Guest Anonymous Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 Hey Gang, I have gone through many of the posts about recording live performances (especially loud ones), but I need some more specific help for my problem. The deal is that my band is in the songwriting phase. We are busy writing 12-15 songs right now and may work on as many as 8 of them in a single night. It becomes difficult to remember which arrangements we agreed on, so I use the MD to record everything for reference. My standard process is to record the practices to MiniDisc, rip MP3s, and write them to CD. Then I give a CD to each band member. At the next band practice we all talk about the different song structures we worked with, and which ones we liked the best and want to keep. I do not want to multitrack, produce studio-quality recordings or anything else. All I want is an accurate representation of the sound in the room. THE PROBLEM Every single time I record the recording is highly distorted. Even the low volume stuff (solo acoustic guitar) has a bit of distortion. THE EQUIPMENT Sony MZ-R700 MiniDisc; Sony ECM-DS70P microphone ("T" version, not the one with the long cord) plugged into the "MIC (plug-in power)" jack. THE TECHNIQUES I have tried the AutoRec, with predictable results: the VU meter pegs almost all the time, and the recording is distorted. So I switched to ManualRec, and set the level EXTREMELY low. (I import all the tracks into Sonar and make modifications, so having a weak initial signal wouldn't be a problem.) Last night I set the volume really low. The VU meter never went higher than 1/3 up the scale. But the recording is still massively distorted. Same as with the AutoRec mode. I have moved the MD around the room, and that has no effect on the level of distortion either. One of the other posts up here mentioned plugging the mic into the "Line In" jack for high SPL recordings, but when I did that the VU meter never moved, so I assumed that no signal was getting into the MD so I plugged the mic back into the MIC jack. Yes, we are a rock band, but we play at a level where we can call out changes to each other without using the microphone. So the SPL in the room is not massive. Does anyone have any suggestions to offer? I do have quite a bit of experience recording in professional studios, so I am somewhat familiar with the techniques, common problems, common solutions, etc. But I have not been able to conquer this distortion problem with my MD! My guess right now is that the mic is simply too sensitive, and I need to get a different microphone. Am I on the right track, or out in left field? Can anyone offer any suggestions? I am really at my wits end with this. Thanks for your time and help!!! - Christian Budapest, Hungary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudden Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 The mic you got is just fine. It's the MD that causing your problem. Many (if not all new ones) Sony's have a poor mic in. It's suited for recording speeches and very low acustic music prehaps. Anything that goes above normal conversation level is to loud. Sharp MD's on the other hand have two mic settings, high and low. With low you can record right infront of the loudspeakers at a Motorhead consert without dist. Soultion to your problem might be to use a mixer. Plug your mic into it (must have phantom feeding but most mixer do if you want to use your Sony ECM-DS70P) and then plug in your Sony via the line in. Another way is to get a Sharp MD, second hand or new. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 You got zero from the line in because there was no power for the mic. If you're playing moderately loud, you could get (or build) a battery box for the mic, and then you _can_ use the line in. For softer music, or voice, you'll probably find that you don't have enough gain, but you should be able to get a listenable recording with low distortion. Pretty easy to build a battery box if you know basic electronics http://webpages.charter.net/tidmarsh/binmic/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mAjEsTiC Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 Sharp MD's on the other hand have two mic settings, high and low.Sony units also have this feature as well under Mic Sens option in the menu... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudden Posted September 3, 2003 Report Share Posted September 3, 2003 Yes a few Sony have mic switch but certenly not the MZ-R700 model (nor does N707). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted September 4, 2003 Report Share Posted September 4, 2003 www.microphonemadness.com www.core-sound.com www.giant-squid-audio-lab.com www.soundprofessionals.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted September 4, 2003 Report Share Posted September 4, 2003 Soultion to your problem might be to use a mixer. Plug your mic into it (must have phantom feeding but most mixer do if you want to use your Sony ECM-DS70P) and then plug in your Sony via the line in.Hmmm...ok. I have a headphone amplifier for my bass that has a 1/4" input for the bass, and an 1/8" output for the headphones. It is powered by two 9v batteries. Maybe I could plug my ECM-DS70P into the Input jack, and the MD into the output jack. That would provide a powered input to the MD, with volume control to boot! I will try that out. I'll let you know how it works. Thanks for the help! - Christian Budapest, Hungary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted September 6, 2003 Report Share Posted September 6, 2003 Well, I tried to use my headphone amplifier, but still got nothing when going through the LineIn jack. The setup was: Mic plugged into the Input on the headphone amp. Minidisc plugged into Output on the headphone amp. Manual record selected on the Minidisc, and set at about 50-60%. The headphone amp runs off two 9v batteries (fresh ones), and has a volume control. We played. Got nothing on the MD. I cranked all the inputs up (Recording Level on the MD and volume knob on the headphone amp). We played. Got nothing on the MD. Now I am even more stumped. If I plug into the Mic jack, then anything I record is distorted. If I plug into the Line In jack, I am supposed to get something, and I get nothing at all. Is the MZR700 just too old to have these basic features, or what? Thanks again for any help or suggestions! - Christian Budapest, Hungary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sudden Posted September 6, 2003 Report Share Posted September 6, 2003 Have you tryed to record from a audio source? Like out from a CD to line in on md? (a normal analog recording). And if so what gets on MD? If nothing, then there are something wrong with your MD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reni Posted September 9, 2003 Report Share Posted September 9, 2003 I have an N707 which I also use to record my band's practice. I initially ran into the exact same problem you were having -- when I plugged the mic directly in the MD unit I got massive distortion on my recordings. The problem, (like sudden suggests above) is that the mic pre-amp on the N707 (and R700) is extremely poor and distorts anything above loud speech. What I did is buy a battery box from sound professionals and after that everything worked fine. I plug the mic into the battery box and the box into the line-in. I'm not really sure if using a headphone amp is doing the same thing as a battery box would, but using the battery box solved all my recording problems. Hope that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted September 11, 2003 Report Share Posted September 11, 2003 OK Gang, I have been working with an electronics whiz friend of mine, and we sorted out the problem. The deal is that the LineIn jack on my Sony MZ-R700 does not provide phantom power. That means that it does not provide any power *out* of the MiniDisc recorder to the microphone. Hence the need for an external battery box. I had heard and read about these things, but could never figure out WHY someone actually needed one. Now I know. (I thought they just increased the dynamic range of a microphone, or some such hooey.) So now I need to build myself a battery box. I will go over to my friend's house (he repairs amplifiers and has all the equipment I need) and build one. Thanks for all the help. I will let you know how it turns out. - Christian Budapest, Hungary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raniel Kursch Posted September 11, 2003 Report Share Posted September 11, 2003 try to put earphone in mic-in, in sony mds you have no distortion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted September 23, 2003 Report Share Posted September 23, 2003 I have an N707 which I also use to record my band's practice. I initially ran into the exact same problem you were having -- when I plugged the mic directly in the MD unit I got massive distortion on my recordings. The problem, (like sudden suggests above) is that the mic pre-amp on the N707 (and R700) is extremely poor and distorts anything above loud speech. What I did is buy a battery box from sound professionals and after that everything worked fine. I plug the mic into the battery box and the box into the line-in. I'm not really sure if using a headphone amp is doing the same thing as a battery box would, but using the battery box solved all my recording problems. Hope that helps. I just recorded my band practice tonight.. and it's perfect volume.. we were all in a pretty large sized living room, (Bass, Guitar, and Drums), the recording was absolutely perfect using a Sony F-V220 Mic, however, it was only in Mono, which sucks balls.. ANOTHER PROBLEM I AM HAVING IS GETTING THE TRACKS OFF OF MY 707.. IF ANYONE KNOWS HOW TO DO THIS, PLEASE EMAIL IMMEDIATELY AT DBORNACK@COX.NET Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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