What mic will best suit my needs?

[Shermy]

Hi All,

This forum has been VERY helpful already, but I still have a few questions.

First of all, I'm planning on purchasing a Sony MZ-NH900 and a microphone to record various things listed below.

I'm a trumpet player that plays a few dozen gigs a year. I would like to be able to record my personal practice sessions, my rehearsals with the various jazz bands, and also the performances.

I noticed throughout this forum, there is a tendency to promote the "stealth" type mics offered by SoundProfessionals, ReactiveSounds, and the like over what I'll call "traditional" mics like Sennheiser, Shure, Audio Technica, etc. I am not concerned with being stealthy, at least not at the moment. What I would like to know is what the pros and cons of each (stealthy/traditional) might be in consideration of my particular needs.

What I am currently looking at are the following:

Audio Technica ATR25, Pro 24, or AT822

SoundProfessionals SP-PSM-3

Auris Stereo Microphone

I have noticed that the last three have much wider frequency responses 20 or 30-20,000 HZ as opposed to 70 or 100-17,000 or 18,000 HZ for the first two. Is this going to be noticeable?

My budget is up to $150 for the microphone. So if there are others out there that I am currently unaware of, please let me know.

[Shermy]

OK, since I haven't had any replies, let me narrow down my question a bit.

Is there a discernable difference between the AT822 and the Auris Stereo Microphone or Sound Professionals SP-PSM-3 when recording mainly what I'll be recording?

How about the same question for the SP-PSM-3 compared to the Auris Stereo Microphone?

Also, is there a difference between the SP-PSM-3 and SP-ECM-MS907? On the Sound Professionals website, the specs look pretty much the same. Was this perhaps an advertising "gimmic" to try to get people who are searching the web for the Sony MS907 to take a look at their product?

So far, from what I've read, and with the budget I have in mind, I'm leaning toward the Sound Professional model. Please let me know if there is a better mic out there (regardless of size) for the price. Also, if the AT822 is worth the difference in price let me know that too.

[A440]

Wish I could help you more, but I only use stealth mics because I'm taking them to live shows. I'd expect bigger studio mics to be better--that's what the supergeek tapers at Phish shows used--and I hope one of the recording-studio experts like Dex Otaku will chime in.

But if they don't, here are a few general observations.

The AT822 is a cardioid (directional) microphone--it records what's in front of it (in a heart-shaped, as in cardiac, pattern with the microphone at the point). You'd be paying more for that feature.

The SoundPro is omni--it hears like your ears, all around it. If you don't need to exclude sounds, like a noisy audience behind you, then the omni will sound richer. Sound Pro's site has sample recordings with cardioid and omni, and you can hear the difference--to me, it sounds like the room has been flattened slightly behind you with the cardioids.

You do want those last few cycles of bass response if you're recording a jazz combo. The bottom note on a piano is 27.5 Hz, and every doubling of frequency is an octave: the next A up is 55, so a mic that tapers off below 70 will lose some of your bass and bass drum.

[Shermy]

Thanks for the reply A440. That info helps. I'll check out the recording samplings to see the difference between the cardioid and omnidirectional mics.

I'll look forward to hearing someone like Dex Otaku chime in.

[Shermy]

I've done some more research over the weekend on this forum and have decided to go with the Reactive AM-2 Dual Point Stereo Microphone. I'm assuming this mic will work fine with the pre-amp included on the NH900. However, would I be better off also getting a battery box and going line in for the type of recording I'll be doing? Some of it can be quite loud.

Thanks!!

Also, when I get my equipment, I'll post how they work for me.

[Christopher]

I'll look forward to hearing someone like Dex Otaku chime in.

There's some personal issues revolving around him at the moment and he may be MIA for a while, which is really unfortunate as he's a great guy and a true asset to this community.

[Shermy]

I'm sorry to hear that!!

Hope everything works out for you Dex Otaku!!

[A440]

That mic should work fine through the mic-in (or Minidisco probably wouldn't be selling it). It's good that you're getting two mics you can separate rather than a one-point stereo mic--you'll get a warmer sound even if what you're recording is essentially mono. Spread them at least six inches apart, like your ears.

For starters, just try it directly into mic-in with Low Sensitivity (via Record Mode settings) and see how your music comes out. Use Manual rather than AGC (also via Record Mode), set somewhere between 12/30 and 15/30 for starters, so that you don't get the changes in volume from the autogain. If you're satisfied with that--and you might well be--then you're set. If not, then you can escalate to a battery box or pre-amp via line-in.

And more best wishes to Dex.

[mgdimo]

Hey Shermy,

Sounds like I'm only a couple of months ahead of you. I am no expert, but I've been experimenting with my equipment since Sept or so. I also play jazz (drums) and that figured into the equipment I purchased.

I got the Auris st. mics and with the nh900 and have been very impressed. Someone here suggested this to me. Google: jecklin disc. It's pretty damn cool if you're looking for authentic stereo separation. I suppose if you place your mics six inches apart, like A440 suggests, this jecklin disc acts as a baffle, as your head would. Pretty cool! I've yet to construct a makeshift one.

Also, it seems to me that the surefire (yet expensive) method of recording live (potentially loud) music is to go with the battery box. Mind you, I don't have one yet and I'm still happy. But I know it can be better, if not even pristine.

The suggestions given to me in this thread may be helpful to you if you haven't already read them:

http://forums.minidisc.org/viewtopic.php?t=5908

Read past the crickets! :smile:

Be sure and post your findings.

Best to Dex Otaku, however he needs it.

GREG

[Shermy]

Hey Mgdimo,

I've been following your posts since our situations seem so similar. Your choice was mostly why I went the way I did. However, I ended up going with the following since the price was only about $30.00 difference for close to the same mic specs including a battery box with bass roll-off.

MM-COMBO-2 Combination Madness Pak (Module & Mics 20-20,000 Hz.)

Sorry Reactive

I've also looked at that jecklin disk.

How do you currently mount your mics during your practice sessions/rehearsals/performances (without the jecklin disc)? This is something that's been bugging me. With the equipment being so suited for stealth, it doesn't seem very conducive to non-stealth recording situations. I've been contemplating attaching a doll rod, metal rod, or microphone gooseneck to a regular mic stand and connecting the mics via the clips to the ends of the rod/gooseneck. Kind of like the SP-TFB-ISI

design offered by Sound Pros. With a gooseneck, it might work well with a jecklin disk.

[Shermy]

Oh, one other reason I went with the MM-COMBO-2 was because the mics were cardioid. Most of my gigs are in a coffeehouse setting where the patrons tend to chatter a lot throughout the performance.

[mgdimo]

I carry my little rig in a small bag/case with a shoulder strap that's actually made to hold a CD player and a few CDs. I hang the bag over the top of a cymbal stand or a mic stand and clip the mics right to the strap. That gets them about 6 inches apart....No jecklin disc yet. Let us know if your idea works.

Also, please report on your battery box v. no bat box results. Are you familiar with the Radio Shack volume attenuator that A440 speaks highly of? It might work well for you in your jazz setting.

GREG

[Shermy]

Hey Greg and A440,

I'm kind of apprehensive about getting the volume attenuator because I have a pair of Sony studio headphones (kinda cheap - around $40.00) that has a volume dial much like the attenuator and a mono/stereo switch. The sound would break up like there was a bad connection or something when I turned the dial, so I cut the wires to the little "box" the dial and switch were housed in and reattached the wires. Of course it lost that functionality, but at least I have halfway decent functioning stereo headphones.

I guess if the price is right ($6.59), and this problem does happen, I could always buy another attenuator! :smile:

Still I would like to know if you, or anyone for that matter, have had any problems with your volume attenuator.

Still anxiously waiting for my NH900 and mics!!!!

[Shermy]

Hi All,

I received my NH900 and MM-COMBO-2 on Friday.

I first did a real quick plug-n-play (really a "plug-n-record") of me practicing my trumpet. This will probably be what I use this unit for the most. I popped in a regular MD. I didn't make any changes to any settings. I simply plugged the battery box into the line-in and the microphones into the battery box. The microphones were clipped onto each end of a 2' length of a 1" wide strip of metal secured to the top of a mic stand extended to about 6' high at one end of the room.

I sat at the other end of the room and began to play for about a minute. I checked the recording. The playback volume was a bit low. I changed to manual and bumped the recording level to 30/30 and tried again. Bingo! I can even hear my valves banging down. I can also hear a lot of stuff that I do that can use some woodshedding...the main reason for my purchase!! The quality was set at Hi-SP by default, and I am pleased with the quality. I tried to see if I could distort the sound by playing as loud as I normally would in a playing situation. The set-up passed the test. I then played as loud as I could...there we go, a bit of clipping.

As a live recorder, I am VERY pleased. Prior to this set up, I used a Marantz PMD221 with an Electro-Voice PL95 mic. First of all, I don't have to have my instrument pointed directly at the microphone and within a couple of feet of it. The HiMD set up blows it away as far as quality of sound (relatively no hiss and no detectible system noise). These sounds were always detectible on the Marantz recordings. Portability...it fits in my pocket! Playback...you can speed up from 0% to 100% of recorded speed and slow down from 0% to -50% of recorded speed! The Marantz had two speeds only and nothing in between, and the pitch went down or up an octave. This feature is Very useful when transcribing music. Also, going back and forth through a particular musical passage on the tape was very abusive to the tape. I had quite a few tapes meet their last living days going through this process.

Next I tried to upload some of my favorite MusicMatch downloaded files to a HiMD. This is where I got ticked off. I got all the files into SonicStage ready to upload into the MD. Hit the transfer button, it went through some processing and then the following window popped up "There is invalid rights management in the OpenMG content". WHAT!!!!! Is this because the files don't have OpenMG management on them? Is it because they are WMA files? If this is the case, how do I transfer them to a "valid" format?

Luckily, this isn't the main reason I bought this system. If it were, I'd have it listed on E-bay already.

Overall, I'm very pleased. :smile: :smile: I'm sure there's a workaround for those MusicMatch files. Can't wait to test it in a live performance.

Also, I need to get some kind of case to carry all this equipment. I'm looking at 8 seperate pieces not including the mic stand.

[A440]

The only problem with the Radio Shack gizmo is that they do tend to wear out and get staticky like your Sony control. It's always a good idea to test it before some crucial recording.

Shermy, if you've got the battery box you don't need the attenuator.

I'm not familiar with MusicMatch, but .wma files are generally a pain since they have their own digital rights annoyances built in.

The free dbpoweramp should be able to convert them into mp3s, which might be easier to transfer. Try one or two and see how they work.

http://www.dbpoweramp.com/dmc.htm

[Shermy]

A440,

Thanks for the info on the volume attenuator!

Also, thanks for the info on WMA files. I posted the same question on another thread as well. I found a workaround that takes a bit more time. I just pop in the CDs I burned from the MusicMatch downloads and rip them to the NH900 via MD Simple Burner. I had to add the track information after they were ripped however. Is there a way to avoid having to do this? Does it have something to do with CDDB? This part took longer than the actual upload onto the NH900.

Kudos to you and all the other staff on hosting such an informative forum!!! I can't fathom what it would be like trying to figure this stuff out with just an owners manual! Especially a Sony owners manual!!!

[obsideo]

I 2nd the dbpoweramp solution - It'll convert between just about any useful format for audio mp3, wav, flac, ogg vorbis, etc etc. Indespensible!