Help me decide on RH1 purchase

[bcom75]

Hello to all,

I have been a long time lurker at this forum and would now need some advice.

I have been using an iriver H140 player for over 2 years now and needless to say, it's simply the best electronics device I have purchased to date. Never had an issue with it and I have used it extensively for field work, recording mainly with the Sony ECM907 mic. I need it primarily for voice and it has served me well.

However, I am looking to get something in the Flash/MD department, since player/recorders are lighter and more reliable than HDD based recording that might die on me any moment now - am getting close to 30 months of continuous H140 usage. I have been looking very seriously at MZ-RH1 and ipod nano + micromemo. The nano was attractive because I intend to use my future player at least in part for MP3 playback.

Questions now:

1) How would you rate the recording capabilities/quality of RH1 compared to H140. Despite the HDD shortcomings (HDD noise flushing, white noise everytime the HDD writes data out of the buffer), I have rockbox firmware installed with the enhanced recording pack and I have to say quality is very good. Am wondering if RH1 is actually better....

2) Playback: I don't mean to compare directly a recording device like RH1 with the H140 or ipods for playback, but can MP3s be transferred freely to HiMD and can one choose folders through the LCD remote and hence play back files in the same folder-structure way used in the H140? This is pretty much essential for me, I don't need much more.

3) Any other piece of information comparing the RH1 to the H140 would be most appreciated!

Apologies for the length of the post, but I would like to make my final decision soon (stick with the h140 till it dies or get RH1)...Ipod nano doesn't seem to be a workable solution due to the need of sticking an external device to recording and due to the very inflexible options (no compressed recordings, no gain control, etc). Does anyone know any other flash based player priced equal or lower to the RH1 that could fit the bill?

Many thanks for any advice!

[A440]

I have an H120 with Rockbox and I prefer my RH1. That may be in part because I started with MD as a portable recorder rather than the H120. So add a grain of salt to the following.

I prefer MD recording. Hi-MD is a better music recorder; it just sounds better on music (mic-battery module-line-in). With an external mic for voice recording, held more than 2 feet away from the unit so you don't get the occasional whirring noise, the built-in preamp of the MD adds far less noise than the H120.

Yes, you can send folders of MP3s to Hi-MD. They're called groups, but it's the same thing. However, the drag-and-drop convenience of the H120 is replaced by the slightly more cumbersome SonicStage. SonicStage isn't as bad as it used to be by a long shot--it's stable now--but it's not drag-and-drop. I use my RH1 mostly for recording, not playback, so I can't tell you much about the nuances of playlisting.

If your primary use is as a player, then I don't recommend Hi-MD--get a 2GB flash player with drag-and-drop. But as a voice recorder, the RH1 mic jack and preamp are superior to the H120 (and presumably H140)--much quieter. The H120 built-in mic doesn't have much preamp noise, but it picks up all the disc noise, so I find that pretty useless.

I like my RH1 as a music recorder for features like track marking as you record or during playback (Rockbox now has something similar) and level meters (Rockbox has those too now), along with the recording quality--again, this is for music, which is far more complicated than voice.

For a nice little voice recorder (built in mono mic) and music player, you could track down a 1GB iRiver T30 (red) for under $100. The buttons have a learning curve, but it does record voice nicely through its built-in mic, and has simple mp3 drag-and-drop.

How hi-fi does your voice recording have to be? That's really the question. The RH1 will give you superb fidelity, but at some cost in convenience.

Frankly, if I were you I would use the H140 until it dies. It seems to me that a great flash recorder--large capacity, drag-and-drop, on-unit editing--is one more product cycle away.

Also, check out the Edirol R09 and the Zoom H4 flash recorders. I don't want them because they have built-in mics, but you might prefer them to the RH1.

[Richard]

* Moved to Find Your Minidisc

[bcom75]

I have an H120 with Rockbox and I prefer my RH1. That may be in part because I started with MD as a portable recorder rather than the H120. So add a grain of salt to the following.

I prefer MD recording. Hi-MD is a better music recorder; it just sounds better on music (mic-battery module-line-in). With an external mic for voice recording, held more than 2 feet away from the unit so you don't get the occasional whirring noise, the built-in preamp of the MD adds far less noise than the H120.

Yes, you can send folders of MP3s to Hi-MD. They're called groups, but it's the same thing. However, the drag-and-drop convenience of the H120 is replaced by the slightly more cumbersome SonicStage. SonicStage isn't as bad as it used to be by a long shot--it's stable now--but it's not drag-and-drop. I use my RH1 mostly for recording, not playback, so I can't tell you much about the nuances of playlisting.

If your primary use is as a player, then I don't recommend Hi-MD--get a 2GB flash player with drag-and-drop. But as a voice recorder, the RH1 mic jack and preamp are superior to the H120 (and presumably H140)--much quieter. The H120 built-in mic doesn't have much preamp noise, but it picks up all the disc noise, so I find that pretty useless.

I like my RH1 as a music recorder for features like track marking as you record or during playback (Rockbox now has something similar) and level meters (Rockbox has those too now), along with the recording quality--again, this is for music, which is far more complicated than voice.

For a nice little voice recorder (built in mono mic) and music player, you could track down a 1GB iRiver T30 (red) for under $100. The buttons have a learning curve, but it does record voice nicely through its built-in mic, and has simple mp3 drag-and-drop.

How hi-fi does your voice recording have to be? That's really the question. The RH1 will give you superb fidelity, but at some cost in convenience.

Frankly, if I were you I would use the H140 until it dies. It seems to me that a great flash recorder--large capacity, drag-and-drop, on-unit editing--is one more product cycle away.

Also, check out the Edirol R09 and the Zoom H4 flash recorders. I don't want them because they have built-in mics, but you might prefer them to the RH1.

thanks for your exhaustive reply. What do you make of the Nano/MicroMemo combination? Some people seem to think very favourably of it...actually over the Edirol, such as this

http://message.inabottle.org/124796.html

[A440]

That blog post is only about recording voice. The crucial question for me is what kind of recording quality you get recording something more complex like music.

I mean, if you want a good voice recorder for recording grandma's reminiscences, you'd be fine with an Iriver T30 and just using its higher-bitrate mp3.

I happen to think the analog-to-digital converter in Hi-MD units sounds better than the one in the the iRiver. But I don't think it's a great enough difference for you to switch over, deal with SonicStage and learn a whole new interface when good flash units might be less than a year away.

Another advantage of MD over either iRiver or iPod is that you can pop in a new battery. (It's easiest with the NH700 or NHF800, which take a AA--the RH1 takes a more expensive gumstick that you'd have to keep recharged.) How dependent do you want to be on a rechargeable?

Rockbox on the H120/H140 and a minidisc with a good remote control (the RM-MC40ELK) have come to be pretty similar: pause, level control, time, making tracks, etc. It seems the iPod and Micromemo give you: On/Off, at least according to this review:

http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/ipod/revi...order-for-ipod/

Sounds fairly promising but:

Battery runs out after 3 hours.

From the recording, it seems to have a fixed gain, not user adjustable or Auto Gain.

And look at Comment #13 and below: Mic-in is mono, not stereo, and a stereo mic comes through the left channel only. So your $300 iPod plus Micromemo is as good as a little voice recorder, only using the space of PCM files.

Edited January 19, 2007 by A440

[bcom75]

That blog post is only about recording voice. The crucial question for me is what kind of recording quality you get recording something more complex like music.

I mean, if you want a good voice recorder for recording grandma's reminiscences, you'd be fine with an Iriver T30 and just using its higher-bitrate mp3.

I happen to think the analog-to-digital converter in Hi-MD units sounds better than the one in the the iRiver. But I don't think it's a great enough difference for you to switch over, deal with SonicStage and learn a whole new interface when good flash units might be less than a year away.

Another advantage of MD over either iRiver or iPod is that you can pop in a new battery. (It's easiest with the NH700 or NHF800, which take a AA--the RH1 takes a more expensive gumstick that you'd have to keep recharged.) How dependent do you want to be on a rechargeable?

Rockbox on the H120/H140 and a minidisc with a good remote control (the RM-MC40ELK) have come to be pretty similar: pause, level control, time, making tracks, etc. It seems the iPod and Micromemo give you: On/Off, at least according to this review:

http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/ipod/revi...order-for-ipod/

Sounds fairly promising but:

Battery runs out after 3 hours.

From the recording, it seems to have a fixed gain, not user adjustable or Auto Gain.

And look at Comment #13 and below: Mic-in is mono, not stereo, and a stereo mic comes through the left channel only. So your $300 iPod plus Micromemo is as good as a little voice recorder, only using the space of PCM files.

I get your points, plus the fact is, I am on OSX / Macintosh, so I would use the Sony OS X software which I read is far better than SonicStage.

I am intrigued by this different remote you have mentioned: it seems pretty cheap too on Ebay. Will it be a good aid for recording and MP3 playback?

thanks again for your very exhaustive answers. It's good to see that you come from iriver H series usage too and that you rate the RH1 higher than the H120. What about the RH1 MD spinning noise? Is it anyways comparable with the H120 HDD noise? Would I be able to attach my Sony ECM-DS70P mike and avoid capturing the MD noise on the RH1? I am forced to use an extension cable on the H140 otherwise I would record the HDD spin ups too...

[A440]

What about the RH1 MD spinning noise? Is it anyways comparable with the H120 HDD noise? Would I be able to attach my Sony ECM-DS70P mike and avoid capturing the MD noise on the RH1? I am forced to use an extension cable on the H140 otherwise I would record the HDD spin ups too...

You have to separate the mic from the recorder on a cord or you'll get the whirring of the disc. It's not as loud as the HDD noise on the H120, but it's definitely present.

I don't know why Sony even makes those mics without cords, since everything in use when they appeared--cassettes, minidisc, DAT--made mechanical noise.

I'm not a Mac user, so I have no idea about the OSX software, but it is still more limited than SonicStage on a PC.

Other people have been writing about the Mac software here:

http://forums.minidisc.org/index.php?showtopic=16424