Should I stay with minidisc or move to a HDD DAP?

[lamewing]

Guys and gals,

I have been using minidisc, on and off, since my first Sony MZ-R70. That was followed by a slew of MD units; R900, R909, R910, Sharp DR7, N1, S1, N910 and N920, NH600, NH900, NH1, and EH1. Each one pretty much repleaced the next model, so until now, I have never had more than two MD units at any one time. Last September I sold my last MD unit, the Sharp DR7. I guess I kept it for nostalgia more than anything.

After selling it I tried a used 2nd gen iPod, which I quickly sold off. After the iPod came the Sony HD1, which I also returned due to construction issues (and price at the time). The next DAP I played with was the Pocket Vaio; but I didn't like being tied to a heavy dock for transfers and charging. It was a BEAUTIFUL player. I wish Sony would have refined it versus just dropping the device. "sigh" Finally, I bought a Cowon X5L, and it seems to be very well built, has tons of features, and is straight drag-and-drop. It can play mp3, flac, ogg, plus video (anime works very well - short episodes and anime isn't affected by the 15fps).

I thought I was done with MD, but I finally tried the NH1 and was really impressed by the build quality. I ended up returning this to the seller on ebay since it had a horrible smoke smell, plus it had "Sun Microsystems" silkscreen on the front. I definately didn't want that on my recorder! Still it was a fine player. So...in the last month I have picked up a few new HiMD units...2 x NH900 and an EH1 HiMD player.

Now I am on the fence. Why, I just cannot justify spendiing $350.00 on the DAP and about $675.00 on the three MD units. To be truthful, the only thing I record is lectures and internet radio. My X5L has line in and a built in mic, which both work okay (not as well as HiMD), but then again, I am not a professional so it really doesn't matter that much.

What to do? What to do? The smart thing would be to sell off the two NH900s and the NEW EH1 and just use the X5L. All of my music is from CD, so if the X5L's HDD goes south, no biggie. I keep the music on two different HD and on DVD as well. Is there REALLY any reason to keep with HiMD (not trying to be over emotional now - compared to after the Sony webconference a few weeks ago) for my uses?

The nostalgia of MD is nice.

The use of MD keeps me from being a Pod person.

The MD has a very (imagined?) "Japanesy" feel to it.

The Cowon is WELL built

The Cowon uses USB 2.0

The Cowon has true drag-and-drop

The Cowon is one device and I am not tied to any particular software or DRM strategy.

Oh, I listne to Korean, Japanese, English and Chinese music. EASY titling of my music is wanted. It is very easy with the Cowon and a pain with SS 3.2. Plus, I cannot do Korean at all and limited Chinese on the HiMD.

What do you folks think? I realize it sounds as if I have already talked myself out of it, but I value the opionions of the MD users here.

Anyone need NH900s or a new EH1???

Joe Edwards

Edited October 19, 2005 by lamewing

[Alien_Poop]

That X5L looks pretty sweet, and I was considering one for myself as I've been archiving a bunch of albums in the flac format. Can that thing record in .wav through the line in, or does it just encode to mp3 right on the player? I can't seem to find to much about the recording functions of the cowon unit.

As for your dilema, I dunno, keep the X5L for listening and maybe keep one of the Hi-MD units for recording. Never know when you may need something of a higher quality than the X5L may be able to provide. That was kind of my plan if I could just manage to save enough money.

Anyway, good luck, and take care

[smilesalot2u]

No you shouldn't keep the minidisc's you should sell them to me for 10US$ each ,

I guess you have to determine is the minidisc a want or need. I would also look at depretiation value and MTBF of each product. I agree with lamewing not only look at the specs but actual handeling. I also ask how many moving parts does it have and what will go wrong first, besides asking how much power does it consume and how easy is it to find. I use my HI-MD for storage purposes, they definately beat DVD-R and CDR's because they dont get scratched, I have an image of win 98 , xp pro and a couple boot images that I have used in a cinch.

Again its all up to you, another choice is the 6 month rule if you dont use it in 6 months get rid of it.

smilesalot

[lamewing]

That X5L looks pretty sweet, and I was considering one for myself as I've been archiving a bunch of albums in the flac format. Can that thing record in .wav through the line in, or does it just encode to mp3 right on the player? I can't seem to find to much about the recording functions of the cowon unit.

As for your dilema, I dunno, keep the X5L for listening and maybe keep one of the Hi-MD units for recording. Never know when you may need something of a higher quality than the X5L may be able to provide. That was kind of my plan if I could just manage to save enough money.

Anyway, good luck, and take care

Unfortunetly, tuition is coming up for hte spring and I really only should keep one of them. To answer your question, the X5L only records to .mp3. This seems odd since it would take more processing power to do this, and it isn't like there isn't a lot of HDD space.

No you shouldn't keep the minidisc's you should sell them to me for 10US$ each ,

I guess you have to determine is the minidisc a want or need. I would also look at depretiation value and MTBF of each product. I agree with lamewing not only look at the specs but actual handeling. I also ask how many moving parts does it have and what will go wrong first, besides asking how much power does it consume and how easy is it to find. I use my HI-MD for storage purposes, they definately beat DVD-R and CDR's because they dont get scratched, I have an image of win 98 , xp pro and a couple boot images that I have used in a cinch.

Again its all up to you, another choice is the 6 month rule if you dont use it in 6 months get rid of it.

smilesalot

The storage idea is nice. Too bad there isn't more room on the discs. You sound like me, trying to determine every little detail regarding the units. "Which goes first, the HDD or the optical block....etc, etc". I also am a BIG fan of the six month rule and it drives my wife insane, epecially since her parents are packrats. She definately picked up that genetic trait from them!!!

More decisions to make. OH, I have 10 minidiscs that I will sell ya for $10 each...and a bridge in Arizona too...

Edited October 19, 2005 by lamewing

[1kyle]

Problem with HDD devices (and non removable memory card devices).

1) If (and when it gets full) it's a pain to re-organise music, decide what to delete etc etc.

2) If it gets broken -- you have to re-create all your music library.

3) If it gets lost or stolen -- as 2) above.

4) You buy a new device --as 2) above

5) When listening on the move you might want to play say 60 mins of something and then play something entirely different. Organising play lists is a bit of a pain unless you want to listen to the same stuff over and over again.

With MD's you can use standard disks (approx 2 Hours per disk) or a longer HI-MD disk (at 256Kbs that's approx 7 - 8 hours -- roughly 7 CD's.

If you get a new device --no probs --just pop in a disk.

On the move grab say 2 disks -- you've got a decent play list that's easily changed (put a new disk in).

There aren't too many DRM issues now with SS 3.2.

MD can RECORD as well and you can still organise all your music needs without being tied to a computer.

MD can record in .wav (PCM lossless) .

I don't care about MP3's but the later MD units can play these (although I don't beleieve you can record direct in that format -- and why would you want to anyway).

(BTW for those advocating using removeable memory card devices -- even a 2gb card costs many times more than standard MD disks).

If you have shelf units or systems you can play your MD in that as well --you don't need the device plugged in to AUX or wherever.

HDD devices look nice etc --but they are a bit too inflexible for me --I'm sticking to MD's for the forseeable future.

Cheers

-K

[Sparky191]

Problem with HDD devices (and non removable memory card devices).

1) If (and when it gets full) it's a pain to re-organise music, decide what to delete etc etc.

2) If it gets broken -- you have to re-create all your music library.

5) When listening on the move you might want to play say 60 mins of something and then play something entirely different. Organising play lists is a bit of a pain unless you want to listen to the same stuff over and over again.

-K

Since everything is backed up on a HD (since theres where it has come from originally) your points 2,3,4 are null and void. If your PC is backed up (as it should be) then you have a backup of your backup.

1 & 5 also exist on any device with a finite limit of capacity. In theory you can buy as many MD as you want but in reality theres a finite limit to the number disks you actually own. So this applies to all players. If you think disk swapping with more disk is easier to manage then less disk, that would suggest that MD is superior to HiMD. I think its hard to claim that MD is easier to manage and use than HiMD.

Personally I like MD/HiMD and see it as complementary to the MP3 players I already own. For me though the AA powered units are the really useful MD units. As you don't need a AC or USB charger and once you have a few disks, the unit is really self contained, doesn't need charging, or a computer to record or playback. Which if you are moving around a lot, like in college, holidays or travelling for work is very convient.

Quite often when I'm rushing somewhere, the MP3 player isn't charged, or doesn't have music on it I like. So I can grab my HiMD, and a couple of disk. Pick up AA's on the way and I have music, or can record immediately. I also like the tactile feel of real buttons. Many MP3's players are not tactile to use in your pocket. But if you are near AC all day, and have access to a PC all day (I work in IT) really a MP3 player can be a lot more useful most of the time. For the other time you have MD/HiMD

[lamewing]

Problem with HDD devices (and non removable memory card devices).

1) If (and when it gets full) it's a pain to re-organise music, decide what to delete etc etc.

2) If it gets broken -- you have to re-create all your music library.

3) If it gets lost or stolen -- as 2) above.

4) You buy a new device --as 2) above

5) When listening on the move you might want to play say 60 mins of something and then play something entirely different. Organising play lists is a bit of a pain unless you want to listen to the same stuff over and over again.

There aren't too many DRM issues now with SS 3.2.

MD can RECORD as well and you can still organise all your music needs without being tied to a computer.

I don't care about MP3's but the later MD units can play these (although I don't beleieve you can record direct in that format -- and why would you want to anyway).

Cheers

-K

Well, these are issues folks can have, yes. But with the Cown X5L that i bought I can address your concerns.

1. It will never get full as I don't have that much music. 15GB at most and all my music is ripped from my CDs.

2. If it was broken, I would replace it and just copy my entire library back over with simple drag and drop. There is nothing to reorganize as it is already set up by folders: Music/Artist/Album

3. See #2

4. See #2

5. I don't use playlists, instead I just listen to albums or a specific artist. I am not organized enough to deal with playlists.

6. I have no DRM with this DAP.

7. I can record to mp3, but I only record internet radio and voice, so that is more than adequate

8. I cannot display Extended Chinese or Hangul on a minidisc unit. Sony just isn't interested in providing this option. Grrrrrr. This is the only problem I REALLY have with any type of minidisc. This includes Sony gimping units outside of Japan so they cannot display Kanji/Kana. You would think it would be simpler to have ONE hardware design and ONE firmware. I just don't understand sometimes.

Personally I like MD/HiMD and see it as complementary to the MP3 players I already own. For me though the AA powered units are the really useful MD units. As you don't need a AC or USB charger and once you have a few disks, the unit is really self contained, doesn't need charging, or a computer to record or playback. Which if you are moving around a lot, like in college, holidays or travelling for work is very convient.

Quite often when I'm rushing somewhere, the MP3 player isn't charged, or doesn't have music on it I like. So I can grab my HiMD, and a couple of disk. Pick up AA's on the way and I have music, or can record immediately. I also like the tactile feel of real buttons. Many MP3's players are not tactile to use in your pocket. But if you are near AC all day, and have access to a PC all day (I work in IT) really a MP3 player can be a lot more useful most of the time. For the other time you have MD/HiMD

Now THIS is something I can 100% agree with. I just don't see why we could get a comperable AA powered unit like the tourist version of the MZ-NH700 (with a metal body like the MZ-R70- wishful thinking, I know). I have never like the slim batteries, but the idea of the AA units always were top shelf in my book. It is too bad that after the R70, Sony started adding more and more plastic to the units. "cry"

The AA are especially nice now that HiMD can record from the USB power versus back when compared to say, the MZ-S1. Oh, your comment about the feel of a unit. 100% agree. I want a solid metal body on my units (the X5L is solid aluminum - heavy too) with buttons that have a solid feel and make a real "click" when I use them. I guess that is why I still use 20 year old HP calculators compared to the $3.00 crap in the stores today. Ooops, showing my age.

[Alexx]

i love the facts MD can be powered by AA, and the NiMH cells are way better than the trash the put in i-pods

[lamewing]

i love the facts MD can be powered by AA, and the NiMH cells are way better than the trash the put in i-pods

Acutally the batteries in the iPod are actually quite nice lion batteries, better than NiMH. I think you are confusing the quality with the hardware with the quality of the design. Now if the batteries in the iPod were removeable, like the NH5, then things would better all around. Of course, I shouldn't go and compliment Sony on their battery choice, considering that they made the their new DAPs with internal batteries...taking a step backward. "sigh"

[Michael1980]

But the battery life on the iPod is dire. You can actually watch the meter go down, similar to how you get on a PDA. I am talking about the 4G.

[lamewing]

But the battery life on the iPod is dire. You can actually watch the meter go down, similar to how you get on a PDA. I am talking about the 4G.

BUT that isn't due to a poor battery design, but instead due to a lack of sufficient power based on a poor power supplied / power required ratio. eg. poor design. The iPod (and other DAPs) could eaisly have better batter life if they simply had larger batteries.

Just look at MD vs. HiMD. MD has lesser power requirements and used larger capacity batteries while the newer HiMD units have greater power needs, but were designed to use smaller capacity batteries. The result is that we went from a MD unit that could play SP/LP2 for 31hrs/38hrs. to a HiMD unit that plays SP/LP2 for 10hrs/12hrs and HiSP/HiLP for 8hrs/10hrs.

This isn't the batteries' fault, but instead the designers' fault. In all actuality the lion battery in the iPod/Sony DAPs/NH1/etc is more advanced than the NiMH battery.