Erasing discs

[musicmaster]

I have an older model Net MD MZ-S1 and I am trying to erase a few discs... or actually format if necessary or possible to start fresh and get the full amount of space/recording time on the disc.

I have tried and retried the steps listed in "erasing a whole disc" description on the operating insructions to no avail.

I am getting an error when I follow the instructions as outlined in the operating instructions.

The error message reads:

TrPROT

This is followed by a meaning/remedy:

--You tried to record or edit on a track that is protected from erasing. Record or edit on other tracks.

--You tried to edit a track that has been checked out from a computer. Check the track back in to the computer and then edit.

There are about 70 or so tracks on about 15 discs that I want to completely erase and/or format... whatever the proper teminology is for MD.

If anyone has any suggestions on what I can do to accomplish this based on this description, that would be great. I have already slid the little button on the actual disc and that didnt change anything. (By the way, what is that for?)

Thanks for the aniticipated help.

[Shozzer]

You cannot delete tracks that have been downloaded via the computer. These need to be checked back in (note: this will not transfer the actual tracks to the PC).

[bland10000]

To erase the discs, plug your unit in to your computer via usb and open sonicstage or realplayer, whichever program you use to transfer music to player. Erase via these programs.

[musicmaster]

Yeah I tried using the software "Open MG Jukebox" to find what was on the disc and erase. It seemed to work ok. Thanks.

Now my question would be for putting tracks from my pc on the newly erased disc. It seems like this application is a bit confusing. Is there a "universal" application that will work for any Sony MD recorder to put tracks on the discs?

I tried using the one above... but it seems very complicated and some of the tracks didnt go through properly. They show as on the disc, but they dont have any sound... the time just runs. Also, the time it takes to transfer seems very long. I suppose this is a limitation of my pc not of the md recorder, because I am using usb 1.0 and my processor is rather old 733mhz P3

Any info would be helpful though. Thanks.

[dex Otaku]

Now my question would be for putting tracks from my pc on the newly erased disc. It seems like this application is a bit confusing. Is there a "universal" application that will work for any Sony MD recorder to put tracks on the discs?

It's called SonicStage, which is what OpenMG Jukebox was renamed to some time ago.

SS 3.3 or 3.4 is available from connect.com, depending on your area. They may all be up to 3.4 by now.

I tried using the one above... but it seems very complicated and some of the tracks didnt go through properly. They show as on the disc, but they dont have any sound... the time just runs. Also, the time it takes to transfer seems very long. I suppose this is a limitation of my pc not of the md recorder, because I am using usb 1.0 and my processor is rather old 733mhz P3

Anything you send to you netMD has to be encoded or transcoded to atrac3 in order to work.

Encoding takes time, and the slower your computer, the more time that means it takes. If you keep a library of already-encoded tracks on your computer with SS, you won't have to go through the wait of encoding/transcoding every time you download - it just downloads the already existing copy.

When you rip CDs, SS will encode directly to whatever atrac3/plus format you choose. Note that your netMD supports only LP2 and LP4 modes, AKA 132kbps and 66kbps.

That said, if you don't change the contents of your MDs very often, Simple Burner is much better for sipmly ripping CDs directly to netMD or HiMD. Ripping CDs with SS means always having those tracks taking space on your computer. SB doesn't store anything on the computer, it just encodes and writes to your netMD.

If you try to download MP3s, they also have to be transcoded [converted].

If you're trying to download MP3s and are getting silent tracks as a result, you probably have a misbehaving or simply incompatible MP3 codec installed on your system.

If you have ever installed codec packs of any kind, they are a likely source of misbehaving [not to mention outdated and just plain broken] codecs.

I would suggest browsing the Software forum here. There are numerous threads about MP3-transcoding related issues, and many of them contain solutions. And yes, most of the problems do revolve around bad codecs.

Lastly, your problem -might- just be solved by upgrading to the newest version of SonicStage, though I can't predict the likelihood of that. That would be the first thing I'd do in your case, at any rate.

[dex Otaku]

Additional note:

If your system really does have USB 1.0 [as a P-III it's far more likely to be USB 1.1] then.. well, here:

Rated speeds -

USB 1.0 - 1.5Mbps

USB 1.1 - 12Mbps

USB 2.0 - 480Mbps

If it really is USB 1.0, that might be another factor. I would point out, though, that legacy MDs [MD60, 74, and 80] as used by netMD have peak write speeds between 1-2Mbps, and read speeds around 4Mbps. Since netMD is download-only, using it with USB 1.0 isn't likely to cause any kind of really dramatic slowdown compared to USB 1.1 or 2.0.

[musicmaster]

Additional note:

If your system really does have USB 1.0 [as a P-III it's far more likely to be USB 1.1] then.. well, here:

Rated speeds -

USB 1.0 - 1.5Mbps

USB 1.1 - 12Mbps

USB 2.0 - 480Mbps

If it really is USB 1.0, that might be another factor. I would point out, though, that legacy MDs [MD60, 74, and 80] as used by netMD have peak write speeds between 1-2Mbps, and read speeds around 4Mbps. Since netMD is download-only, using it with USB 1.0 isn't likely to cause any kind of really dramatic slowdown compared to USB 1.1 or 2.0.

I thought it was USB 1.0 but you may be right at 1.1 At any rate, it still seems slow, but that could be because of the P3.

Well, anyway dex... I really appreciate your timely and informative response. Great information there, although somewhat not what I was wanting to hear, because of the limitations of my MD player. It sucks that it will only encode to the equivalent of 66 and 132 kbps. I did read in the manual it has a 3rd setting. It lists in the manual "Normal, LP2 and LP4 as far as the batter life, but I presume this is merely playback and has nothing to do with the actual encoding process. Is this right and this is only a setting on the player to play back in different quality to reduce draining the battery faster?

Now here is another interesting piece of info, which maybe be generic and only applicable to some MD units, but again this is in my Operating Instruction Manual. In the recording section it has a table which lists SP, LP2, LP4 and monaural. SP is 80 mins, LP2 is 160, LP4 is 320 and Monaural is 160. Do you have any information on this table and info?

I will also look in the forum for info regarding the codecs and such regarding blank tracks, because it may have been how these were encoded. Hopefully I can find what I am looking for regarding that.. but I will browse around Thanks for your help

[dex Otaku]

Now here is another interesting piece of info, which maybe be generic and only applicable to some MD units, but again this is in my Operating Instruction Manual. In the recording section it has a table which lists SP, LP2, LP4 and monaural. SP is 80 mins, LP2 is 160, LP4 is 320 and Monaural is 160. Do you have any information on this table and info?

SP = 292kbps = 80 mins on an MD80

"Mono" = single-channel SP = 146kbps = 160 mins

LP2 = 132kbps = 160 mins

LP4 = 66kbps = 320 mins

These are the recording modes available for use with realtime recording, via mic, line, or optical in.

With netMD via the PC, there are 3 modes:

Pseudo-SP = 292kbps = 80 mins [this is actually LP2 encoding padded out to work as SP mode for older players]

LP2 = 132kbps ..

LP4 = 66kbps ..

Basically, the highest quality you can encode to via PC for netMD is LP2.

[musicmaster]

Basically, the highest quality you can encode to via PC for netMD is LP2.

That Bites!!

Well I suppose I am very limited with this cheaper quality MD unit.

There is an optical in... does that give me the capability to record with a mic if I purchase an adapter of some sort? Or is mic recording possible at all with this unit that you know of?

[Roamer]

The MZ-S1 has a line-in / optical-in input. You will likely need a preamp unless you record very loud shows (like i do). You will also need some way to convert if you want to use optical (which is not required, you can also go analog from the line-in). At the same time, a preamp will had some bulk and some cost, so you might also considerer a unit with built-in mic entry.

And I use a PII 400Mhz (but only for uploading HiMD, i don't have any mp3s in SonicStage's library).

[musicmaster]

That is useful information roamer. Like I suspected, since I do not have HI-MD I do not really have the capability of recording a quality live show with ease. So I am stuck with just playback, which is fine. I would have liked to been able to record shows with this, but I seem to be able to find many of the shows I have attended or many that I haven't... in file sharing communities.

One other question I have, which you may have the answer to...

I just recently upgraded my software from Open MG Jukebox to the Sonic Stage application via the website download.

For some reason however, I cannot get the software to complete a scan of my files, it seems to freeze a minute or so after it gets started scanning my hard drives to add files to the database. I have retried this many times and the same result... just the hourglass, and my hard drive ceases to work with the app. I have to manually shut down the application via Task Manager.

Any ideas?

[atrain]

try running the mdac repair tool in our downloads section. once run perhaps try running SS without scanning for files & add them manually?

[musicmaster]

try running the mdac repair tool in our downloads section. once run perhaps try running SS without scanning for files & add them manually?

Actually, I tried that, but I was thinking... why am I going to use a tool to try and repair this problem, yet I dont still get to use the scan function?

See, I have a huge amount of music on my hard drive and I want to be able to import it all at once to the Sonic Stage library. From there I wish to be able to have them all converted to atrac to pick and choose as I like what to burn onto minidisc.

Is there a way to add my entire database from my pc to the SS Library in one step, and then in one other step do a conversion process from mp3 to Atrac?

Edited February 26, 2006 by musicmaster

[atrain]

just run the mdac tool anyway.

if you have a huge amount, do an automatic import then walk away for a while. like an hour at least. let it do it's thing without you using system resources for oither things.

[musicmaster]

just run the mdac tool anyway.

if you have a huge amount, do an automatic import then walk away for a while. like an hour at least. let it do it's thing without you using system resources for oither things.

Well, I have run the mdac tool, and it hasnt done anything for the method I have tried as explained before.

Now, what you suggested above, as far as doing an automatic import and leaving the pc run the app. to do it's thing until it's done, would be just sweet. I am away from the pc for long enough periods of time where it can in fact do it's thing. Unfortunately, I am missing a step on exactly where to start the 'automatic import.

I have searched left and right in the index and tried to figure out exactly how to do this by what you suggested, but I just can't find it for what I want to do.

All I can find is how to transfer media 'from the library' ... 'to a device/media', but not 'from my pc'... 'to the library' , which is my goal.

I need to transfer about 100gb of data in one step from my pc to the library. Then convert to ATRAC and then transfer to the minidisc player.

If you can tell me exactly where to click step by step that would be greatly appreciated.

I just cannot find it on my own.

Cheers!!

Edited February 27, 2006 by musicmaster

[dex Otaku]

in the menus:

File -> import -> scan folder

this will let you add your existing media to the library.

Then go to:

tools -> start file conversion tool

That said, if your existing tracks are readable by SS [i.e. they're WAV, MP3, or WMA files] it might be easier to just convert them on the fly rather than having to [first] duplicate your entire library [and second] have to add another pass of loss to every file already encoded in a lossy format.

Point being: for listening on your PC, you should maintain your current library of [hopefully] first-generation encoded tracks, and perhaps convert them as needed when transferring to your player.

If the added pass of loss doesn't bother you and you have lots of space to invest in duplicating your entire existing library, then go ahead and encode everything as you wish, of course.

Side-note:

The reason "importing" your existing tracks takes so long is primarily because SS has to read all of their tag info and assimilate that information into its own database.

[musicmaster]

Hey dex...

My last few posts were posed to atrain, although if you can answer the last question I asked, that would be great.

It seems you just picked up where you left off. I have already gone beyond that. I am now trying to just figure out how to do what was outlined in my last question.

I have no restrictions on space. I am also no longer concerned with the time it takes to convert.

I just want to be able to convert all of my music on my hard drive at once, rather than folder by folder... because it is a lot of music. I am also not concerned about it being lossy either... especially since what you said earlier about it being 112kpbs or 66kbps if I am correct. So, in closing I just wanna do the whole sha-bang in one step for addition to library... and one step for whole conversion to atrac. I have yet to find out how to do that.

Thanks!!

[dex Otaku]

It seems you just picked up where you left off. I have already gone beyond that. I am now trying to just figure out how to do what was outlined in my last question.

Reread my last reply.

[musicmaster]

in the menus:

File -> import -> scan folder

this will let you add your existing media to the library.

Yes dex... I did read your post fully over and over again. I am not trying to sound demeaning or ungrateful at all, so please dont take my words like that, but what you have suggested has been suggested, tried and also a repair for this has been suggested tried and also I have retried this scan method, still to have it freeze again.

If by 'on the fly' you mean adding my cds to the library directly without ripping them to my hard drive, well that is not an option, because that will take far too long because I have thousands of discs. If you mean some other method not so time consuming that would be great, although need to do all of it at one time. Folder by folder would take far too long. I need to add everything all at once... walk away from the pc for a few hours and come back and its finished.

If you typed something else in regards to adding my music to the library... then I missed it and I apologize. So, if that is case can you repeat that part only for me please, and explain further in detail what I need to do.

From what I gather by what atrain suggested, seems to be what I need to do to get all of my hard drive of music added to the library at one time:

"if you have a huge amount, do an automatic import then walk away for a while. like an hour at least. let it do it's thing without you using system resources for oither things."

The problem is... I cannot find out where to run this method.

If you know or if anyone including atrain can give me the directions on how to do this.. THANKS!!!

If there is another method to get my mp3s burned on mindisc in a quick manner then I would be interested in finding out.

A final note is that I posed this request directly to Sony. They sent me email back first in regards to the Conect Store. I repeated that I am inquiring about adding music to the Sonic Stage libarary that is on my pc. They again replied with something completely irrelevant saying if we have no record of yoru account with Sony. If you want to purchase a card please do this etc... It seems hopeless with them... so this forum is my only salvation for this issue.

Thanks so much

Edited March 1, 2006 by musicmaster

[dex Otaku]

Have you tried just dragging & dropping your music folder on the SS library?

The automatic import that atrain is talking about is the same thing I already mentioned.

[atrain]

i think i crossed the wires, i meant doing the music scan dex mentioned but dragging folders will do the same thing. also SS may look & act like it is not responding but odd-on it is. leave it overnight even.

[musicmaster]

Ok guys... well I tried the drag and drop method into the library and that seems to have added all of my music that I wanted into the library.

Now I want to convert it to atrac to then burn on mindisc so I can play it on my MD player.

I tried using the file conversion tool... but it says it has to shut down SonicStage to do so... so I clicked ok.

Then it says it will convert all of my files that are of the old type, not mp3 or wav. And, it also says to back up my files before proceeding. Well, first of all my files are mp3 and wav... so it apparently will not work, unless I am using the wrong procedure.

Additionally, why do I need to back up my files? Is this process going to change the files on my pc that are in my music folder or is it going to change the ones that I added to the library?

I am a bit confused.

[musicmaster]

Ok you guys, I think I have it. Sorry that I didnt get it sooner, but I think I have figurd this out. I just had to have the MD player connected, then I just drag whats in the libary to the MD player. I didnt understand that before. Unfortunately I still can only drag one folder at a time, but I suppose that is all that is necessary since the minidiscs only hold about 3 or 4 albums anyway depending on length. I was under the impression since they were 80 mins they would also be about 700mb just like a regular cdr, so I would be able to burn about 8-10 albums on each... but I suppose these only work based on time and not on space.

Anyhow, thanks all!!! I appreciate the input