mbhbaritone Posted July 24, 2005 Report Share Posted July 24, 2005 Hi. Can i pose a few queries that arise from beginners problems with uploading etc. NB I have read through various FAQs and threads but those and the manual etc have given rise to some contradictions/further queries.1. Should you live edit recordings on MD first and then upload or visa versa. I've now seen contradictory advice. Might this explain why my upload failed - i assidously edited and titled all tracks first.2. Should you upload and then save (or should i say transfer?) as WAV or do it automatically (i've read that this is poss on SS3.+) i.e in one go.3. I did succesfully upload an unedited (i'm pretty sure) track (approx 5 mins), and converted to WAV but when opened in Audacity only approx 2.07 mins of it is there. This has happened three times?! 4. Are there guides to Audacity program out there? The help stuff doesn't actually see to tell you how to use it! i.e How do you actually edit stuff - i import saved WAV file (or at least the 2.07 mins of it - see 3.) but the "effects" key etc just has a load of greyed out options - how do you get to use them?Thanks to anyone who can answer/guide me.Since my frustarated post a week or so back i've managed to see how to save CDs onto the MD for portable listening so that's improved my faith in the technology. Just a shame i can't work out how to do the reverse which i bought it for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenmachine Posted July 24, 2005 Report Share Posted July 24, 2005 1. I usually upload the recordings without any pre-editing and it worked without problems so far.2. Whatever you prefer3. ?4. You have to highlight a section before you can edit it.The online manual is to be found here: http://audacity.sourceforge.net/manual-1.2/a downloadable version here:http://audacity.sourceforge.net/audacity-manual-1.2.zip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbhbaritone Posted July 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 24, 2005 Thanks for comments and advice. Using same numbers:1. Is it easy to then edit though? Can you do basic editting ie cutting out applause and number tracks in Sonic S or is do you have to use another prog like Audacity for that?2. I just wondered what the pros and cons were4. Oh dear that's what i'd tried to do. I highlighted the whole thing (and tried to highlight part) using edit, select but after that no go. I'll read the guides you gave links for. Thanks again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenmachine Posted July 24, 2005 Report Share Posted July 24, 2005 To 1) To be honest i have no idea what SS can do, i use it exclusively for uploading/wav converting. There is more powerful software for editing (incl. Audacity). Besides, i don't trust SS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meryl Arbing Posted July 24, 2005 Report Share Posted July 24, 2005 (edited) To 1) To be honest i have no idea what SS can do, i use it exclusively for uploading/wav converting. There is more powerful software for editing (incl. Audacity). Besides, i don't trust SS.←I agree, SonicStage is required as the interface between the MD and the computer but I don't expect it to be anything more than a transfer conduit. For editing, I have several options (depending on how much editing I want to do): Magix Audio Cleaning Lab 10 (for cleaning up imported audio from my old cassettes and vinyl), Creative Wave Studio (which came with my sound card), Nero Wave Editor, Roxio's Sound Editor (pretty basic)...among others.Of course, the greatest amount of editing and clean up comes with Live recordings. I burn to CD from the editing software and not from SS. Edited July 24, 2005 by Meryl Arbing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Low Volta Posted July 25, 2005 Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 - titling on the recorder is OK, but easier using SS prior to uploading- I would really advise against other types of editing, as there have been quite a number of reports of trashed uploads with edited recordingsjust use audacity or another program to edit (not SS) and follow these instructions as this really is the safest way known at this moment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbhbaritone Posted July 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 - titling on the recorder is OK, but easier using SS prior to uploading- I would really advise against other types of editing, as there have been quite a number of reports of trashed uploads with edited recordingsjust use audacity or another program to edit (not SS) and follow these instructions as this really is the safest way known at this moment← Thanks The Low VoltaUnfortunately as well as adding titles on MD i also deleted chunks of applause, added track marks and deleted track marks i'd set to be inserted automatically every three minutes. Took me ages as well!Having read link I take it that was a mistake big time as it means I've interfered with this whole 75fps thing?!Assuming my worst fears are correct i.e. i've ruined any chance of SS upload why the hell don't Sony, in the manual, tell you not to edit before uploading????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terence Kelly Posted July 25, 2005 Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 Thanks The Low VoltaUnfortunately as well as adding titles on MD i also deleted chunks of applause, added track marks and deleted track marks i'd set to be inserted automatically every three minutes. Took me ages as well!Having read link I take it that was a mistake big time as it means I've interfered with this whole 75fps thing?!Assuming my worst fears are correct i.e. i've ruined any chance of SS upload why the hell don't Sony, in the manual, tell you not to edit before uploading?????←I replied to your situation in another topic. You will not be able to upload tracks that include a "combine" edit. This is a bug, not because you did anything wrong. You are doing exactly what the unit was designed to do. Sony needs to fix this problem. Please complain to them directly. Perhaps it has been fixed in the new release of SonicStage? It would seem that very few people actually edit on their MD units in this forum or there would be a louder outcry about this serious flaw. That seems odd to me, since the format was designed for that purpose and editing is simple, quick and versatile on a standard MD. However, neither 1st or 2nd generation HI MD units will do what they were designed to do. Sony should recall them or fix them.TKTK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBeardy Posted July 25, 2005 Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 Well, I must be one of the lucky ones then - this weekend I recorded REM live at Hyde Park off my DAB radio on BBC Radio 2, and did all of my track marking, combining, removing commentary etc. on my MZ-NH900 and then squirted the whole lot into WAV files on my PC using SS 3.1 without so much as a second thought. Then I used Nero Express to burn myself a CD of the concert. So yeah, it can be done.Not quite sure what to suggest... wait until SS 3.2 is available in an English version?Peace,Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ishiyoshi Posted July 25, 2005 Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 wait until SS 3.2 is available in an English version?←SonicStage 3.2 English version is available for download. (without Connect Music Service) Check within the download section of the forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbhbaritone Posted July 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 Thanks to TK and others.I will complain as suggested but clearly from other comments I've read in my short time as MD owner this is an ongoing love/hate relationship everyone establishes with Sony with limited response from them. Glad to see i wasn't being stupid but disconcerting, as you say, that a multi-national company is! Just to be clear on SS 3.2. From threads elsewhere there is genuine expectation that new version WILL allow muliple attemps at upload wiithout deleting.BUT are we also hoping that it will cope with pre-editing on MD as well or is that still a bridge too far for the Sony gurus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terence Kelly Posted July 25, 2005 Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 Well, I must be one of the lucky ones then - this weekend I recorded REM live at Hyde Park off my DAB radio on BBC Radio 2, and did all of my track marking, combining, removing commentary etc. on my MZ-NH900 and then squirted the whole lot into WAV files on my PC using SS 3.1 without so much as a second thought. Then I used Nero Express to burn myself a CD of the concert. So yeah, it can be done.Not quite sure what to suggest... wait until SS 3.2 is available in an English version?Peace,Michael←Are you sure you did a combine where the two previous tracks had really been written to the TOC of the disK? As long as the combine is done in the units memory you won't have a problem. The failure is not just occasional with my RH10, it is 100%. Do me a favor and try a test where you auto track mark an analog recording and get several tracks. Afterwards, combine two tracks by removing a track mark. Make sure the edit is written to the TOC, then try to upload. I will either get bombs or SS 3.1 will hang as it plays back the combined track. The conversion to wave will stop where the combine was made. To repeat, if SS doesn't bomb, the whole track is uploaded but will not play back over the combine, nor will it convert the whole file to wave. The program thinks all is well, but the wave file will only be the first part of the combined track. TK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbhbaritone Posted July 25, 2005 Author Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 That sounds like a possible explanation as well for why my one succesful upload only converted partially to WAV (another thread).Thanks TK, it's all bad news but at least i feel less ignorant.Having said that i fear i must risk sighs by asking what TOC stands for as in your comment "written to the TOC of the disK"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terence Kelly Posted July 26, 2005 Report Share Posted July 26, 2005 That sounds like a possible explanation as well for why my one succesful upload only converted partially to WAV (another thread).Thanks TK, it's all bad news but at least i feel less ignorant.Having said that i fear i must risk sighs by asking what TOC stands for as in your comment "written to the TOC of the disK"?←TOC stands for table of contents. The TOC is the map of where the tracks on the disk are located. It is similar to the directory of a hard disk. You will notice in your manual that it warns you not to disturb your unit while it is writing the TOC. If the TOC gets scrambled, you can't play your disk even though the musical information is there. The TOC allows the minidisc to be edited easily -- your musical tracks do not need to be stored contiguously on a minidisc. The TOC keeps track of all the bits and pieces. I believe the problem you and I have experienced is because SS 3.1 has a problem interpreting the TOC of a minidisc when the entries get a little more complex.TK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terence Kelly Posted July 26, 2005 Report Share Posted July 26, 2005 I forgot to say that your minidisc will update the TOC each time you turn it off. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but initially, when you edit a disk, all the edits are made to a copy of the TOC which has been loaded into the MD unit's memory buffer. The changes are only written to the disk when you turn the unit off. That's the reason why they warn you about battery level so much in recording. If there is not enough power left in the battery to update the TOC when you turn off the unit your recording will be lost, even though the musical information may have been successfully stored on the disk.TK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBeardy Posted July 26, 2005 Report Share Posted July 26, 2005 Do me a favor and try a test where you auto track mark an analog recording and get several tracks. Afterwards, combine two tracks by removing a track mark. Make sure the edit is written to the TOC, then try to upload. I will either get bombs or SS 3.1 will hang as it plays back the combined track. The conversion to wave will stop where the combine was made. To repeat, if SS doesn't bomb, the whole track is uploaded but will not play back over the combine, nor will it convert the whole file to wave. The program thinks all is well, but the wave file will only be the first part of the combined track. TK←OK Terrence,I'll give it a try this evening... Just dragging my body off to work right now - with a fistful of tunes in my NH900 - Peace,Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBeardy Posted July 26, 2005 Report Share Posted July 26, 2005 OK, so I must've been doing something a bit different on Sunday... Combining tracks with either auto- or manually-inserted marks results in a message "omgjbox.exe has encountered a problem and needs to close."I think what I was doing at the weekend was manually inserting track marks and using them to delete out bits of commentary - I think I may not have actually combined any tracks, certainly not with a save to the TOC. That's one I'll have to beware of... It would be interesting to know if SS 3.2 has fixed this... but I won't get my hopes up.Peace,Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terence Kelly Posted July 26, 2005 Report Share Posted July 26, 2005 OK, so I must've been doing something a bit different on Sunday... Combining tracks with either auto- or manually-inserted marks results in a message "omgjbox.exe has encountered a problem and needs to close."I think what I was doing at the weekend was manually inserting track marks and using them to delete out bits of commentary - I think I may not have actually combined any tracks, certainly not with a save to the TOC. That's one I'll have to beware of... It would be interesting to know if SS 3.2 has fixed this... but I won't get my hopes up.Peace,Michael←Thanks for trying the test for me Michael. Misery loves company. I did send detailed instructions to Sony Support on how to duplicate the problem. They promised to send my info to Japan for testing. It does seem like it must be a SonicStage bug so it is possible they addressed it in 3.2. I haven't had time to set 3.2 up yet.TK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBeardy Posted July 26, 2005 Report Share Posted July 26, 2005 Thanks for trying the test for me Michael. Misery loves company. ←Hey, my "pleasure"! Do post up what results you get if/when you try it under SS 3.2Peace,Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terence Kelly Posted July 27, 2005 Report Share Posted July 27, 2005 Hey, my "pleasure"! Do post up what results you get if/when you try it under SS 3.2Peace,Michael←Well, I just installed SS 3.2. No difference. The bug which cripples ALL Hi MD units is still present.TK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelBeardy Posted July 27, 2005 Report Share Posted July 27, 2005 Well, I just installed SS 3.2. No difference. The bug which cripples ALL Hi MD units is still present.TK←Poo...! Thanks TK.Oh well... Maybe I'll just skip 3.2 and stay with 3.1 for the moment. Better the Devil you know...Peace,Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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