ozpeter

MS-based mics are also a good way of capturing a realistic stereo soundstage with good ambient feel. I'm not up with current model numbers but I'm pretty sure that any "proper" Sony stereo mic will use MS (by which I mean anything intended to be held in the hand). Keep in mind how the listener will perceive the stereo sound field. Possibly stating the obvious, but say you were recording a car zooming past - don't follow the car with the mic, else you won't get the in-on-the-left, out-on-the-right feel. The same applies in more subtle situations - don't move the listener's head around when he/she might not expect it. So if the mics are attached to you, you may have to go a bit strangely rigid at times!

That's not most people's experience so there must be some local reason for the problems. But what I can't guess.

I just tried the setup.exe download but it wouldn't install - so I tried the supplied "MD Editor 2" software and it seems fine under XP (SP2 even) anyway. (I'm interested as I am hoping to sell my PC2 soon and want to be able to sell it as XP compatible - which it seems to be here at least - I too had it under Win98SE till now).

Now you know how they work you can have endless fun holding one end up to a light and seeing the result in the other end, and stuff like that, pending the purchase of something to actually connect it to. And as stated you can take off the covers, lose them, search for them, find them, put them back on again - wonderful times lie ahead. My book entitled "101 Things To Do With A Disused Optical Cable" can be purchased on Amazon shortly.

The long pointy one goes into the line in socket and the stubby square one goes in the output of the equipment you haven't got....!

Well, it's evidently a matter of YMMV. I'd still be interested to hear from anyone with an NH900 who is convinced following a proper bench test (ie a test where they turn the source off and on altogether, not a location experience) that they can turn off auto track marking by any method. (Also from anyone who can create a new group on the fly, that it, without pressing stop then going back into record!).

Give me 24 hrs to go back over auto track marking with the NH900 - I'm pretty sure the sync setting has no effect on any aspect of track marking and is purely useful in the context on digital input, but I want to reassure myself that I'm not talking rubbish before I get dogmatic! The Sony 979 must indeed be pretty antique now - I've got two of them, and I suspect I've had them for about 15 years. I used one the other day to record a lecture in the the same rumbly church and it recorded the rumble pretty convincingly, so I don't think it has a radical bass rolloff. For the lecture I had auto level on and mic sensitivity on high, and the result was remarkable given that I was not nearly as close to the source as I wanted to be. No system noise at all. But I digress. Anyway, this whole wording of the reference to the need for attenuation is largely a matter of opinion and personal mileage with the mic one happens to have, whereas my paragraph above concerns a more important matter where it's either right or wrong - I shall return....

http://forums.minidisc.org/index.php?showtopic=5121 is relevant I think.

My understanding is that "sync rec" is for automatically starting and stopping recording in sync with an optical input, rather than the function described in the FAQ. As for defeating track marking by using time mark, this is demonstrably not true with my NH900. You have to test this rigorously with a steady mid-level signal interspersed by total silence. "In the field" experiences are not likely to be valid tests. In the two most recent concerts I've recorded with the NH900, I got about 60 automatic track marks in the first, and none in the second. The hall in the first was very quiet. However, the hall in the second suffered from traffic rumble which defeated the silence detection. At the end of the concert I turned the mics off altogether for 5 secs, turned them back on, and the NH900 then inserted an automatic track mark (and I had not touched the NH900 in any way). A small point, but when you are setting manual record levels regularly, it's a whole lot easier to access the rec menu by two clicks up rather than five clicks down- the menus rotate so you can go backwards to rec far quicker than going forwards. Personally I'd change that to "It can't handle excessive levels, especially from a sensitive mic. So for most amplified music....." I'd be surprised if a symphony orchestra actually caused a problem. And it would rather depend on the mic in use too. I recently recorded a jazz big band in a small club from six feet away with no problem (Sony 979 mic). Pop/rock levels are of course (often ear-damagingly) higher. Please don't take these comments as a general reflection on these excellent FAQs. Thanks for preparing them!

What format did you record in? There was a thread running here which said, if I recall correctly, that there is a bug affecting editing of Hi-SP recordings leading to inaccurate deletion of tracks. The safest thing is perhaps to transfer the tracks to a PC, convert to wave files, and edit the wave files themselves using (if necessary) a freeware sound editing program such as Kristal or Audacity.

I know you said that "hard limiting sounds horrible" but you might want to try using it after the compressor if using a rack of effects in Audition's multitrack view. The idea of hard limiting is just to catch the occasional extreme peak - perhaps the ones that slip through the compression net. It does not change the sound at all on audio below its cutoff point - I've tested that scientifically and proved that only the peaks are modified (which is the whole idea). Really, if you can hear it working, you're not setting it up correctly - you must be hacking into the main signal rather than just the out-of-the-ordinary peaks.

That's a good introduction if I might say so! From a binaural CD review at http://www.binaural.com/bins.html- "Mike Skeet is a binaural-positive recording engineer. He has fashioned some of his own mike systems, including a dummy head into the back of which a digital MiniDisc recorder has been installed for a completely portable package that goes anywhere. And Mike went just about everywhere with it to put together this unique collection of music, locations, voices, events, happenings and even history... He designed it for a high quality headphone listening experience. If you think MiniDisc is just a consumer digital format, experiencing this sampler might change your mind. The 60 different tracks include such startling binaural demos as bell-ringing in the belfry, a steam engine passing right over your toes, a thunderstorm that beats any of the others in our catalog, a party with a jazz group that easily outclasses the "you are there" feeling of the famous Jazz in the Pawnshop , some choir excerpts in which you can easily locate each singer in the ensemble, and some of the usual walking-around-the dummy-head-and-laughing demos. " I introduced Mike to minidisc many years ago, and he's never looked back. He has a pair of Aiwa MD recorders built into a special case with preamps he designed and built himself, together with a custom built level and phase display. Last time I saw him he was recording a classical concert in London's prestigious Wigmore Hall with this rig, fed from a complex surround sound mic array suspended above the stage. He's built many different binaural setups and you'll find further references to these via Google.

The arrangement I described in this post charges the battery on the road nicely. Gives about 24hrs recording time - playback for I don't know how much more!

I'd suggest asking on Adobe's own Audition forum or on the AudioMasters forum where there are many users with many ideas, and also FAQs covering some aspects of this. And it might be deeply boring for the others here. This link might make a start. Remember the more you squash the higher levels, the more you can raise the lower levels into the 'space' you have made at the top of the waveform.

I've seen comment that the Marantz mic inputs are rather noisy. That on the NH900 seems remarkably good to me. I've started using it professionally for backup instead of DAT (main recording being to CDR) where the dire ergonomics don't really matter, but that and the mills-of-god transfer speed (compared to CDR anyway) is the real problem with serious use. If HHB brought out a pro Hi-MD version it might be interesting.

I recently bought a not-very-costly external battery for my digital still camera, and noticed that it would not only output the 7.2 volts the camera needed, but also the 3 volts required by my NH900. Needless to say, I couldn't resist it... I've made up a lead which connects it to the charging stand, and a present I'm seeing how long it will last while recording to 1GB MD using Hi-LP, with the phones plugged in on full volume, the MD supply power to a mic, and the backlight permanently on in the remote. I suspect about 24 hours may be possible but my patience may not last that long. The battery comes from this site here in Australia - I don't doubt similar ones are available elsewhere. I was surprised at the amount of tiny components inside the charging stand - it's not just a passive device. Why does the manual say to remove the MD from the charging stand when it's in use? Has anyone discovered a downside to that? I could use the normal power input socket instead but for my forseen purposes, the changing stand will be neater.

At this post I've noted some results about levels which may be relevant to this thread. At the end of the day, you've got to set the levels by the meters. In that thread I've suggested peaking two segments down from the 2nd dot to avoid clipping. Also, if to achieve that you are having to use the low sensitivity mic input at 10/30, you are probably overloading the mic input right at the outset. If you are using high sensitivity above about 20/30, you are in danger of getting excessive mic preamp hiss. So, if your meters are hitting the penutimate segment all the time, you need to reduce the mic level. If to do that you have to go lower than (probably) 13/30 on low sensitivity, you mic is overloading the input stage, and you need an attenuator. If your meters never hit the segment two to the left of the second dot, you need to set a higher level. If you have to go above about 20 or so in high sensitivity to do that, your mic is not sensitive enough and you need to preamplify it. Am I right?

Results of more testing:- I've been comparing recording from a CD via line in and mic in, to see whether recording via mic in is a viable workaround for avoiding auto track marks. Not surprisingly, even when mic sensitivity is set to 'low' the mic preamp overloads in this scenario - I had the level set to 10/30. Noise level however was not a problem - it seems to be the same for line or mic input. So, you need to lower the incoming line level when recording line into mic. From years back (maybe with the MZ-1?) I have a Sony lead with a resistor built into the miniplug designed for recording line into mic - I must find it - I wonder whether they are still available? Also, there must be a mic level setting below which you should not go, otherwise you are bound to be overloading the mic preamp. 10/30 is clearly a no-no. I'm guessing that somewhere around 15 upwards is ok - I need to test for that. Also, off topic, I see that the NH900 meters under-read. If they ever illuminate the segment below the second dot, that's a definite overload. If they are regularly hitting the segment to the left of the second dot, you may well be getting clipping (overload). If they very occasionally do so, you might be ok. To be safe, given that the average noise floor is around -86dB, you should not allow the meters ever to light up the segment to the left of the second dot. (This comes from checking the levels of transferred files in Adobe Audition, both for wave and for Hi-SP recordings).

To answer my own question - I have just been through every combination and permutation of settings I can reasonably come up with - including things like holding down the track mark button when paused - and I cannot find a way of turning level-based auto track marking off for line in, nor for that matter on for mic in. I really can only conclude that those seeming not to get line-in auto track marking are simply not encountering adequate lowness of level in their input material. But I would be very happy to be proved wrong. Good old Sony.... Of course, one workaround is to use low sensitivity mic in with the level turned down, instead of line in. Tomorrow I will try to establish what quality issues one might come up with in that scenario (stop me if that's tried and tested way back). One might expect higher noise levels from the mic preamp but an initial test using theshold of pain levels of FM hiss interspersed with silence, using the mic input with a line source, was very encouraging - I could hear no noise at all in the silent bits.

It really does seem odd that people are getting different experiences with this. Using the test I suggest above (or similar - just something which is BOUND to trigger any auto track mark) it would be interesting if anyone could report settings which repeatably turn on or off auto track marking. I'll have a fiddle myself too. (There's gonna be a whole lot of fiddling in Australia going on!)

It's very simple to test this behaviour. Just connect the MD line in to the line out of a CD player, play a CD for 20 secs, pause the CD for ten secs, unpause it, and I'd be amazed if it didn't start a new MD track regardless of any setting.

It must be pretty heartbreaking for people here who have spent a great deal of time on preparing FAQs and answering replies when someone comes storming in and tells them that they don't like the comprehensive advice offered and the eminently clear answers they have been given. You don't have to spend much time reading here to know that the FAQ you have been directed to contains all possible options. If there were others, they would be known to people here (who are universally acknowledged as the prime source of such information) and would be included in the FAQ. Why would they want to keep it a secret from you?

If you have correctly-sited mics and they match and they are a stereo pair, your levels should be naturally centred - or if off-centre, perhaps that reflects the nature of the performance. Assuming you are uploading into wave format afterwards, any reasonable correction actually required should be possible with a freeware editor. And at that point you have the leisure to make careful decision. I'd be wary of putting anything not crucial between the mic's outputs and the MD's inputs.

True - and the mic stand three or four feet from the performers is a bit of a give-away too! I do this for classical radio broadcast, I should explain. For reasons related to the risks of SonicStage and the slow transfer rates compared with CDR, I'm not about to replace the primary CDR recording with HiMD even though nobody would know, but for the backup recording I'm likely to retire my HHB PortaDat in favour of the NH900.

What I think most of us want is a way to stop it doing that. If it doesn't happen for you, then the silence isn't silent enough. In a classical concert using manual recording levels, it should happen pretty often - I came home from a concert yesterday with 64 tracks. Damn nuisance. At any other genre, or if using ALC which will try to turn up quiet bits, you might not be so lucky/unlucky.