Moon River

[Alexx]

Ever

[Christopher]

Who sings it?

[Ishiyoshi]

Originally composed by Henry Mancini and Johnny Mercer (lyrics). Made famous by Audrey Hepburn in "Breakfast at Tiffany's". If I remember correctly, Mancini and Mercer wrote the "Moon River" exclusively for Hepburn - just to fit the actress' limited vocal range.

[atrain]

it is a charming song. it's a bit of a standard for cabaret/lounge singers too.

[bobt]

If I recall right it was Andy Williams who sang it, even in the movie, it was lip synched.

[Alexx]

it was NOT lip synced.

its clearly Audry

[atrain]

he certain ly did sing it at one point but it was holly

[bobt]

Didn't mean to offend Alexx, just that I thought I remebered something from twenty or thirty years ago that said that they used Andy Williams voive for that segment because his sing voice closely matched Audrey's speaking voice. I could be wrong, has happened many times, ad I do agree it is a good song.

All the best

Bob

[Mr_Bass_Man]

Didn't mean to offend Alexx, just that I thought I remebered something from twenty or thirty years ago that said that they used Andy Williams voive for that segment because his sing voice closely matched Audrey's speaking voice. I could be wrong, has happened many times, ad I do agree it is a good song.

All the best

Bob

... I could never get my head round what "my huckleberry friend .... " was all about!!

[Ishiyoshi]

... I could never get my head round what "my huckleberry friend .... " was all about!!

Words can have opposite meanings. But for this context (Breakfast at Tiffany's), I believe "my huckleberry friend" means "my special friend" or "my champion".

[bland10000]

I believe "my huckleberry friend" means "my special friend" or "my champion".

Yep, an old term for what you said, Ishi. The last time I've seen it used was in an American western period movie called "Tombstone". Doc Holliday tells Wyatt Earp "I'll be your huckleberry".

[yamagatacamille]

Breakfast at Tiffany's is one of my favourite movies. and Audrey Hepburn singing "Moon River" was so enchanting. amazing talent, amazing song. whole-heartedly agree w/ you Alexx.

Edited December 18, 2005 by yamagatacamille

[Mr_Bass_Man]

Words can have opposite meanings. But for this context (Breakfast at Tiffany's), I believe "my huckleberry friend" means "my special friend" or "my champion".

Thanks for that - you learn something every day!!

It makes no sense in the context of English as spoken in here in England, isn't "culture" a wonderful thing!

Still I suppose it is poetry, rather than plain dialogue so the normal rules don't really apply.

I regard the Andy Williams version as the definitive recording. And a pretty decent song it is too ...

[Karl Myer]

Which river is Moon River?

"Wider than a mile" and "my Huckleberry friend" call to mind the Mississippi. But I didn't know the song was written for Breakfast At Tiffany's. That fact, and "you dreammaker, you heartbreaker" point to the Hudson, also wider than a mile. "I'm crossing you in style some day" is a big clue, introducing striving, desire, dreams of success.

"Whereever you're going I'm going your way" indicates a journey, and a passive journey. Same with "Two drifters off to see the world" (Huckleberry Finn and Jim floating down the Mississippi).

"We're after the same rainbow's end, waitin' round the bend ... ." The Mississippi winds but the Hudson does not. Huck and Jim float down the Mississippi River on a raft but the Hudson River is crossed -- "I'm crossing you in style someday."

The lyrics seem deliberately ambiguous but I don't think there are more than two choices. Personally, the song comes to mind whenever winding down the helix to the Lincoln Tunnel, a soundtrack for that incredible skyline a mile across the Hudson River. It's a New York song.

Edited March 16, 2007 by Karl Myer

[Number Four]

Have any of you seen "Bad Education" by Pedro Almodovar (Gael Garcia Bernal is the main actor in the film)? You won't be able to listen to that song in the same way ever again. If you've seen the movie, you'll know what I mean...

Scary!

[Karl Myer]

Moon river

Wider than a mile

I'm crossing you in style

Some day...

Old dream maker

You heart breaker

Wherever you're going

I'm going your way...

Two drifters

Off to see the world

There's such a lot of world

To see...

We're after the same rainbow's end

Waitin' round the bend

My Huckleberry friend

Moon River and me...

A letter from Audrey Hepburn to Henry Mancini after his score was added to the film:

Dear Henry,

I have just seen our picture - BREAKFAST AT TIFFANY'S - this time with your score. A movie without music is a little bit like an aeroplane without fuel. However beautifully the job is done, we are still on the ground and in a world of reality. Your music has lifted us all up and sent us soaring. Everything we cannot say with words or show with action you have expressed for us. You have done this with so much imagination, fun and beauty.

You are the hippest of cats - and the most sensitive of composers! Thank you, dear Hank.

Lots of love, Audrey

A photograph of the letter is here.

Edited March 14, 2007 by Karl Myer

[rayzray]

1st of all;; i (rayzray) WAS there ;;live and in person when that movie came out;; it was a GREAT movie;; the "Cat" got to me the most..

2nd;; i sang that song at weddings and lounges for 0ver 40 years;; never really knew what i was singing about;; but i would think about the times when i went to see the movie;; and that was enough emotion to get across to the patrons..

3rd;; but,, the meaning of that song "Blew-up" on me when i would sing it to this "Couple" that used to come in every WED and Sun night;; and ask for it..

turns out this "Couple" were TWO "Drifting" ppl staying up the street at a Catholic home for Problemed Priests and Nuns..

Yess; i (rayzray) single handedly sang this couple out of the Church with my LONG renditions of "Moon River"..

The song just don't make it for me anymore;; but,, one of my favorite vinyl albums (that i have) of all times is the one of Andy Williams sings his version of Moon River..

He does it the Best of all.. (Living Strings) does it good too..

interesting;; the rant about his voice being the same range as Audrey's speaking voice;; yes;; i had to drop it down MANY keys to be able to sing it.. Andy has i "High" voice..

Edited March 19, 2007 by rayzray

[Strungup]

I have a friend "Jackie Frost " on her first CD se is singing an old traditional " Shenendoah" and she just brings me straight to the melt , The emotion she puts into it brings the loneliness of that song right into your heart.

It is beautiful

http://pulleytunes.com/_wsn/page2.html

Edited March 19, 2007 by Guitarfxr

[Karl Myer]

The song just don't make it for me anymore; rayzray Posted Mar 18 2007, 09:03 PM

It surprises me the song's beauty faded for you, even after 40 years.

...brings the loneliness of that song {Oh Shenandoah} right into your heart. Guitarfxr Posted Mar 18 2007, 09:50 PM

Good comparison. It's that same haunting lonliness and wistfulness as Moon River, and also about two rivers, Shenandoah and Missouri. Edited March 21, 2007 by Karl Myer

[rayzray]

It surprises me the song's beauty faded for you, even after 40 years.

i never have been a lyric's guy;; i am ALL musician;; and chord progressions,, and harmony..

and,, i (rayzray) NEVER dwells in the past;; keeps me young..

i would rather "play' moon river on my keyboard and hook a Rap beat to it;; or some excentric beat..

what about M&M it;; like Moon River vs. Marylin Manson!!

[inovermyhead]

haha, I just learned this song for functional piano class. It is a great song!

[rayzray]

haha, I just learned this song for functional piano class. It is a great song!

the beauty of that song (written by johnny mercer and henry mancini);; is the constant use of "OFF TONES" as i call them as the melody..

that is;; the melody note a 4th up from the Tonic of the chord as a lead in melody note to many measures..

myself i could NEVER stand and tolerate some of the chords in that song and "Changed" them to more "Normal" chords,,

i HATED their use of a Bb9+5 (in key of C) instead of an "Fm"..

Edited March 29, 2007 by rayzray

[Karl Myer]

myself i could NEVER stand and tolerate some of the chords in that song and "Changed" them to more "Normal" chords,,

i HATED their use of a Bb9+5 (in key of C) instead of an "Fm"..

Rayzray, you have 40 years hands-on experience actually singing the song, in front of appreciative audiences, so I don't like to contradict, but to me those 9th-plus-5th chords are what express the longing, yearning, striving of the lyrics. Changing to a simple minor chord runs the risk of suggesting sadness only, or sadness in too great proportion. There is a wistful sadness in the song but it is a ("minor") component in a more complex emotion mainly hopeful.

Henry Mancini, also very experienced, crafted the chord exquisitely. It expresses the lyric as well as music can express words. I would recognize the emotion being expressed even if ignorant of the lyric, I always feel. If music were our only form of communication, I would know what you are saying to me just from that melody with those exact chords.

The layers of complexity in that chord are like the refining and honing of a blade that reaches in and touches the soul at the exact location triggering that emotion. I'm surprised an accomplished musician like yourself would deconstruct it. Changing to "Normal" chords might change it into a 'normal' song.

Edited March 30, 2007 by Karl Myer

[rayzray]

quick answer without showing "Quotes" again..

LOL,, yes you are right and your are wrong;; like;; if 1000 musicians/arrangers arranged Moon River;; you would get 1000 VERSIONS..

i rayzray would rather DE-compose the song;; and play/sing it back different EVERY time i play it..

the accomplished musicians around here never understood how i could keep jobs for a LONG time in clubs/lounges..

i NEVER played a song the same way each time..

now those 9th tones and 5th tones were only in the FIRST beat of many measures;; which i ADMIT "Makes" the sone;; and makes it beautiful..

but it's only the melody;; and i don't believe in making the orchestra dwell over a complex chord for too long..

complexing the songs would classify it as a "Jazz Arrangement" IMO;; and everytime i play jazz in a club;; i LOST my job;;

the mass of ppl can't take "Jazz" or complex music;; so un-complex it and "Feel it"..

i admit i am not a Jazz musician;; but would LOVE to be one for myself;; but never studies it that much as to become one in fear of "Staving" my family..

*i'm losing my train of thought;; or;; a am in the early stages of "Alzimers disease" ??SP??*

i mostly play in 4 piece bands,, trios duos and mucho as a solo with many synths..

an orchestral arrange can handle complex chords well;; buy moi (rayzray) cannot;; as i can't stand "Three Chord" songs also..

the myth about "minor" chords being sad it false;; i can ROCK on a minor chord for a long time;; well various extensions of that minor chord ;; maybe between the Harmonic,, Real Melodic and Natural to help a little!! but we keep it simple now..

i LOVE the Am (8th),, AM may7,, Am 6,, and Am 5 (D7 add9) progression;; it connotes confusion as to sadness or suduction.. or just a long synth solo up in the air..

i did say i sang for a living for over 42 years;; but i am not a great singer;;

so it was either the ability to pick the right song at the right time;; or my music ability that carried me;; my instrumental rants;; my wild solos;; and my jimi hendrix/yngvie Malm... mentality..

so,, we are both right;; depends on the audience;; but i would never subject myself to a hostile audience.. as i would never post in a hostile forum..

soo, you win..

late edit and PS]] i think in 1963 i either went to a movie or a high school dance in Allentown, PA;; but can't quite remember which one..

Edited March 30, 2007 by rayzray

[Karl Myer]

so,, we are both right;; depends on the audience;; but i would never subject myself to a hostile audience.. as i would never post in a hostile forum..

soo, you win..

Not at all, Ray. You, the performer, and Mr. Mancini the composer are the professionals and I defer to your judgments. I hope my tone wasn't hostile. I did not mean it that way. I apologize it came across like that. I was curious to know your reasons, and thank you for discussing at length.

I agree "the myth about minor chords being sad it false." (I did say "runs the risk" of "suggesting" sadness.) But there are no minor chords in the original, just because, I think, there is already that element of sadness in the wistful nature of the 9th-plus-5 chord. To overtly insert a minor chord risks the hopefulness of the lyrics.

Artistic license allows you to alter the song and I might very well be surprised, if I heard you perform, with new things your interpretations show me.

Edited March 30, 2007 by Karl Myer

[rayzray]

nice words;; anyhows..

you got me to sit down for an hour and play Moon River in many ways..

i played it with the chords in my "Fake Book";; the chords in another book;; and the chords in my own handwritten india inked manustcript..

Mancini IS a master;; but in the key of C;; i prefer the Dm6 in the place of that Bm7b5 before the E7th chord..

like the song is really a (( i,, ii,, iv,, V)) song with temporary keys (Harmonic MINOR)..

there is too much contrast between the simple and the complex;; so,, either make it ALL Complex or all simple;; and let the Melody or the Words prevail;; as when i hear that song;; i only think of my FIRST real steady girlfriend in High School or that "Wet" Cat in the Movie..

but,, i must admit;; i NEVER fooled around with the rhythm of that song;; i always kept it as a Waltz;; as opposed to when i changed Amazing Grace into a CHa CHa or a Reggae..

i do always "respect" Moon River and Mancini..

although i TEACH my piano/keyboard students to first learn the song the right way;; THEN;; rearrange it;; change it;; kill it;; better it;; and FEEL it..

i don't care what they do;; just change it;; even the instrumentation;; but it MUST convey a story or idea;; or an emotion or something like that..

oh,, thanks for getting me to play if for an hour..

Edited March 30, 2007 by rayzray

[Karl Myer]

Mancini IS a master;; but in the key of C;; i prefer the Dm6 in the place of that Bm7b5 before the E7th chord..

Did you notice they're the same chord? Their different root notes alter their character though-- I can see why you prefer one over the other. Both resolve nicely into that following E7. Edited March 30, 2007 by Karl Myer

[rayzray]

Did you notice they're the same chord? Their different root notes alter their character though-- I can see why you prefer one over the other. Both resolve nicely into that following E7.

yes,, i know that;; it's like each is a different inversion of the other;;but that Root difference makes the whole world of difference,, AND;; it is easy to omit the 6th on the Dm6 and just make it a simple Dm;; then inprovise with one of the ralated "Pentatonic" scale;; avoiding the minor-ish sound of the Harmonic Minor scale..

even an occational "Blues" scale in ther;; but it's been so long;; it was soo much FUN being a "one-Man-Band";; i could do anything i wanted;; mainly please the audience and hiding my real voice with rapid intrumental rants and ,, oh yeah;; my beloved "spring Reverbs";; Echo-Plex delay;; analog reverbs (noisy);; and Digital Reverbs;; and then all those great combinations;;

the Roland Vocalizer/Harmonizer was also a great escape;;

why didn't they invent MD's 20 years earlier??

oh,, late edit]] i utilize a 4 note version of the Pentatonic scale;; i leave out the 3rd note;; thus making it easier to improvise "Radically" like play different pentatonic scales over simple chords like G7 but playing a lightning run with various pentatonis with omitted 3rds..

Edited March 30, 2007 by rayzray

[Strungup]

It surprises me the song's beauty faded for you, even after 40 years.

Good comparison. It's that same haunting lonliness and wistfulness as Moon River, and also about two rivers, Shenandoah and Missouri.

Since your in PA , your not too awful far from Virginia, Jackie Frost is a local there in Richmond VA , Look up her schedule and see if you cant catch her live , it will be well worth the ride , I really enjoy her music , voice , and harmonies in the group

But you have to hear her do Shenendoah . a must .

[rayzray]

Since your in PA , your not too awful far from Virginia, Jackie Frost is a local there in Richmond VA , Look up her schedule and see if you cant catch her live , it will be well worth the ride , I really enjoy her music , voice , and harmonies in the group

But you have to hear her do Shenendoah . a must .

i (rayzray) will be in VA in and about the 20/21 of April;; (newport News); i will be visiting a T-Board/MCDF member with my wife (and my Hi-MD900)..

i will be asking about Jackie Frost;; *as i jot it down in my jot book*..

Edited April 10, 2007 by rayzray