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Comparing Hi-MD, old MD quality?

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mikerophone

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All --

While I've been recording to Minidisc since 2000 (I still use my trusty MZ-R37 for live recordings and my MDM-X4 for recoding music performances) I just recently purchased a MZ-M100 Hi-MD for live recording. The idea of being able to download recordings directly to my Mac without having to do it in real-time through the audio-in was just a bit too alluring.

I'm trying to get a handle on which recording modes to use. I know the PCM is the best it gets, but the downloads to my Mac are deadly slow (USB 1.1...what was Sony thinking?), so I was considering using the Hi-SP mode. Can anyone tell me how the quality compares with the old Minidisc format (ATRAC whatever?) that my MZ-R37 records in?

Thanks in advance for the assistance -- and my hats off to the site creators...it is always a big help!

Mikerophone

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All --

While I've been recording to Minidisc since 2000 (I still use my trusty MZ-R37 for live recordings and my MDM-X4 for recoding music performances) I just recently purchased a MZ-M100 Hi-MD for live recording. The idea of being able to download recordings directly to my Mac without having to do it in real-time through the audio-in was just a bit too alluring.

I'm trying to get a handle on which recording modes to use. I know the PCM is the best it gets, but the downloads to my Mac are deadly slow (USB 1.1...what was Sony thinking?), so I was considering using the Hi-SP mode. Can anyone tell me how the quality compares with the old Minidisc format (ATRAC whatever?) that my MZ-R37 records in?

Thanks in advance for the assistance -- and my hats off to the site creators...it is always a big help!

Mikerophone

You'll probably find that you won't be able to tell the difference for most recordings using HiSP VS PCM. To me PCM would pnly be used when I had the time to make sure everything was perfect, and then probably on a line in recording. Best advice try a couple of different recordings and see what suits you

Have fun and enjoy

Bob

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Can anyone tell me how the quality compares with the old Minidisc format (ATRAC whatever?) that my MZ-R37 records in?

Thanks in advance for the assistance -- and my hats off to the site creators...it is always a big help!

Mikerophone

I think the consensus on this board is that "old school" SP (292K) recorded in real time trumps HiSP (256K). Though that may just be for sentimental reasons.

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All --

While I've been recording to Minidisc since 2000 (I still use my trusty MZ-R37 for live recordings and my MDM-X4 for recoding music performances) I just recently purchased a MZ-M100 Hi-MD for live recording. The idea of being able to download recordings directly to my Mac without having to do it in real-time through the audio-in was just a bit too alluring.

I'm trying to get a handle on which recording modes to use. I know the PCM is the best it gets, but the downloads to my Mac are deadly slow (USB 1.1...what was Sony thinking?), so I was considering using the Hi-SP mode. Can anyone tell me how the quality compares with the old Minidisc format (ATRAC whatever?) that my MZ-R37 records in?

Thanks in advance for the assistance -- and my hats off to the site creators...it is always a big help!

Mikerophone

When you Import to a Mac it will all come in as WAV regardless of what you record in , I am on a Macbook Pro , have the RH1 and 10p anything Imported from a HiMD gets converted to WAV , so PCM will be the best quality SP will just be a Lesser Quality WAV , and you really wont ( unless your an absolute Audiophile ) know the difference .

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I'm pretty fussy about sound quality, and don't think twice about spending a fair bit on Hi-Fi kit/cables etc... and in my opinion, Hi-MD SP (256kbps) sounds a little TINY bit more clinical than old SP (292kbps), which sounds to me a fraction more analogue-y.

However, I ran a frequency analysis test using SoundForge and Izotope Ozone mastering software, on the same track via an old SP recording, and a new Hi-MD SP recording - and believe or not, the Hi-MD one came out having a better frequency response (despite being short 36kbps!).

So in the test I ran, Hi-MD won, and to my ears I think I prefer it too. Basically, you have nothing to worry about using Hi-MD SP mode, unless you actually want the placebo effect of KNOWING that it's recorded as PCM.

Hope my thoughts help you a bit.

Cheers

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for me hisp atrac 3+ is far better than old sp atrac, especially in the high frequencies range: much more clear, best transitory.

Just try miles Davis "Kind o Blue": old sp artifacts on trumpet have disappear with hisp.

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for me hisp atrac 3+ is far better than old sp atrac, especially in the high frequencies range: much more clear, best transitory.

Just try miles Davis "Kind o Blue": old sp artifacts on trumpet have disappear with hisp.

Not on an MZ-R50 they dont , The R50 has a dedicated Line out that is seperate from the Headphone jack , goes thru a completely different driver , and it is VERY clean

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He wasn't talking about that "cleanness" TC, but artifacts created by the compression algorithm of SP Atrac.

He has a Hi-MD deck with VLSC circuitry and gold-plated RCA line out for his A-B comparisons... so the cleanness you're mentioning shouldn't be an issue.

Sony improved ATRAC's compression algorithm with ATRAC3+ supposedly; I say supposedly as I admit I haven't yet done any serious testing.

I must admit I'm very impressed with the Hi-SP rendition of Miles' Ascenceur pour l'échaffaud, I so far can't tell the difference with the original CD. But I'll do a recording of it and Kind of blue in SP to see what all the fuss is about ;)

Well Wiz , if you do not have an R50 , then you wont understand , and any unit that has an integrated Headphone/Line jack will NOT let you hear what I am saying , the R50 was a special unit . and the Line out was direct representation of what was on the disc , also do not forget that I am a recording engineer , so I am speaking on a different level here, the R50 circuitry would be needed to have to proper comparison made , between HiSP , and true SP .

just defeating the Headphone settings , doesnt do it.

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Analouge signal "Purity " , ...... you said it ,

There is a video on you tube somewhere of an interview with Tom Sholtz of the group Boston , and he gives a fairly accurate summation , of what he hears when he put on a CD for the first time . See if you can find it .

the Gold Plating on the RCA , amounts to very little, if the rest of the signal path is compromised . to really hear the difference , it would have to be pristine from point A (the source ) to point B ( the final output)

but lets not turn this into a Debate , If I ever find another good condition R50 , I might send it to you , and let you play with it for a month ( unless you have something to swap me for it !!!! )

But I have the RH1 , and have the R50 , and I have A/B compared them on many occasion . The line out on my R50 and Line out on the RH1 , ............. I like them both , but the R50 , holds its own quite comfortably .

Just my opinion

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When you Import to a Mac it will all come in as WAV regardless of what you record in , I am on a Macbook Pro , have the RH1 and 10p anything Imported from a HiMD gets converted to WAV , so PCM will be the best quality SP will just be a Lesser Quality WAV , and you really wont ( unless your an absolute Audiophile ) know the difference .

So are you running it into a MAC through ITunes?

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Well Wiz , if you do not have an R50 , then you wont understand , and any unit that has an integrated Headphone/Line jack will NOT let you hear what I am saying , the R50 was a special unit . and the Line out was direct representation of what was on the disc , also do not forget that I am a recording engineer , so I am speaking on a different level here, the R50 circuitry would be needed to have to proper comparison made , between HiSP , and true SP .

just defeating the Headphone settings , doesnt do it.

We wanted to compare 2 lossy codecs atrac SP(292kbps) and atrac3+ hisp (256kbps).

For this purpose it is necessary to play on the same hi-end harware (for example Onkyo MD-133 deck), the same track (for example "flamenco sketches" on miles davis Kind of Blue), recorded both in SP atrac and hi-SP atrac3+.

As R50 cannot play atrac 3+, you cannot make this compairison...

(MD-133 has no headphone output, which is a downside for me! :lol: )

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