infoman Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Hi there The other evening I was recording a concert. My internal rechargeable battery was low as I forgot to charge it, so I was really just running on an external AA battery pack with my HiMd MZ-NH900. I recorded a short speech last 9 minutes at the start of the evening and that still exists. However the 1 hour 22 minute and so many seconds recording of the concert is missing, along with a possible 0 second track created whilst I switched from auto record volume to manual record volume. What are the chances of the track(s) being recovered? I know the unit was still recording when I reached my car and it was then that I switched off the hold button and hit stop. I don't know what happened after that because I wasn't watching but I don't remember the battery icon flashing before I hit stop. I'm gussing the battery gave out during the saving but I can't be certain of this. What I do know is that when I went to play the recording today, only the first track lasting 9 minutes existed. The disk space is also showing as being free. What are the chances of Sony recovering it? I live in the UK and don't know if Sony UK recover discs. I've read previously that Sony do in the USA. Is this still the case and do I simply e-mail them requesting this service, as I don't live in the USA? If I was to send it abroad, I'd need to do an exact sector copy of the disc first, including all the sectors listed as free, in case they modify it with no luck or the disc goes missing in the post. Kind regards Infoman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philippeb Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 What minidisc have you used: MD or Hi-MD ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfbp Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 Hi there The other evening I was recording a concert. My internal rechargeable battery was low as I forgot to charge it, so I was really just running on an external AA battery pack with my HiMd MZ-NH900. I recorded a short speech last 9 minutes at the start of the evening and that still exists. However the 1 hour 22 minute and so many seconds recording of the concert is missing, along with a possible 0 second track created whilst I switched from auto record volume to manual record volume. What are the chances of the track(s) being recovered? I know the unit was still recording when I reached my car and it was then that I switched off the hold button and hit stop. I don't know what happened after that because I wasn't watching but I don't remember the battery icon flashing before I hit stop. I'm gussing the battery gave out during the saving but I can't be certain of this. What I do know is that when I went to play the recording today, only the first track lasting 9 minutes existed. The disk space is also showing as being free. What are the chances of Sony recovering it? I live in the UK and don't know if Sony UK recover discs. I've read previously that Sony do in the USA. Is this still the case and do I simply e-mail them requesting this service, as I don't live in the USA? If I was to send it abroad, I'd need to do an exact sector copy of the disc first, including all the sectors listed as free, in case they modify it with no luck or the disc goes missing in the post. Kind regards Infoman Sadly there is no good way for you to do an exact copy of the disk. Don't attempt it, the result will be worthless and you may change the disk irretrievably. If the disk was recorded in any HiMD format you are most likely out of luck (though Sony Media Services might be in a position to help, for a fee). If it's standard format disk (80m disk and SP, LP2 or LP4) then one of us can help via TOC cloning. However it's clearly not SP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peteinoz Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 (though Sony Media Services might be in a position to help, for a fee). The non-existence, after all these years, of any sort of file retrieval system from Hi-MD is extremely bad news, but typical of Sony's top-heavy technical "cleverness". I recorded a concert last night, after which the MD entered "save" mode, and now all it says is "NO TRACK". It's the first time this has happened, but that doesn't make it any better. Has anyone successfully retrieved Hi-MD data via Sony Media Services, and what sort of fee are we talking? I'd be prepared to pay, but only if there's a chance it could actually be done. After several failures similar to this with standard MD, usually from battery failure (I successfully 'cloned' many of these discs once I found out the solution, but god only knows how many recordings I overwrote prior to this, thinking the discs were blank), I thought this problem would be solved by investing in the new system. What a grave disappointment. Sony really should get their rear ends kicked for this. I am ready to ditch this whole daft recording system and move to something that actually works without all the technical black holes. I wonder if that member several years ago who was going to sue Sony for mental anguish over lost and irretrievable research interviews he'd done in the Domenican Republic actually went through with it? They need a good class action on their hands to smarten them up. What *should* have been the last straw for me was when Sonic Stage told me that a whole heap of ATRAC files I'd previously ripped to my computer couldn't be played or accessed because they'd "expired". Give me a break. Unfortunately I have to use the damn thing over the next two nights for the same purpose because there's no alternative. If I strike any more problems the unit will most likely be finding itself sinking to the floor of the nearest river, unless some other masochist wants to buy it from me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfbp Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 To be fair, the only time I have seen the exact set of circumstances you describe is when the overwrite head is no longer working. If so, getting mad at something Sony did (that doesn't affect you) won't help much as the recording was stillborn regardless. Suggest you exercise it a bit and see whether you can perform normal editing and sound track creation operations on the unit (using a different disk as it's quite possible your recording could be recovered). The non-transportability of ATRAC files was designed in from the beginning. Since version 4 of SonicStage there has been a way out, however, which is well known on the forum here - the File Conversion Utility. Until this happened along I never wanted anything except WAV files anyway as my goal at the time was to edit with sound processing software - and generally WAV was the only format that I could do this with. I personally weigh the excellence of the sound and convenience of the package against the nonsense of Sonic Stage and all the futile protection they employed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A440 Posted February 21, 2010 Report Share Posted February 21, 2010 (edited) Maybe I'm the only one, but Sony Media Services did retrieve a Hi-MD full of music for me. At the time, I had no idea what had gone wrong, but in retrospect I may have removed the battery (near dead) when it was still saving. I killed another (near empty, luckily) disc that way. They charged about $50, with no charge if they can't get the files. No idea whether they still even try--this was years ago. And Pete, if your unit is dying--sounds like it--get the Sony PCM-M10 flash recorder. PCM (up to 24/96) or mp3 recording. Drag-and-drop with standard USB-to-miniUSB. (No ATRAC, no SonicSadist, no encryption, no conversion--nothing proprietary.) Lighted, clear on-unit display. Track marking. 4GB internal memory plus microSD slot (also takes but does not require Sony memory stick). Remote with record button (but no display, sigh). Solid build. Huge battery life (2 AA). Under $300. Suffice it to say I'm at the end of my MD years. Edited February 21, 2010 by A440 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infoman Posted November 13, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 Hi there Sorry it's been a long time since I posted my question. I forgot to return as it's one of these issues that I only sometimes think about. I actually have 3 discs with issues. 2 were recorded in LP2 [edit: previous SP wording was wrong] and the 3rd in HiSp. Of the 2 SP discs, 1 failed due to battery dying whilst writting and another due to me accidentally deleting part of a recording on a the disc. I was new to minidiscs and whilst messing around with the options I deleted part of the recording. As I said, both of these were LP2 [edit: previous SP wording was wrong] recorded and in both cases I never wrote to the disc again because I knew that would be fatal. [Edit: I have found the TOC cloning guide on the Minidisc.org Web Site, so I'll give that a read.] So if you know how I can get that back or if a blog/post explaining this exists I'll be interested. The HiSP disc was damaged by some unknown reason. That would need to be sent away but I've always hesitated because I'd have to send them to another country and I'm concerned they might get lost on route or not get returned back to me. If they do lose them then there's nothing I can do at all to recover the recording. Is it possible to clone a disc prior to posting, so that a second attempt on a different disc, by those in the know, might be possible later on? I'd be more likely to get the disks repaired if it was the Sony UK repair service dealing with it. I still however do record to minidisc because it's light and easy and it just about works. I don't want to spend another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infoman Posted November 13, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 13, 2010 Hi there Having read the minidisc.org guide I see that I might be able to clone the TOC myself. My father has a minidisc desk which he uses to record opera. However the model numbers are not listed on the site. So does anyone know if the models MDS-JE770 and/or MDS-JE470 can clone? My farther has one of those models, although I don't yet know exactly which one it is. Kind regards Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odyssey Posted May 8, 2011 Report Share Posted May 8, 2011 Wow, I know this is a late answer and it seems you are using an 80 minute MiniDisc. If the battery died during the recording, only the parts that had a pause between them will be found on the disc. If there was no pause, it is all gone. OK, when the minidisc is recording, you should be plugged into power unless you are at a local concert or at school or such where plugging in the power supply is not a good option. The recording goes to disc and is completed ( not the TOC ) after every pause, the track number increases by one and it records a new track. any track that is in record when the battery dies is lost because it has not completed the track recording. With the loss of the TOC, the recorder cannot find the recordings that were saved on the disc. 70 and 80 minute discs can be saved, Tascam has a unit that does this easily by pusing a button or two. If you don't know anyone that has one of those units, go back to the minidisc forum where they discuss this in length and a couple of ways to try to get a TOC back. One method will give you a TOC but your recordings will come back a one long recording and you will have to put the breaks in manually. www.minidisc.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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