SonicStage 3.3 is "Buggy."

[bergmarmot]

I downloaded and installed the new SonicStage 3.3, but that was a mistake. The program is too buggy, SS3.2 was in my opinion much more stable. The "Auto" transfer to my NW-HD3 contineously hangs when I try to synchronize the player with my playlist. I don't need that dynamic playlist because I want to choose myself which music should be transferred to my player.

As I write now this message the SS 3.2 transferres 136 songs smoothly what SS 3.3 was not able to do. If I stop this transfer now and then re-initiate then it will continue synchronizing my player with the playlist!! Impossible with 3.3, because the program hangs itself and can only be stopped via the task manager.

How are your experiences witht the new version of SS?

[Richard]

As regards the interface to my Hi-MD units, everything is great. I don't have an HDD players to offer an opinion. Maybe you should post at our sister forum AtracLife to maybe gauge other experiences.

[banjo]

I have experienced a different problem with 3.3.

I have been importing CDs in WAV format and transferring them to HiMD with conversion to 352kbs.

I found that the start of the first track on the HiMD starts with a clip, one or two seconds duration, of some track that I haven't identified, before recommencing with the real first track!

I found the same result with 5 different attempts with a mix of CDs.

I deleted the WAV file in SS3.3 and I found that the corruption is also in the converted file as stored on hard disk. It seems, therefore, that the corruption is introduced by the SS3.3 ratherthan by the recorded.

If I delete the first track from the SS3.3 library and re-import this first track it imports and transfers correctly.

Anybody else experience anything similar? It could be my 'environment' but I don't think so at this stage - I have not had any problem with CD import with SS3.2 or with any other application.

[whynot]

I have experienced a different problem with 3.3.

I have been importing CDs in WAV format and transferring them to HiMD with conversion to 352kbs.

I found that the start of the first track on the HiMD starts with a clip, one or two seconds duration, of some track that I haven't identified, before recommencing with the real first track!

I found the same result with 5 different attempts with a mix of CDs.

I deleted the WAV file in SS3.3 and I found that the corruption is also in the converted file as stored on hard disk. It seems, therefore, that the corruption is introduced by the SS3.3 ratherthan by the recorded.

If I delete the first track from the SS3.3 library and re-import this first track it imports and transfers correctly.

Anybody else experience anything similar? It could be my 'environment' but I don't think so at this stage - I have not had any problem with CD import with SS3.2 or with any other application.

YES! I experience this also. It's sound from the same track about a minute into the track playing for about a second, then the track commences normally. I've had this with 3 CDs. I don't hear the artifact when playing it back from SS3.3 on the HD, just the MD. I have to re-import the CD & re-transfer it to MD. I too am importing at 1411kbps & burning to MD at 352kbps.

Here's my PC info:

Dell Inspiron 8200

Windows XP SP1

Intel Pentium 4-M 2.2GHz

512MB RAM

Nothing else was running.

Here's my SS info:

SonicStage : 3.3.03.10270

SonicStage Add-on for Personal Audio Download : 3.3.00.09270

OpenMG Secure Module : 4.3.00.08302

MagicGate Memory Stick Device : 4.3.00.08302

NW-E2, NW-E3, NW-E5 and NW-E8P : 4.3.00.08302

OpenMG CD : 4.3.00.08302

M.S. PRO : 4.3.00.08302

CD Walkman : 4.3.00.08302

Hi-MD : 4.3.00.08302

Music Clip, NW-S4, NW-E7 and NW-E10 : 4.3.00.08302

HDWM : 4.3.00.08302

Net MD : 4.3.00.08302

EMD Plug-in: 1.2.0.9

CD-R Writing Module(Audio CD/ATRAC CD/MP3 CD) : 3.3.00.09270

Px Engine: 2.4.35.500

[dex Otaku]

I ran some tests to check out 352kbps, importing WAV directly from CD just as you did, and on 6 tracks from 6 different CDs, did not experience this issue. I also ripped the same 2 tracks >10 times to different bitrates and had no problems there.

[whynot]

I imported 30 CDs B4 noticing this. The same tracks with the artifacts will convert to MD OK at all the other bitrates. What's odd is re-importing the CD clears the problem. But U don't know it exists until you listen to every track on the MD. It doesn't just happen with the 1st track of a CD either.

[bergmarmot]

So as far as I understand nobody has faced the same problems with SS3.3 as me. I am wundering whether this has to do with my computer configuration/installed software and my NW-HD3 or that nobody has tried the "Auto" mode in SS. But as always, in new software old bugs are solved but brings new features and new bugs. So, sometimes it's better to stuck to an older version if this is fulfilling your needs and works. They say, never change a good working system....

Edited November 21, 2005 by Bergmarmot

[chomprock]

upgrading from version 2.x, it's even worse. i've been using it for less than an hour, and it's crashed three times (all while importing and deleting from my library.) i can't group together compilation albums (multiple artists on one album. they all register as albums for each artist with a single track), most of the features are not intuitive (selecting folders to import, for instance), when you queue two albums to transfer and the first isn't converted, it will convert and transfer the first, rather than transfer the second while converting the first, etc., etc., etc....

for how much i like my md, sonicstage has to be the single worst part of it. no wonder it's had limited mainstream success. does sony beta-test the software? is it designed with the help of testers, or is it solely a team of engineers? god, it's so incredibly frustrating....

[Mortal_Takeda]

I also found another bug in SS3.3. It won't let you delete more than 1 file from you MD at the same time. So I have to delete one file at a time. I've never had this problem with version 3.2.

[greenshank]

I imported 30 CDs B4 noticing this. The same tracks with the artifacts will convert to MD OK at all the other bitrates. What's odd is re-importing the CD clears the problem. But U don't know it exists until you listen to every track on the MD. It doesn't just happen with the 1st track of a CD either.

I got hit by this with my very first uploading attempts, and re-importing fixed it. In fact I was using Windows Media Player, not SS, to upload, but I have read that trying to use your computer for anything else at the same time can introduce glitches into the uploaded track. Since then I've made quite sure that the uploader has the entire computer at its disposal, and no problems.

Just a thought.

[Richard]

I also found another bug in SS3.3. It won't let you delete more than 1 file from you MD at the same time. So I have to delete one file at a time. I've never had this problem with version 3.2.

I am using 3.3 and can't say that I've had this problem. Does it happen if you delete multiple individual tracks / multiple groups / non-contiguous tracks?

[dex Otaku]

I got hit by this with my very first uploading attempts, and re-importing fixed it. In fact I was using Windows Media Player, not SS, to upload, but I have read that trying to use your computer for anything else at the same time can introduce glitches into the uploaded track. Since then I've made quite sure that the uploader has the entire computer at its disposal, and no problems.

This is just a niggling point, but it is confusing for everyone at the best of times:

In terms of HiMD:

* UPloading is transferring tracks FROM the unit TO your computer

* DOWNloading is transferring tracks TO your unit FROM your computer

Why Sony chose to make this terminology the reverse of what virtually anyone with any tech savvy would call it is beyond me, but these are the terms as used by Sony, Sony's software, our manuals, &c.

Sorry greenshank, not meaning to pick on you - just wanting to note that this makes all our language accidentally unclear attimes.

[greenshank]

This is just a niggling point, but it is confusing for everyone at the best of times:

In terms of HiMD:

* UPloading is transferring tracks FROM the unit TO your computer

* DOWNloading is transferring tracks TO your unit FROM your computer

Why Sony chose to make this terminology the reverse of what virtually anyone with any tech savvy would call it is beyond me, but these are the terms as used by Sony, Sony's software, our manuals, &c.

Sorry greenshank, not meaning to pick on you - just wanting to note that this makes all our language accidentally unclear attimes.

Er, no, I don't feel picked on, but I agree with the above definition (although it's not clear to me whether you mean that is Sony's definition or the opposite thereof). I use uploading to mean to the computer, from whatever source, and in this case I meant from the CD to the computer. I think that's consistent with general use (and I consider myself not entirely lacking in tech savvy).

I hope that hasn't added to the confusion!

Additional: this means that I suppose copying direct from CD to MD is, er, side-loading!

Edited November 25, 2005 by greenshank

[dex Otaku]

Ah .. hmm. I guess what confused me was the line "I was using WiMP to upload" .. because my brain is stuck in Hi-MD mode [good god, I'd better not do any editing..] and Hi-MD can neither be transferred to or from using anything but SS and Simple Burner.

As for the semantic issue, in what I would call "classical terms", uploading and downloading in computer terms .. uploading is when you put a file somewhere, and downloading when you receive a file from somewhere. Most portable storage devices I tend to think in terms of something I would upload to [put things on], and download from [take things from], since the device is the "other end" and my computer is "here".

Sony's terminology reverses the roles of that context - the computer is "there" and the device is 'here" .. which isn't actually nonsensical, especially if you think in terms of the computer being the "client" end [running Sony's client software for your device], but for my old-school thinking it still seems backwards.

[whynot]

I got hit by this with my very first uploading attempts, and re-importing fixed it. In fact I was using Windows Media Player, not SS, to upload, but I have read that trying to use your computer for anything else at the same time can introduce glitches into the uploaded track. Since then I've made quite sure that the uploader has the entire computer at its disposal, and no problems.

Just a thought.

OK. I think I was playing Solitaire when importing. I'll give it another try with absolutely, positively nothing happening this time. Sigh. Thanks. Based on the fact only 2 of us B4 your reply experienced this. I was beginning 2 think it was my CD player/burner flaking out, but giving no indication. Still is dubious in nature.

Why would SS be mucking with the music if it's importing it uncompressed, 1411kbps. It should be laying it down as is on the hard drive. Anyway, thanks again 4 the thought/suggestion.

[Syrius]

I also found another bug in SS3.3. It won't let you delete more than 1 file from you MD at the same time. So I have to delete one file at a time. I've never had this problem with version 3.2.

Hold CTRL while you click on each file, then hit the little X at the bottom after highlighting all the tracks you want to delete.

[Richard]

Hold CTRL while you click on each file, then hit the little X at the bottom after highlighting all the tracks you want to delete.

Or just press the "Delete" key on your keyboard

[greenshank]

As for the semantic issue, in what I would call "classical terms", uploading and downloading in computer terms .. uploading is when you put a file somewhere, and downloading when you receive a file from somewhere. Most portable storage devices I tend to think in terms of something I would upload to [put things on], and download from [take things from], since the device is the "other end" and my computer is "here".

Perhaps if we simply talked about "copying" rather than uploading/downloading then we wouldn't get confused.

And if it were all drag'n'drop then we probably would call it copying.

As if it mattered that much. I think we all know what we're talking about!

[greenmachine]

Amen to that.

[whynot]

Here's how 2 recreate the artifacts.

1. Import some CDs @1411kbps into MyLibrary.

2. Select some albums to transfer to Hi-MD @ 352kbps.

3. When you see a song "Converting x%" hit the "stop transferring" button.

4. When SS is finished stopping. Delete the whole album you were transferring from the Hi-MD disk.

5. Transfer that album again to Hi-MD. Let it finish.

6. Listen for the artifact at the beginning of the song you stopped transferring in the middle of being converted in step 3.

I can do this everytime now. Oh yeah.

[Richard]

Here's how 2 recreate the artifacts.

1. Import some CDs @1411kbps into MyLibrary.

2. Select some albums to transfer to Hi-MD @ 352kbps.

3. When you see a song "Converting x%" hit the "stop transferring" button.

4. When SS is finished stopping. Delete the whole album you were transferring from the Hi-MD disk.

5. Transfer that album again to Hi-MD. Let it finish.

6. Listen for the artifact at the beginning of the song you stopped transferring in the middle of being converted in step 3.

I can do this everytime now. Oh yeah.

What if you convert them to 352 before and then transfer "as-is" instead of converting as part of the transfer?

[whynot]

What if you convert them to 352 before and then transfer "as-is" instead of converting as part of the transfer?

That would be a workaround, not a fix.

But U can't import a CD @ 352kbps, only 320. What's with that?

To use 352, U must submit to the conversion step as you're burning the Hi-MD.

[Richard]

That would be a workaround, not a fix.

But U can't import a CD @ 352kbps, only 320. What's with that?

To use 352, U must submit to the conversion step as you're burning the Hi-MD.

No import to WAV. Use the "Convert Format" option to convert to 352, then transfer "as-is". This would be a workaround yes, but I'm curious to the end result.

Edit: I just tried this method and didn't encounter any issues.

I imported a CD to WAV. This CD contains one hour of continuous music, but split into mulitple tracks so it needs to be gapless.

Used the Convert Format to convert to 352.

Deleted the WAV files.

Transferred as-is.

No playback issues / artefacts on the playback of these tracks and all tracks segue perfectly (ie. gapless is maintained).

I don't know if this would be a workaround for you? I haven't yet tried your method of converting on the fly.

Edited November 26, 2005 by richyhu

[whynot]

No import to WAV. Use the "Convert Format" option to convert to 352, then transfer "as-is". This would be a workaround yes, but I'm curious to the end result.

Edit: I just tried this method and didn't encounter any issues.

I imported a CD to WAV. This CD contains one hour of continuous music, but split into mulitple tracks so it needs to be gapless.

Used the Convert Format to convert to 352.

Deleted the WAV files.

Transferred as-is.

No playback issues / artefacts on the playback of these tracks and all tracks segue perfectly (ie. gapless is maintained).

I don't know if this would be a workaround for you? I haven't yet tried your method of converting on the fly.

I wouldn't bother doing all that normally, because U have 2 do it track by track.

Anyway, just 4 giggles:

1. I selected all the tracks manually for an album, & used "Tools" -> "MyLibrary" -> "Convert Format".

2. Then cancelled the process in the middle of a song.

3. Restarted the whole process again for all the songs.

I repeated multiple times on different songs.

The same artifact bug appeared 4 every song the convert was in process.

Not surprising since they're probably using the same module.

I surmise your approach works if the convert process is uninterrupted.

Then you can probably interrupt burning the Hi-MD as often as U wish.

Still a bug though. So when can we expect SS3.4? Or should that be another thread?

[Mortal_Takeda]

I am using 3.3 and can't say that I've had this problem. Does it happen if you delete multiple individual tracks / multiple groups / non-contiguous tracks?

It happens when I try to delete multiple individual tracks. So first I hold CTRL while I click on each file, then press the Del key (or the X button), and then after I confirm the task, all the selected files disappear from the list, but after SS has refreshed the list, the files are still present. But sometimes it work when I try it a second time.

[Richard]

It happens when I try to delete multiple individual tracks. So first I hold CTRL while I click on each file, then press the Del key (or the X button), and then after I confirm the task, all the selected files disappear from the list, but after SS has refreshed the list, the files are still present. But sometimes it work when I try it a second time.

Is the disc formatted as Hi-MD or NetMD?

[Mortal_Takeda]

Is the disc formatted as Hi-MD or NetMD?

As Hi-MD. So it should be fine right?

[pauljones52]

Yes I've noticed this, I've also noticed that if you transfer a CD to MD as one, the trackmarks are ~1/4 of a second before the trackmarks of the original CD. This doesnt occur if I transfer the CD to my MD 1 track at a time, odd!

[timonoj]

Ok, the same goes for me... But at 64kbps. I also noticed that artifact from what it seems to be another song. Just happened once, though. I think i preferred 3.2, is there any way to redownload it? Thanks!

[whynot]

Yes I've noticed this, I've also noticed that if you transfer a CD to MD as one, the trackmarks are ~1/4 of a second before the trackmarks of the original CD. This doesnt occur if I transfer the CD to my MD 1 track at a time, odd!

So too have I. Annoying, isn't it.