apply to SE's ATRAC-playing phones. Sigh :P

And nothing wrong with inexpensive product sectors... we can all be "cheap chic" :D This is not a sarcastic remark :D

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maxthrusters Newbie

maxthrusters

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Depends on your model and such, but I know my Clie (NR-70U, before MSPro) doesn't play back ATRAC3plus files (though it can handle ATRAC3 and MP3 files).  Considering that most Clies were made before ATRAC3plus bitrates were introduced, I'd say the chances of your Clie playing back ATRAC3plus files are slim to none.

I already use MP3 for my Clié UX50 (supports Memory Stick Pro up to 2GB) so not being able to transfer ATRAC3 isn't a huge issue. You are right that my PDA does not support ATRAC3plus, but then I never expected that much of an improvement from a SonicStage upgrade.

What I had hoped for from the new SS version was the ability to transfer ATRAC3 (LP2) to Memory Stick Pro (1GB). Prior to SS 3.2 this was only possible with MagicGate Memory Sticks with a capacity up to 128mb, and that seems to be unchanged. I don't like swapping sticks so I just put MP3 files onto my 1GB stick with windows explorer. SonicStage does not even recognize the 1GB stick as usable media.

Maybe Sony would consider enabling ATRAC3 to all varieties of Memory Stick someday. Since we can rip CDs and convert music files to .oma with no DRM now it would follow that non-DRM music should be transferable to non-DRM sticks. I'm not holding my breath since such a change would mostly be of benefit to users of older Sony toys.

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Ryzir Newbie

Ryzir

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You cannot transfer songs bought at Connect with 3.2.

I don't really use it but my brother just bought an hd3 and I had him install 3.2 and he had his 50 free songs and wasn't able to transfer the tracks so I tried some songs and wasn't able to either.

It seems that you cannot "authorize" your device in 3.2 stopping you from being able to transfer Connect songs.

Anyone else try this?

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pata2001 Newbie

pata2001

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Quick question: Earlier US version of SS3.x has problems with kanji display, it can't, even with registry edits. One can use MS Applocale, but it only works with winXP, not win2k, etc. Has this been "fixed"? 1 thing that keeps me from upgrading (in fact, I downgraded form 3.1 to 2.3 when I found out all my Kanji titled songs become ????) is this issue.

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pata2001 Newbie

pata2001

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OK, I installed 3.2 US version. As I feared, kanji display is not supported on its own, even changing windows non-unicode program setting doesn't help. I have change back to English(US) locale, and use MS applocale, then kanji is displayed fine. Weird. Sony just cannot do this part right huh. I guess I have to stick with 2.3 for my win2k machine.

Interesting is, when I connected my E99, look at the transfer setting screen:

ss32e996az.jpg

I have not tried transferring yet, so I don't know if the E99 actually support all the new bitrates. But it would be SWEET if it does! :)

Edited by pata2001
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pata2001 Newbie

pata2001

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Ripped a track to 320kbps and 96kbps Atrac3+. SS3.2 transfers them to the E99 without any transcoding. :) Yup, the E99 plays both just fine. Presumably it can play all the bitrates then. Nice!

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shirleywhite_ Newbie

shirleywhite_

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Hi all. Am slightly embarassed to admit that i've only just found this forum. Having used Minidisc and AV forums quite a lot I'm not sure how/why I missed "Atrac"!!?? Anyway - a quick couple of thoughts re SS 3.2 - I installed on a "spare" computer (my main machine got SS3.1 on it ) - ripped some cds at 320 kbps and transferred to hd5. SS3.2 reported "cant transfer because tracks from another computer on device" Said I had to delete all tracks first. ( Though I believe that "authorising" - which i'd never bothered with - is a way to be able to use muliple computers?!) Rather interestingly though - I clicked transfer - SS transferred but converted to 192 on the hd5. ( with tracks in library still at 320 ) The tracks wouldnt play on the hd5 though. Rather like an earlier poster I'm thinking of starting afresh with a clean version of SS3.2 and a fresh hd5 - but need to decide what bitrate to use. ( I'd already done a firmware update to 1.2 on the hd5 - I'm not 100% sure if a further update is needed for all the newatrac plus bitrates?!)

My second thought/point was re the flash based 70D which I occasionally use. I believe biggest card it can use is 128mg memstick duo. Wondered if with SS3.2 etc and/or firmware update there's any chance of bigger sizes? ( Like an earlier poster too I still use a Clie ( N760) as a pda - no chance there I guess of more bitrates I suppose!! )

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maxthrusters Newbie

maxthrusters

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Shirley:

My MS-70D does NOT play back Memory Stick Pro Duo 1GB, so don't spend money on one to try. It would seem that the 128MB ones are the best we can use.

SonicStage 3.2 WILL transfer (and at all of the new bitrates too), but once on there the MS-70D indicates it has an invalid memory stick inserted. I would think this means that if Sony did put out a firmware upgrade it could work, but I don't expect that will happen given our lovely titanium players are from 2003 and therefore "old" heh

Edited by maxthrusters
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