Which Sony Soundforge Audio studio 9 or 10?

[freddyjollo]

well I have both and  just got round to intalling 10 on my Windows 8.1 pc. Seems like there is a bug in the default  save mechanism as it dont save to the same  bit rate as the source  file eg LP4 66 kps 13 mb file is  turned into a 39 mb 192 kbs file. Sound Forge AUdio Studio 9 works as it should LP4 to LP4. Not sure what advantage  10 has over 9 but  version 9 is the one to get I think if at this late date  you want to  edit  on your pc  atrac files ( is the only editor that will?) I am a bit surprised at this  fault in 10 - there dont seem to be any way to  change this faulty behavior so it isnt a matter of a setting. You  can of course use the "save as"  but then you get a new file and it dont have thte OMA extension

[freddyjollo]

By the way Sony sold their software to a German company called Magix

www.magix.com. They only  have the v10 for sale - but I susoect you can get the older v9 from Ebay. This will still register with sony/magix so no problems there

[punkrockaddict]

hi

im using Audio Studio 10 on Win 10 :-D

I´ve noticed something similar but in the end when i looked at the file in the windows explorer it turned out it was saved as i wanted it to be.

maybe you shozld check that ?

it was like i was trying to select a bitrate/codec to the saved file that was switched back during saving.In the end it turned out this was not the case.

 

 

[freddyjollo]

well I think the  save button should just  save the file to exactly the same type and  format as the unedited one - v9 does that, v10 didnt my example was of a LP4 66khz  file at 13mb going to a 39mb 192 khz file.  Not what I want.  Rather important for putting back onto the discs I think, given their small capacity? I think I will have to query the new owners on this and see if it can be fixed. The only reason I noticed some thing was  wrong was that the file size had increased - then I looked at the details from SS or SF Studio and saw the details that the bit rate had changed. If you have an LP4  atrac file untouched  by SF  I suggest  you try loading a copy into  SF edit a bit and click the save button and see  what you get - I would be interested  in your results

 

here an LP2  file  I just tried on see its format has been changed to atracplus bit rate & file size has changed . Maybe there is a setting I have over looked, but commonsense  suggests a save button shouldnt need a setting? first image is before 2nd is afer edit and save. Its almost as if the old atrac formats have been removed and only the new plus ones  used? even the saveas wont wont allow write back to atrac lp2/lp4  So it seems  SF 10 not much use to netmd users which is a great loss?  need v9? which is not easy to get hold of now ( I had a look at Ebay )

I saw just one copy for sale  from Belgium.

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SONY-Sound-Forge-Audio-Studio-9-FR-Headset-free-/262412768064?hash=item3d19051340:g:XAYAAOSwE6VXJIgu

 

 

 

for comparison here are  before and after for SF 9 - see all that has changed is the file size

 

 

 

 

[sfbp]

I tried both versions and I don't see the problem. Maybe you have to figure out how to make a template (although the last one used should be good enough). I get identical file sizes. The only difference was that version 10 warned it would be throwing away some metadata that it couldn't save in LP2 format.

[freddyjollo]

hmm I dont seem to be making my self clear. I am talking about useing the save button on the task bar which "should" save to the  format that the orginal was with no intervention? v10 dont, v9 does. Any way the "save as" button"  that brings up templates dont include any  original Atrac formats so you cant make a template to save to  Lp4 or Lp2. If you look at my screen shots of the orginal and edits info  you can see that the LP2.Atrac3/132 kbs was turned into  Atrac3plus/192 kbs and larger file size using v10. The screen shots for v9 dont, everything is preserved.  Not sure how i can make my self clearer?

 

  Are you saying your installations dont do that?  Your copy of V10 DONT  without convert  Atrac3 Lp2/Lp4 to Atrac3Plus/192kbs when  you edit and do  a save?

Why is this a problem? well if you use Net Md and Lp2/Lp4 SS will have to  convert any original Atrac3 LP2/LP4  files that were edited  using SF from atrac3plus  BACK to atrac3 again before saving to a minidisc - silly. and further more reduce the file size again - again silly.

 

[sfbp]

4 minutes ago, freddyjollo said:

 the "save as" button"  that brings up templates dont include any  original Atrac formats so you cant make a template to save to  Lp4 or Lp2.

Yes it works perfectly, you have to look (as always) under Custom. But once you have selected that it stays the default as Last Unsaved Template.

[freddyjollo]

what about the "save" button? thats  my issue not "saveas" ( I can see now it is possible to use that to saveas Lp2/Lp4)

No templates are visible for "save"

 it seems to be fixed at atrac3plus/192

what build is yours mine is 152

 

RE  v10 I have  noticed dont seem to be able to change the "format " description field when you set up a custom format - stays at

"Audio: 192 Kbps, 44,100 Hz, 16 Bit, Stereo, ATRAC3plus" wont allow me to delete that or change that

but can with v9

[sfbp]

It's going to change the file type on you no matter what you do. If you OPEN an ".OMA" or (.oma") file it will not permit you to save as that suffix. That has not changed between versions 9 and 10, the focus of your thread, I think.

I tested both versions and as long as you select the right thing (Default Template, Custom), regardless of what it says in the dialog box (maybe confusing to you) it will do the right thing. Better to make yourself a "Save" template and then you don't have to worry. I've already done this for MP3 because the default is "Joint Stereo" which we know sucks bigtime, and needs to be changed. The way to change defaults is to make a template with the right settings.

I got 132kbps when I told it that's what I wanted. Did you find the menu entry (clearly marked ATRAC 3) under Custom?

The other ?neat feature is that SF will write directly to an MDLP minidisc. That feature is gone in version 10. But why wouldn't it? Atrac3+ is 12 years old already, and you can still export the file via Sonic Stage.

[freddyjollo]

You seem to talking exclusively about the saveas button, whereas I am concerned with the "save" button

 seems like you never use the "save" button - I would assume it selects format and bit rate automatically to be the same as the original as it overwrites the original so that the "saveas" button is only needed if you want to do format conversion eg mp3 to atrac and output to a different file, This assumption is true for v9 but not v10 where the "save" button does a format conversion and there seems to be no way to stop it other than not use the button - this seems to be a bug or  alternatively v10 has been  written as if  minidisc doesnt  exist and the format upgrade that the "save" button seems to do a good thing ( as you wont  be saving it to a minidisc disc ever )

 v9 will save to an oma file extension IF I USE THE "SAVE" button ( the very same file as the original). The "saveas" wont it changes to a "aa3"

You still dont seem have  answered my question it seems about what the "SAVE" button in the task bar does on your installation?

 Unlike  you I do just simple edits and saves, want to strip out material not part of a file, press a button and save without further a do and the deletion is all thats happened  - thats what the "save" button is supposed to do and does so under v9 but not v10 it seems

 

The build of v10 ( build 152 ) I have seems have issues  - not only the  dubious  "save" behaviour but also the  handling of new templates in the  "saveas" function where  you dont seem to be able to change the  format description as mentioned  in my previous post

 

[sfbp]

From my POV this conversation is over. Yes, I have exactly the same build as you. The save button is greyed out in Xp and Windows 7 on both 9 and 10. This may mean it is something to do with the way .OMA files are installed in Windows. I do not see the issue, and I do not care to debate this further.

[freddyjollo]

well  under  windows 8.1 the save button  functions. I assume  u mean Windows 10 in your case.

[punkrockaddict]

I just recorded a test file @66kb e.g. LP4 on my JB980 and uploaded it with RH1 to SoS.

imported it in AudioStudio 10 and saved it again as LP4 66kb.

Now the copy protection is gone too :-D and i can import it in SoS with no Problems.

Like Stephen said the Metadata can´t be saved somehow.

When you´re about to save you need to click custom to select the Atrac3 modes ; that was a bit confusing for me as you couldn´t select them from the standard view.

But in the end everything works perfect besides the option for quality.I can´t select high or standard when it comes to Atrac3.The option just don´t exist :-O It´s only available for Atrac3+..

[freddyjollo]

10 hours ago, punkrockaddict said:

I just recorded a test file @66kb e.g. LP4 on my JB980 and uploaded it with RH1 to SoS.

imported it in AudioStudio 10 and saved it again as LP4 66kb.

Now the copy protection is gone too :-D and i can import it in SoS with no Problems.

Like Stephen said the Metadata can´t be saved somehow.

When you´re about to save you need to click custom to select the Atrac3 modes ; that was a bit confusing for me as you couldn´t select them from the standard view.

But in the end everything works perfect besides the option for quality.I can´t select high or standard when it comes to Atrac3.The option just don´t exist :-O It´s only available for Atrac3+..

I assume  you also  cant use the "save" button (rather than saveas,) which dont have any  template options and saves to the source  without changeing format in any way in  v9 but not 10? dont  know why haveing so much trouble getting this across here.

[sfbp]

It has, IMHO, nothing to do with either the version of SF or Windows. More likely something about the way file types are installed. Has anyone ever seen that funny "file type" something like "Identifying installed files" ;(  ??

[freddyjollo]

2 hours ago, sfbp said:

It has, IMHO, nothing to do with either the version of SF or Windows. More likely something about the way file types are installed. Has anyone ever seen that funny "file type" something like "Identifying installed files" ;(  ??

well i have both SF v 9 & 10 installed on my Windows 8.1 pc so dont know what " the way file types are installed" here means and I get the behaviour as described - the save button preserves the  type of  source file when  an edit is saved  eg Lp2 or Lp4 ( Atrac3)  in v 9 but not v 10 which are changed to an atrac3plus codec at 192kbs, typically 3 times the size in bytes.  I noted other  issues with the saveas button that when  you make custom templates  I cant change the  format/codec information.description field for it in 10 where it  says 192kbs even if it aint,  but can in 9. I conclude some bugs have crept in, in v10

[sfbp]

Try changing the file association for .oma

Really, this is getting rather boring, please forgive me for being so rude. Your problem has nothing to do with Sound Forge or Windows, but with your particular installation. And, on reflection an artifact of trying to run two different versions of the same software which (likely) relies on file associations to determine some of its behaviour.