Hat Trick For MDCF? - Service Mode + 2nd Gen Hi-MD

[though]

i have a US version RH-910. i am able to customize the 5 band EQ and save the setting.

is there a volume cap on it? am i able to gain anything by trying to apply this "fix"?

[MDGB2]

Sony = "Bacca."

[bug80]

Does anyone know the reason behind the EQ restrictions on European models yet?

I haven't had any sleep this week thinking about it What was the person thinking who said "Hey, let's change that bits and switch off the ability to customize the EQ settings for our European friends. Those guys don't need that."

I don't get it

Edited April 30, 2005 by bug80

[Damage]

Does anyone know the reason behind the EQ restrictions on European models yet?

I haven't had any sleep this week thinking about it What was the person thinking who said "Hey, let's change that bits and switch off the ability to customize the EQ settings for our European friends. Those guys don't need that."

I don't get it 

←

EDIT: To bring this post back to topic, the Entry code and what not works the same as RH910 as RH10. The language support works for RH910, provided that you have a "K" remote (the RH910 has a chunky LCD, so it doesn't look as if it'll display Japanese or Asian fonts properly.

As far as my understanding goes, it's a EU/France restriction deal, where portable units with their default headphones can not exceed a certain decibal level (103dB/SPL was the figure thrown out). Actually, it's a France Restriction, but them being one of the founding members of the EU, the restrictions supposedly applies to all of Europe, not just France. So, in order to comply, Sony has to restrict output, by volume capping, limiting EQ, etc.

Not sure how kosher that theory is. But in order to cost save, altering firmware could probably be the cheapest way to achieve this (uniform packaging, accessories, etc.). Likewise, Sony could use crummier headphones to conform with the law as well, and that'd sound like a better option, one'd think.

Moral of the Story: Blame the French!

[mcca6392]

yeah, i have tried the mp3 that u posted on this thread. it's not working on my RH-910. i've found from a forum, they said asian version doesn't support DIRECT-MP3, so mine is asian version.

so anyone with RH-10 or RH-910 please compare your firmware code with mine, any different please let me know thanks.

←

Oh bleep. I just ordered my Japanese-spec RH10 the otherday. I really hope that's not the case - but if it is, oh well; if I'm using Sonicstage to get those MP3s into the HiMD, I guess I may as well ATRAC them while I'm at it .....

[Christopher]

This claim by erictoh84 is false - he is probably having problems with some mp3's.

[pichu64]

is it possible to have the volume restriction on a canadian RH10? I would like to try it to test if there is less noise.

[erictioh84]

This claim by erictoh84 is false - he is probably having problems with some mp3's.

←

no.. whatever mp3s i have tested on my MD doesn't work. i have 4000 mp3s on my HDD, no one is working, and i've tried to encode a mp3 file using some program from CD, it didn't work also.

[schnitt]

Does anyone know the reason behind the EQ restrictions on European models yet?

I haven't had any sleep this week thinking about it What was the person thinking who said "Hey, let's change that bits and switch off the ability to customize the EQ settings for our European friends. Those guys don't need that."

I don't get it 

←

after I recive my RH10 (euro) Iam written a badly e-mail to our sony support in germany - where I ask about this silly things!

they give me (a week later) the answer, those things are only "EU-Norms" so sony can't infiltrate those Laws! in this way I belive this... the EU have even more stupid laws!

Edited May 1, 2005 by schnitt

[llywelynbren]

Does anyone know the reason behind the EQ restrictions on European models yet?

I haven't had any sleep this week thinking about it What was the person thinking who said "Hey, let's change that bits and switch off the ability to customize the EQ settings for our European friends. Those guys don't need that."

I don't get it 

←

Presumably because a Graphic EQ also acts as a volume control, and pushing all the sliders to the max would be too much for our delicate European ears.

The theory about it being a France restriction is probably correct, though. At concert venues in Paris they have volume restrictors, so that power cuts off if it's too loud!

[MDfreak]

Presumably because a Graphic EQ also acts as a volume control, and pushing all the sliders to the max would be too much for our delicate European ears.

The theory about it being a France restriction is probably correct, though.  At concert venues in Paris they have volume restrictors, so that power cuts off if it's too loud!

←

I heard too that it is French legislation that limits the volume output so why doesn't Sony only limit French models? Why does the whole of Europe have to suffer from it?

[jadeclaw]

I'm wondering myself here.

In the EU, if a product can be legally sold in one country inside the EU, it can be sold in ALL EU countries, regardless if the specifications violate the rules in one or more countries.

One Example: Scanner receivers had been prohibited here in Germany, but the sale was legal in Holland and the UK.

And because of the EU trade laws, Germany had to allow the sale as well.

And with the same trade laws, the french regulation could be nullified.

Including ultra low efficiency earbuds would have been an alternative...

[kudlaty]

I'm wondering myself here.

In the EU, if a product can be legally sold in one country inside the EU, it can be sold in ALL EU countries, regardless if the specifications violate the rules in one or more countries.

One Example: Scanner receivers had been prohibited here in Germany, but the sale was legal in Holland and the UK.

And because of the EU trade laws, Germany had to allow the sale as well.

And with the same trade laws, the french regulation could be nullified.

Including ultra low efficiency earbuds would have been an alternative...

←

Hmm, you're right, however I'm not sure, that this is French law only. It may be EU's law eventually.

[bug80]

Presumably because a Graphic EQ also acts as a volume control, and pushing all the sliders to the max would be too much for our delicate European ears.

←

I thought too this could be the reason. However, it's very strange older EU-limited models like my 510 do have an output limit, but still have customizable EQ. Maybe Sony got a warning from the EU that users can get above the limit by pushing the EQ up or something.

EDIT:

Now that I think of it, the 2nd generation units have a slightly higher output (2x2.8mW) than my older unit (2x2.5mW). Maybe Sony choose to increase the output at the expense of the customizable EQ?

Edited May 2, 2005 by bug80

[MDGB2]

I don't think I'll buy a new unit until something is done about this. Maybe a special 'UK version' - they do it with Hi-Fi decks. Take off all the nappy-wearing, big girl's blouse restrictions Sony, and watch your sales soar!

Bloody Cheese Eating Surrender Monkeys.....

Appoligies to anyone reading this who is French...

[KJ_Palmer]

Does anyone know if this hack gives the RH10 or 910 a "line out" mode (through the menu)? If so I might consider one if/when funds allow...

Thanks in advance...

[Woodbar]

First of thanks to everyone for all the information and of course the hack for the RH10.

Last night I was just about to repack my RH10 for return to the retailer - having found the final insult from Sony regarding the missing letters/symbols in the titling pages! Having already discovered that, contrary to most websites description of the unit it:-

1)Does NOT have a graphic equaliser (presets are not Graphic Equalisers even if you do show a pretty picture of where the sliders are)

2)Disc Memory is pretty useless as it only saves the "Custom" equaliser settings - which it did not have

3)Does not have a pitch control - never used it on the NH900 anyway - so no worries there really

4)Does NOT have a built in alarm function or Date/Time Stamping

5)Does NOT have Virtual Surround Sound - sounded grim on the NH900 - so no loss I think

6)Does NOT have a Line out facility

7)Comes with a "new style" remote - yeh - cheap, tacky and no LCD!

Anyway I have applied the "destination" hack and voila - I have Custom 1 & 2 equaliser settings, all the letters of the alphabet are available on the titling tables and presumably I have the full 5mW output at the phone socket - I only generally use upto about 50% volume as the Sen PX100s are fairly efficient.

I was so eager to carry out the adjustment that I forgot to note the actual setting for the EU destination - perhaps someone could oblige - just in case the unit has to go back to Sony.

Just a thought - as the Japanese versions come with the full remote and all the facilities enabled - would setting my unit to Japan, with English language, be possible and if so what extra facilities (if any) would I get - DTS would be good?

Finally, one last thing I have noted - I generally record my music in Hi-SP direct from CDs via Simple Burner - before I did the hack I could edit the song titles and artists etc on the RH10 itself - that's how I discovered the "missing letters" syndrome - now it will not let me do this - saying "Cannot Edit" - in fact the only thing I can change is the Disc title - has anyone else noticed this - is there a reason?

Thanks again to everyone - I am now happier with my purchase - Sony take note - perhaps you might listen to your customers one day - no, sorry I forgot that would take a miracle.

(Anyone interested in a mint MZ-NH900?)

[schnitt]

Does anyone know if this hack gives the RH10 or 910 a "line out" mode (through the menu)? If so I might consider one if/when funds allow...

Thanks in advance...

←

where is no problem. you don't need the lineout after hacking.

the RH10 is now loud enough. lineout is only a mode, to bring the MD

in the "loudest" position without any EQ (btw.!)

this can be done by ourself!

[bug80]

[..]

←

Don't forget that the price of the unit compared to the 1st generation is much lower because of the missing features.

Am I actually defending Sony? What's happening?

[Woodgnome]

Hack works a treat - now the RH10 sounds as good as it can!

Thanks for the information

[Woodbar]

Don't forget that the price of the unit compared to the 1st generation is much lower because of the missing features.

Am I actually defending Sony? What's happening?

←

Well I think Sony are big, rich and arrogant enough not to need your defense!

........ just remembered another addition to the list of things all the sites tell you it has - HD Digital amp - which of course it hasn't.

The RH10 certainly has a slightly different sound balance than the NH900 but I can''t say I prefer one over the other - my old MZ-R35 sounds totally different and in many ways "better" than both newer models!

[erictioh84]

how do u all judge the sound quality between RH-910 and NH-900? same ? one better than the other?

[Libelula]

Thank you for the hack! It's great that someone takes the time to outsmart these stupid useless legislative issues. *G* (the french seem to need a lot of time to adjust to new things don't they...take the education system for example: it makes you go completely nuts!)

But, how on earth did U come up with that sequence :ff,ff,rw,rw,etc ???

[Damage]

But, how on earth did U come up with that sequence :ff,ff,rw,rw,etc ???

←

I'd wager from the service manual. ;-)

On a more amusing note, it is a variation on one of the more famous secret codes. Something about thirty men backup?

[erictioh84]

any one can give me the complete service manual for RH-10??

[Christopher]

We will distribute all of the service manuals for first and second generation within 2 weeks to a month.

[erictioh84]

wah, nice nice.. i'm waiting for that...

[Taaronk]

UGGGGG!!!!

Well, this thread spurred me to try this with my NH900. I'm in America, but I bought mine from England (got a hellava good deal) so I figured this would be a good trick. I've done it successfully before on previous units and was successful on mine. Unfortunatley, I decided I couldn't tell a difference, so I decided to switch it back. Again, no problem. Well, as the old saying goes, 3rd times a charm, and I decided to go try some of the other values out to see if my ears liked them better. In the process, I couldn't get into service mode and, in frustration, i spun the jog dial willinilli. Unfortunatley, I had entered service mode, unbenonced to myself and the spinning of the jog dial created some....errors. Now my values are all jakked up . I was dispondant at first. So, after combing through the archives and finding a comprehensive list of values for the unit in question, I began the quest to undo my impatiants. I gave up and sent it back to sony (its still under warrenty). Anyone know if they can or do check that kind of thing? Hopfully it'll be a nice hassle free repair/exchange......ahhahahahahahahaha. From Sony, yeah right. Anyway, just a point and lesson to anyone who deides to do this == it is very simple to do, just give yourself a good 5 seconds for your display to catch up with you and don't punch buttons in frustration.....this could end up being a costly lesson. I'll update you guys if Sony fixes it. If they don't, my premptive question is: Anyone wanna help me fix it

[Taaronk]

Update guys - Sony couldn't fix it and they are sending me a new one!

[Christopher]

Nice..please don't ever do that again.

[milomind]

First of thanks to everyone for all the information and of course the hack for the RH10.

Last night I was just about to repack my RH10 for return to the retailer - having found the final insult from Sony regarding the missing letters/symbols in the titling pages!  Having already discovered that, contrary to most websites description of the unit it:-

1)Does NOT have a graphic equaliser (presets are not Graphic Equalisers even if you do show a pretty picture of where the sliders are)

2)Disc Memory is pretty useless as it only saves the "Custom" equaliser settings - which it did not have

3)Does not have a pitch control - never used it on the NH900 anyway - so no worries there really

4)Does NOT have a built in alarm function or Date/Time Stamping

5)Does NOT have Virtual Surround Sound - sounded grim on the NH900 - so no loss I think

6)Does NOT have a Line out facility

7)Comes with a "new style" remote - yeh - cheap, tacky and no LCD!

Anyway I have applied the "destination" hack and voila - I have Custom 1 & 2 equaliser settings,  all the letters of the alphabet are available on the titling tables and presumably I have the full 5mW output at the phone socket - I only generally use upto about 50% volume as the Sen PX100s are fairly efficient.

I was so eager to carry out the adjustment that I forgot to note the actual setting for the EU destination - perhaps someone could oblige - just in case the unit has to go back to Sony.

Just a thought - as the Japanese versions come with the full remote and all the facilities enabled - would setting my unit to Japan, with English language, be possible and if so what extra facilities (if any) would I get - DTS would be good?

Finally, one last thing I have noted - I generally record my music in Hi-SP direct from CDs via Simple Burner - before I did the hack I could edit the song titles and artists etc on the RH10 itself - that's how I discovered the "missing letters" syndrome - now it will not let me do this - saying "Cannot Edit" - in fact the only thing I can change is the Disc title - has anyone else noticed this - is there a reason?

Thanks again to everyone - I am now happier with my purchase - Sony take note - perhaps you might listen to your customers one day - no, sorry I forgot that would take a miracle.

(Anyone interested in a mint MZ-NH900?)

←

I found the same to be true after the hack. Follow the instructions in getting to service mode. Change the value from 24 to 21 to gain edit functions. The alphabet problem is there in that config though, but at least you can edit. 21 is US/Can setting.

Also, I did notice that although my unit plays mp3's for the most part just fine, it does not want to play any below 48kb unless I convert them either to ATRAC3+ or to a higher mp3 bitrate. These mp3's are from Leo Laporte from his radio show, and I know he is using a high quality encoder. It's just the low ones that have that problem. It did that in every country code setting by the way.

Edited May 7, 2005 by milomind

[Damage]

For reference:

RH910's 113 (Aka "Regional Code") for US is 20, not 21. That maybe the same for RH10 as well, since changing the RH's 113 has similar effects (A0 puts it in Euromode, 24 Japanese with no editing mode).

I also suspect the 114 bit has to be changed in conjunction. For reference, the 114 on RH910 is 80.

[Christopher]

Damage is 100% correct. Additionally, all values for 114 should be 80 in any region setting. Do not tamper with it unless it is not 80.

[milomind]

Do you know of any way around the alphabet problem other than "24" that would allow editing yet. I do a lot of field recordings and do like to title edit on the fly. It would be greatly appreciated. Thank You.

[Terandrei]

.) Press the 'Vol +'/'Vol -'key and set the value that is after "DistFL", or if you don't see that, when you press 'Vol +'/'Vol -' a value will increase/decrease - change it to 24

In step 3 although there was no value DistFL I changed the last digits to 24.

Custom 1 and 2 appeared but no loudness unfortunately, what was more important for me. Can anyone help me with loudness?

I have eu model

Thanx in advance

Edited May 8, 2005 by Terandrei

[ciro]

In step 3 although there was no value DistFL I changed the last digits to 24.

Custom 1 and 2 appeared but no loudness unfortunately, what was more important for me. Can anyone help me with loudness?

I have eu model

Thanx in advance

←

After I set the value to 24 on my eu model, I didn't notice an improvement in the volume, either. An I'd love to crank it up.

And was 'Damage' right when he wrote that the original setting for the RH10 eu model was AO?

What about the other numbers before the last two digits? Why do they keep changing?

[scaffolderus]

Success! I have a couple of flash memory network walkmans but wanted something to play my collection of MDs. I bought the RH10 on recommendation and build quality but soon discovered the restrictions, lack of equaliser etc. The sound really sucks on the standard offerings. Was about to give the thing away when while on train to work this morning I was surfing the WAP on my mobile (sad or what?) and I came across this thread. Spent at least an hour trying to follow the instructions and, yes, trying to get the Distfl to register at 24 (tried toggling the menu button) is a right fiddle but, hey I got there. I now have two custom equalisers and increased volume. It's a different machine. What can I say, but thanks to Kurisu and friends. Magic or what?

[Christopher]

Wap is nice. I've been looking into getting a wap module for the forum for better functionality - I would suggest you may want to try surfing via the "Lo-fi Version" using the link at the top of the forum - the direct link is http://forums.minidisc.org/lofiversion/

Glad it worked for you! If it's not working for others, please carefully read the instructions - you're not doing something right. This isn't a homebrew hack or anything of that sort - straight from the service manual of the RH10.

[davidb]

Can I just recap re the destinaton codes for the RH10 to make sure I've understood the previous posts:

A0 is Europe. Output restricted to 2.8 mW, no custom equalisers, no missing characters, title editing allowed.

20 or 21* US/Canada. Full output plus equalisers. Missing characters. title editing allowed.

24 Asian African Australian Tourist. Full output plus equalisers. No missing characters. Title editing not allowed.

(* Seems to be some confusion about whether the US/Canada code is 20 or 21, or is it different on the RH910and RH10 ? Please could someone clarify.)

Is that correct?

Its great to see the service manual will soon be available - but will it be in English or Japanese?

I haven't yet got up the courage to try service mode on my RH10 (only just got it - European version). It would be nice if someone could post some pictures of the display when in service mode so I know what to expect.

[Steve_W]

(* Seems to be some confusion about whether the US/Canada code is 20 or 21, or is it different on the RH910and RH10 ? Please could someone clarify.)

I can verify that my US/Canada RH10 was initially set to 21 as purchased; I changed it to 24 to get the full alphabet for title entry.

By the way, regarding the lack of title editing using destination code 24, this code doesn't prevent you from entering titles for tracks you record from a live source, in case anyone was wondering. -Steve

Edited May 11, 2005 by Steve_W