First attempt @ live recording - not good!

[soundalike]

Hi

I've just got a Sony MZ-NH900 and an audio-technica ATR97 omnidirectional condenser boundary microphone. The setup works perfectly for recording interviews and focus groups which is the reason I bought the kit.

Having read lots of stuff on the forum I realise that this is not the ideal setup for recording live music but I couldn't resist trying it out at a festival. The results are not good!

For the open air stuff (e.g. standing by the mixing desk at The Magic Numbers) I got some nice ambient crowd noise, a bit of wind and fairly clear but low fidelity music. The mic is mono so I duplicated the track in Audacity to make left and right channel sound. Is there anything else I could do to improve what I've got?

For the indoor stuff it gets worse. I used the low sensitivity mic setting and turned the rec. volume down to 12/30 but the sound is really distorted in places. Presumably there's nothing I can do with the wav file to get rid of the distortion?

Looks like I'm in the market for some new kit now! Any recommendations for cheapish UK distributors of binaural (stealth!) mics?

I'll upload some samples when I've got time - perhaps you can include them in a 'how not to' guide!

Cheers

[greenmachine]

Wind noises are an issue with any insufficiently screened microphone. Crowd noise is a matter of mic placement and/or directionality of their pickup pattern - it's often unavoidable. Trying to improve a bad recording often fails, it's propably better to invest in good equipment. Getting rid of distortion in an afflicted recording is next to impossible. In order to record virtually distortion-free in loud situations, you'll need either a very low sensitive mic or an attenuator or a battery box through line-in. At least you've identified the majority of problems by yourself, a good first step for improvement.

[soundalike]

Wind noises are an issue with any insufficiently screened microphone. Crowd noise is a matter of mic placement and/or directionality of their pickup pattern - it's often unavoidable. Trying to improve a bad recording often fails, it's propably better to invest in good equipment. Getting rid of distortion in an afflicted recording is next to impossible. In order to record virtually distortion-free in loud situations, you'll need either a very low sensitive mic or an attenuator or a battery box through line-in. At least you've identified the majority of problems by yourself, a good first step for improvement.

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Thanks Greenmachine

I'm looking for a pair of binaural mics so will use the recommendations on the forums here. However I'm not sure (even after reading the numerous excellent posts) whether I'm better off with an attenuator, battery box or both. Is there a rule of thumb for loud gigs without having to buy both and conducting lots of field trials?

Cheers

[greenmachine]

I assume you mean a separable miniature omnidirectional stereo microphone, i consider binaural as a certain recording technique. Some manufacturers abuse this term for labeling their products and thus create quite some confusion. You can record binaurally with such a microphone, but you obviously don't necessarily have to, it's propably one of the most flexible and experiment-friendly solution. See my recent tread about microphone placement to see how some common techniques compare.

As for the attenuator against battery box discussion, there's quite some disagreement. Some say a battery box would be too expensive and gives too quiet results, while on the other hand the headphone volume attenuator decreases the signal to noise ratio, lowers the bias voltage, is susceptible to mechanical wearout and dirt and is made of potentially lower precision components. If you're a hardcore headbanger, the battery box is propably the only possible solution for you, otherwise the attenuator may do suffice if it's not getting extraordinarily loud.

I don't know of any european manufacturer of such microphones except for the german soundman.de, but i wouldn't call their products inexpensive. I took a look around at ebay.co.uk but couldn't find anything suitable either. They're really easy to do for yourself though, see this thread: http://forums.minidisc.org/index.php?showtopic=11254

[soundalike]

Yes I did mean 'separable miniature omniaural stereo microphone' and am easily confused! Listening to your different mic placement configurations I think that the 6" human head baffle sounds really good and from a practical point of view (standing inconspicuously in a crowd), it's the way forward for me.

I'm not good with a soldering iron so I think I'll be scanning e-bay for an appropriate mic. Maplins in the UK stock attenuators so I'll try this first before buying a battery box. I'm not into really loud headbanging stuff so may not need the battery>line-in configuration.

Thanks again for your help greenmachine

[soundalike]

Not trying to bump up my own post (or whatever the term is) but I've added my first live recording to the Gallery.

This link should get you there if you're interested

http://forums.minidisc.org/index.php?act=m...&cmd=si&img=982

Pretty poor I'm sure you'll agree but an improvement on my very first attempt where I forgot to turn the mic on!

I'm not sure of the limits on file sizes etc but let me know if it needs to come down and I'll post an excerpt instead.

Cheers

[greenmachine]

Sorry to be a showstopper, but i've heard way worse first recordings, take mine for example:

http://forums.minidisc.org/gallery/1122160...3_60_834153.mp3

I've been trying to record a very loud, bassy show with a highly sensitive microphone and high sensitivity setting on the recorder, levels 6/30 or something ridiculously low, lol. If you listen carefully, you might recognize the music somewhere hidden in a wall of distortion. But heh, at least it's stereo

Back to your recording though:

I'm not sure what you were trying to accomplish by adding a second channel with exactly the same information, it's still mono, but divided to two channels. I think you may have wanted to use some artificial stereo effect to give it some space, like that:

http://forums.minidisc.org/gallery/1122160...3_60_517907.mp3

Still no substitute for a stereo microphone and careful placement though, maybe i made it even worse.

[soundalike]

Good point about the mono-stereo solution (or lack of). Seems like I need to read through the manual for Audacity. Anyway, this should be academic soon as stereo mics are hopefully on the way.....