CNET Reviews NW-S705f

[navsimpson]

http://reviews.cnet.com/mp3-players/sony-n...ag=nefdprod.rev

[ceres]

http://reviews.cnet.com/mp3-players/sony-n...ag=nefdprod.rev

Realistic review from cnet this time around. sound quality is in deed stellar and design top-notch, best of the industry. unfortunately with the latest gen. of flash players transfer rates are effectively halved and along with badly designed SS a mark of 7.7 is appropriate. of course, ipod nano at 8.3 is ridiculous.

[Shinji Ikeda]

Realistic review from cnet this time around. sound quality is in deed stellar and design top-notch, best of the industry. unfortunately with the latest gen. of flash players transfer rates are effectively halved and along with badly designed SS a mark of 7.7 is appropriate. of course, ipod nano at 8.3 is ridiculous.

I should really try iTunes to see what all the accolades are for. I however have tested the iPod nano, and would agree with ceres on the rating of the NW-S705F compared to the iPod nano.

Unfortunately, for CNET they do not know how SonicStage works and biased. "Sony (not surprisingly[sic]) uses a proprietary method for storing and organizing music on the player, preventing any kind of drag-and-drop music transfers." This is only half true and distorts how SonicStage really works. It is obvious that they did not review SonicStage, but more previewed it. Other than that issue CNET's review seem well balance, but I am just as leery about CNET's reviews.

[navsimpson]

While I think that SS is way better than it was, it's still subpar, especially when compared to iTunes. I don't think that CNET are being biased here - I think there's a solid case to be made that iTunes is more intuitive and better designed than Sonicstage. And Sonicstage is proprietary, isn't it? It's the only way you can get songs onto a Sony device, especially since the alternatives we know about here don't always work on new models. iTunes is also proprietary, but its universality makes that a bit of a moot point.

And I just noticed - 200 posts! Yay.

-Nav

[aob9]

Realistic review from cnet this time around. sound quality is in deed stellar and design top-notch, best of the industry. unfortunately with the latest gen. of flash players transfer rates are effectively halved and along with badly designed SS a mark of 7.7 is appropriate. of course, ipod nano at 8.3 is ridiculous.

8.3 for ipod nano........absolutely unbelievable. Also,Is there any way we can stop comparing everything with the ipod?

[Shinji Ikeda]

Unfortunately, CNET does not present any information on what are the discrepancies with SonicStage. Nor do they present any information on the advantages of using SonicStage. The reviewer presents the review as though they are being objective, but as stated above presents nothing to support this.

CNET states that the One of our favourite NW-S705F features is the Intelligent Shuffle control, which creates shuffled playlists tied to a common theme--such as the year the song was released, or a common genre. CNET fails to recognize that some of the Intelligent Shuffle features, such as My Favourite Shuffle and Artist Link Shuffle, are only available when using SonicStage. CNET assails SonicStage without realizing this fact.

It appears that CNET did not review the current version of SonicStage that was supplied with this player. I do not think SonicStage is the best software out there for its intended purpose. However, there are advantages to using SonicStage. Not presenting this information suggests that they are basing their judgement on a previous products, which is not objective but subjective.

The statement Sony uses a proprietary method for storing and organizing music on the player, preventing any kind of drag-and-drop music transfers. Is deceptively wrong. It is hard to understand what they are trying to say. They do not present the advantages of using different types of interfaces to transfer music to the player. SonicStage manages the music on your computer. What ever the format (WMA, ACC or MP3) that the music in does not require to be stored in ATRAC format.

Additionally, iTunes is the only way of getting music on the iPod (I may be incorrect about this fact). However, when CNET reviewed an iPod-nano they presented features about iTunes. For the review of the NW-S705F they present nothing, and seem to be rehashing a previous conclusion about SonicStage. This action is biased. The popularity of the product or anything is irrelevant when pressing an objective view. SonicStage may be disliked by many people, but assailing a product and not demonstrating that you reviewed it is as biased act. Straight and simple.

Biased means that you did not present an objective argument. With this review it leaves it up to the reader to decide what is bad about SonicStage. If you do not like a product and present an objective view I may not agree with you, but I will accept you argument. CNET did not do this. I like most reader, expect professional reviewers like CNET do the work that is required when reviewing a product. I have a more comprehensive knowledge of the software that the reviewer. This should not be the case, there is no excuses for this.

[ender325_]

Great point Shinji. I for one have been using SonicStage since version 3.2 and found it very easy to understand and manage. Even a little friend of mine (he's 13 years old) knew how to use it pretty quickly without me explaining to him how to use the program (he has the E005F). Both of my MP3 players still surprise me sound-wise (E507 and S705F) so I don't know what's the harsh treatment people have against Sony (maybe it's just the software). I remember when I was entering the digital music life and didn't know which MP3 player to buy. I saw people at my school with their iPods, but I saw its design and sound so flat, I knew there had to be a better DAP out there and after researching for months...I chose the Sony E507, no regrets since then.

I find this funny as about a year ago I went to a Gamestop nearby and the cashier was looking at my E507 since I entered the store -- he even asked what it was, what functions it has, where I bought it and how much it cost, everything -- he was amazed at the sound and design. Weeks later I went again to the store, saw him along with his E507 and so I asked him about SonicStage 3.3 or 4 by that time -- he said "Pretty straightforward". So yeah Shinji I agree with you, people are way too biased about SonicStage and Sony sometimes.

[aob9]

I am really pleased to see such good support for Sonicstage. I have been using SonicStage since V1.5 which was pretty awful but it is excellent music management software now. This is the key issue for me .....music management...'Drag and Drop' offers no facility to manage my music files. Personally, I don't like 'Drag and Drop' and hope that Sony have no intentions of going down that road as appears to be the case with the upcoming B-series of Walkmans.If this happens I am sure that the Atrac codec will be next to suffer and eventually Sonicstage will get the hammer.

I recently convinced a friend of mine to buy the NW-S705 for the NC properties alone. When I questioned him about Sonicstage he responded that it was nothing as bad as some of the reviews he read on the 'net. So, the whole point about reviewers trashing something before really testing it is a valid one.I am also certain that a lot of these reviewers actually own an ipod and are biased towards Apple before they even take the device ( and software) out of the box.

I still cannot believe that the ipod nano got 8.3.

[Damage]

To be fair, SonicStage has improved quite a bit since the days of NetMD and 128MB MagicGate Memory Stick days, where you were limited to 3 check ins our check outs or other bit of nonsense. However, compared to other jukebox programs (say MediaMonkey, for example), it still fails.

For instance, a jukebox program should be intelligent enough to compile compliation albums on its own based on ID3 tags. So, if you have an album by several artists under single album title, it should naturally import into a single album under album view. Unfortunately, SonicStage still fails at this common task (To be fair, it seems to take the approach of Artist->Album, which is more logical).

Using SonicStage is straightforward. However, managing tracks within SonicStage is an absolute chore vs. other managers, especially when it comes to multi 10s of gigs of music. Try putting those albums back together one by one manually and see if you don't curse SonicStage to kingdom come. Trust me, it's not pleasant.

However, the thing that drag and drop implies on most DAPs is the use of UMS file transfers (that is, able to import and export music without the aid of a jukebox program, WMP, iTunes, SonicStage, etc.). In that instance, all Sony players do fail at providing drag and drop capabilities. So does the iPod, though there are plenty of third party programs that does the database management to give users alternatives. Sony gears, to date, does not, new players notwithstanding.

So given that, it is absolutely right on CNet to dock points for this critical failure. But that is due course for most Sony gears.

Where it should count, sound quality, the CNet has got it right. The S703F sounds absolutely fabulous.

(note: I've recently gotten a S703F for $40+Tax at buy.com using google checkout. Jump on it.)

[Terence Kelly]

Well, I recently had to use Itunes to search for an old recording that I couldn't find on CONNECT. I didn't find it any more intuitive to use than SonicStage. The layout was cluttered between the music store and the library, making it harder to see what to do at a given moment. I found the track I was looking for and downloaded it to a laptop at work. Itunes balked at writing it to a CDRW. I had to reerase the RW in Windows. SS will do that for you. When a colleague took the laptop on a trip before I had made the CD I had to repurchase the track even though I registered another computer to my Itunes account. Connect allows you to redownload any music you have purchased to any computer on your account. I don't know what other advantages Itunes has, but based on my recent experience it's not some fabulous program leagues beyound SS. SS is clearly superiour in certain areas. SS's big problem seems to be it's random instablility on certain computers that Sony had never been able to solve. Once you have a stable installation, it works fine.

TK

[gotthat]

i have read some review from australia site, it was about a different walkman, same thing basically they just wanted to review NW-A800, but it turned out to be a pure comparison bewteen A800 and ipod family. The result is on many features the review said that yes A800 beats ipod nano, but on those features the review also pulled out ipod 30GB player to further compare with NW-A800, so either way the review made ipod a better choice over NW-A800....so they needed to pull the whole ipod family out to have a go at NW-A800, conclusion of course they suggested people probably will go for ipod not NW-A800.....

[pata2001]

When a colleague took the laptop on a trip before I had made the CD I had to repurchase the track even though I registered another computer to my Itunes account. Connect allows you to redownload any music you have purchased to any computer on your account. I don't know what other advantages Itunes has, but based on my recent experience it's not some fabulous program leagues beyound SS.

1. You can upload iTunes purchased tracks from your iPod to the newly registered laptop.

2. Sony has to allow re-downloading tracks (which actually never works for me since it doesn't actually add the number of transfer permission) because backing up your purchased music is painfully a hit and miss. With iTMS tracks, you can just backup the songs normally (normal copy is fine), and authentication will be handled when you log-in to the service.

iTunes is universal (1 installation for all regions), unicode, and gapless capable on MP3 and AAC tracks. Sonicstage is not. I think iTunes is still better than any other jukebox software mainly because of its Smart Playlist feature and built-in podcast management. Of course, it's even better if you're on a Mac since it integrates with iLife apps.

The S70x series just shows again and again, Sony knows how to make great hardware, but not the software. Pretty much all reviews since the HD3 indicated around the same conclusion for Sony, good hardware, bad software, and yet Sony has yet to learn (remember the super buggy connect?). I mean, the S70x can play AAC gaplessly, but not the software? How stupid is that.

[ender325_]

2. Sony has to allow re-downloading tracks (which actually never works for me since it doesn't actually add the number of transfer permission) because backing up your purchased music is painfully a hit and miss. With iTMS tracks, you can just backup the songs normally (normal copy is fine), and authentication will be handled when you log-in to the service.

Re-download has always worked for me. I usually relocate all Connect songs to a custom folder to ease backup (and yes I backup them on an external hard drive and they still work when I transfer them over to my PC!). So everything's smoothly here...except that SonicStage should be configured to make the default music folders in let's say...My Music folder. So yeah there's still room for improvement, I agree with you on that.

[Terence Kelly]

1. You can upload iTunes purchased tracks from your iPod to the newly registered laptop.

2. Sony has to allow re-downloading tracks (which actually never works for me since it doesn't actually add the number of transfer permission) because backing up your purchased music is painfully a hit and miss. With iTMS tracks, you can just backup the songs normally (normal copy is fine), and authentication will be handled when you log-in to the service.

That would work well if I had an Ipod. As is, I had to buy the same track twice. Not a plus in my opinion. I've never experienced a problem with my Connect tracks unless there was a flaw in the SS installation on an upgrade. If you have to erase SS completely from your system, Connect thinks it's a different computer. That definitely messes with your authorization on Connect files.

TK

[Zizone_]

I just buy CDs and never have to deal with DRM and low kbps music files...