kgallen

Hi. Sorry I did mean to go and do this but got distracted by the pitch/speed question! So I have just done this now. Unfortunately it doesn’t. After playing the one track it goes into STOP. Pressing PLAY plays the same track again. How frustrating. The hunt continues... Kevin

(Off topic, sorry OP!). This is probably the reason, good shout. Our MD would give me their final cut (i.e. a rough-as-a-badgers-hind-quarters cut) with some pitch shift on a chorus and it would be horrific beyond belief - horrible splashy percussion and garbled vocals. So I'd have to start again and try and reproduce from the original (supplied) tracks - but you're right these were probably MP3 from t'internet.

For completeness, the MDS-JE530 (which is the next model along from your 520 and is near identical, but with the newer Type R codec) has pitch shift. As I have a 530 too, I just gave it a go and whilst again it’s pitch+speed, again it does a great job of it. The function is accessed from the setup menu rather than having dedicated controls as on the pro models. This might be a more affordable machine. Kevin

I use Audacity a lot and even pitch and speed shifts using Audacity can be pretty horrific. The shift done by the MD players was pretty impressive if you want the pitch shift with the corresponding speed shift.

I'm not sure you can get these functions truly separate, even on the best decks. MDS-E12 (and MDS-E10) have "Vari Speed" but this alters pitch (and speed creeps with it), +/- 12.5% Tascam MD-350 also has "Pitch Control" but this is the same, alters pitch and speed, +/-12%. I just tried my MDS-E12, MDS-E10 and MD-350 for this. Very nice implementation, sounds good, no distortion or sound aberrations. The portable MZ-B10 does have a speed function, presumably for dictation use, but the sound quality suffers horribly as you slow it down or speed it up. Tascam MD-CD1 Mk1 and Mk2 (NOT Mk3) also have MD pitch function. As I have (a Mk1) these too (what a surprise on this forum!) I'll have a play in a bit, but as it uses the same Sony chipset as above I think the results will be the same. Happy to hear from others who have found a machine that can! Kevin ETA: Confirmed Tascam MD-CD1 Mk1 is the same Pitch Control as the Sony decks. What I also need to note here for completeness, is that these pitch/speed control functions only work with SP tracks - not MDLP LP2 or LP4 tracks. MZ-B10 has a true speed control that does not affect pitch - but this is not a function you'd want to use as a backing track source, since the sound is altered. The machine trims off the bass and the sound becomes a little aberrated at the more extreme settings. It sounds pretty bad through the inbuilt speaker, but actually listening to an Ian Dury MD using headphones, it's not quite as bad as I thought. But it's still not usable for performance, this is a feature to help the transcription of a dictated message.

Auto Pause: MDS-JE440 and MDS-JE480 definitely don't (I just tried on mine with and without disc). Setup Menu options are very limited on these decks. Cost reduced - no headphone socket either. Previous model range MDS-JE520 and MDS-JE530 definitely do and hence the 9xx/7xx/6xx of their respective ranges. MDS-E10 and MDS-E12 do. Tascam MD-350 and MD-CD1 do.

Possibly something more ‘pro’ like the MZ-B10 although we’d have to check the manual... ok just looked, it has a 1- Track mode. Whether this is the same as Auto Pause (which I too use for theatre) on the big decks I’m not sure. As it happens I have a B10 so will have a play when I get home unless someone else confirms in the meantime. Otherwise I suspect the ‘newer’ portable models don’t (indeed the gits removed Auto Pause from the later home decks from the MDS -4xx series just when I needed another MD deck back in 2001 for my drama group). However it is worth digging back to the slightly older portables pre 2000 assuming you don’t want MDLP. Even the mid 90s models with an ATRAC before our beloved 4.5 will be just fine for quality playback - most of the advances in ATRAC were in the encoder/recording side, the decoder pretty much unchanged. Any version of machine/ATRAC will play SP tracks. Don't go too early though - the very early machines had much higher power consumption so had some unobtainable rechargable battery pack. Look for something that takes AA cells, which means it will probably also work with the fairly standard Sony 3V power bricks that are pretty common. Make sure you look in the Players section too as I'm guessing you don't need record on this unit if you're using it "out on the road". Also some of the ‘larger’ and older portables have remote or footswitch inputs. Worth having a browse on minidisc.org - I just looked at the B3 and R3 for example but no 1 track option there. Kevin OK admittedly having had a look around I'm not finding much with A-Pause. I had a browse on eBay to see what was about. Stumbled on this Sharp MD-MT270, which whilst it doesn't have Auto Pause or 1-Track, does look like a chunkier build which might be of interest for on-the-road. No connection to the seller. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sharp-Minidisc-Recorder-Walkman-MD-MT270H-BK/264842411748?hash=item3da9d67ee4:g:AFYAAOSwSYNfQ7Jp Manual is here: https://www.manualslib.com/download/489231/Sharp-Md-Mt270h.html

Great news and great learning exercises too across the range - especially as you document them here for the benefit of others!

Great news, keep it up!

I have the exact same on a N505. I resoldered the headphone jack but it didn’t help. Pressing gently around the headphone amp chip on the PCB got back full operation so my fear is there is a broken joint somewhere in that circuitry rather than the jack itself. As you say it’s tiny surface mount stuff so no chance of getting even my finest soldering tip in there without blobbing lots of solder shorts all over the place! So I’m intrigued if any of your ideas work... Kevin

Great story. Hope the drive transplant goes well. I suspect the main PCB and power supply is good too. Maybe the failed audio is a killed output cap if some Neanderthal abused the poor thing by back-driving it from say a power amp. Is it both channels failed? If so possibly the output stage op amp which would be trickier to replace as it will be surface mount. Any news on the analogue input side?

Bought mine new too and it’s never been out of the box since a couple of weeks later I did your option 1). I think it was my E12 but same result!

Random, sorry, but I just dug up the Behringer manual page on SCMS for the SRC2496 so thought I’d capture the section here for reference (yes I know you can download the pdf from the Behri website). This also shows all 4 combinations of the two binary digits.

The only disc I’ve ever scrapped is a TDK RXG where the disc surface looked like it had gone ‘rusty’ - specs of reddy brown in patches. It wouldn’t read or record. Otherwise I have Sony, TDK, Maxell, BASF, maybe the odd Sanyo. Some look nicer when in the wrapper than when unwrapped!

Probably don't need to swap the plastic facia - swap the PCB behind it with the buttons and display. And certainly just swap the drive, don't risk transplanting that OWH (although actually that process is probably a couple of tiny pozi screws and a 2-pin header). But overall if you put the silver drive in the black machine are you done? ETA; Ha @BearBoy just beat me to it with a much more succinct answer!

Good call @NGY. ‘Dry joint’ is what I’d know a bad joint as. However in your example I think that’s a stress fracture. But I think they have the same consequence - a poor and highly resistive joint. Sounds like you had yourself a solder joint low pass filter!

Give us more information. Like what did you do to awaken the chipmunks? 480 doesn’t have a pitch shift function that I can see in the UM.

Cases arrived this morning. Agree they are a nice case (kids are loving them for their MDs! :-D ). The case will also fit (just) an MZ-B10 (left photo). There is a cute zippered back pocket that will hold AA batteries and a velcro one that will hold probably 3 MDs in cases. Also the back pocket can un-velcro at the bottom and will then fit a small smart phone like an iPhone 5s (as modelled here by my son!).

As my trial above shows, it ignores SCMS in the input SPDIF and sets it on the recorded track per the Copy Bit menu setting. What do you mean by ‘strip’ compared to ignore (in the context of the E10)? I realise other machines may ignore on the input and ‘strip’ for the output because they don’t have a means to allow the user to configure them (effectively a ‘copy bit killer’). If I get time I’ll try similar on my E12 but it’s probably the same as the E10.

I get the impression SCMS was never enforced in the J model - maybe not enforced in any J MD model? Would be interesting if anyone other than Techmoan has some Japan-sourced machine and if any of them give a hoot to SCMS adherence.

I thought I saw a definition for GC and UC somewhere but after posting above I couldn't find it again to reference as I thought there might be a query (and here it is!). For sure, UC was USA and Canada. I think GC covered everywhere else they seem to have specific locale designations for (EU/GB, AUS, J). Ah here we go:

The different SCMS behaviour we (may) see between E10 machines could be down to a change made on later machines. I have "Supplement-1" to the E10 Service Manual (probably from Elektrotanya) and it describes a different resistor configuration for the SCMS setting. Which way this takes SCMS handling is not clear, it just says "now do this". Note in the schematic the interesting point, pin 87 (pin list=AVSS,schematic=SCMS) versus pin 72 (pin list=SCMS, schematic=CDR/MD) (see schematic, 3rd image) If you're intrigued by R435 (which is not on the schematic), it's just a resistor that can pull up pin 87, whereas R434 pulls it down - fit one only otherwise you'll create a power supply short (see PCB layout, 4th image). Note: red/blue annotations added by me.

Right, here goes. I set up my Sony MDS-E10 PRO and my Tascam MD-350 and connected them only via an optical TOSLINK cable (both machines have both optical in and out). I have 4 discs: - Blue is the "master disc" - an MO MD that was dubbed in LP2 from a commercial CD using a Tascam MD-CD1 Mk1. So this is a 1st Gen Digital Copy of a CD. - I have Yellow, Purple , Black MO MD discs that I make successive generation copies on where permitted. The MDS-E10 PRO has a menu option "Copy Bit" that can take one of 3 setting: Permit, Inhibit, PreRecorded. 1) MD-350 --TOSLINK--> MDS-E10 PRO For the first step I play a disc track on the MD-350 and record on the MDS-E10 PRO. I make successive copies of a track Blue -> Yellow then Yellow -> Purple then Purple -> Black. I repeat for all settings of Copy Bit on the MDS-E10 PRO. Conclusion: - MDS-E10 PRO will copy (record) via optical TOSLINK, a disc track played on the MD-350 of *any* generation that was recorded with *any* Copy Bit setting used when that track was recorded on the MDS-E10 PRO. The drive in the MDS-E10 PRO is MDM7SC (SC=serial copy?). On Yellow, Purple and Black discs I now have a set of tracks recorded with each setting of Copy Bit on the MDS-E10 PRO, where Tk1=Permit, Tk2=Inhibit, Tk3=PreRec and Yellow=1st Gen Copy (i.e. a copy of a Blue track), Purple=2nd Gen Copy (i.e. a copy of the respective Yellow track), Black=3rd Gen Copy (i.e. a copy of the respective Purple track). 2) MDS-E10 --TOSLINK--> MD-350 Now I reverse the TOSLINK connection and play on the MDS-E10 PRO and record (where permitted) on the MD-350. MDS-E10 PRO has the Copy Bit setting at Permit (but I now see this setting is irrelevant for playback). This is where I make some further generation copies where I can, but recording using the MD-350 which I presume obeys SCMS coming in on the TOSLINK. Blue Tk -> Cannot Copy Yellow Tk1 (Permit) -> Copy to Purple Tk4 Yellow Tk2 (Inhibit) -> Cannot Copy Yellow Tk3 (PreRec) -> Copy to Purple Tk5 Purple Tk1 (Permit) -> Copy to Black Tk4 Purple Tk2 (Inhibit) -> Cannot Copy Purple Tk3 (PreRec) -> Copy to Black Tk5 Purple Tk4 (Permit) -> Copy to Black Tk6 Purple Tk5 (PreRec) -> Cannot Copy Black Tk1 (Permit) -> Copy to Yellow Tk4 Black Tk2 (Inhibit) -> Cannot Copy Black Tk3 (PreRec) -> Copy to Yellow Tk5 Black Tk4 (Permit) -> Copy to Yellow Tk6 Black Tk5 (PreRec) -> Cannot Copy Black Tk6 (Permit) -> Copy to Yellow Tk7 So after all of that, some readers are laughing their socks off, because the results are unsurprising. So, recording on a machine that honours SCMS (the MD-350): - Tracks with the track recorded as Permit can be copied digitally without generational limit (well at least 3 times) -> the Permit propagates down the generations. - Tracks recorded as Inhibit cannot be copied. In addition a track dubbed digitally from a CD cannot be copied (using a Tascam MD-CD1 Mk1 at least). - Tracks recorded as PreRec can be copied once only. Hope that clears it up. Kevin

You could be right. What this means is you're going to make me go back into the shed in the rain and get out a bunch of MD machines and find out...

No worries! Not exactly a masterpiece - much better examples seen on this forum! As you say over on TH, is there an MDS-E10 and a MDS-E10 PRO? I'm pretty sure my original-still-not-working-no-I-dont-want-to-talk-about-it E10 just says "MDS-E10" on the display when it starts, i.e. not "MDS-E10 PRO" like in the video above. It won't initialise far enough that I could get into the menu system to look. Maybe the chap on TH has a "non-PRO" and this doesn't have the menu item. Maybe that is a conundrum we can resolve soon, so please report back on what happens over on TH! ETA 04/Sep/21: Indeed there does seem to be a difference - machines that don't say "PRO" on the startup screen don't seem to have the Copy Bit menu item in Setup (regardless of the resistor settings shown in the SM Supplement for SCMS). However it's possible, but not proven yet, that they ignore SCMS (possibly dependent on those resistor settings in the SM Supplement) but just can't be configured for the Copy Bit setting to write to the disc.