Musicians defying contracts to join iTunes Japan

[Christopher]

From Strap, a good friend. Article cited from BusinessWeek:

Japanese musicians under contract with Sony and other labels that haven't joined Apple's iTunes Music Store are starting to defy their recording companies and trying to get their music on the popular download service launched last week in Japan. At least one artist has already gone against his label to offer his songs on iTunes. And a major agency that manages Japanese musicians said Wednesday it was interested in a possible deal with Apple Computer Inc., regardless of the recording companies' positions.

Online music stores had not taken off in Japan until iTune's arrival last Thursday, which opened with a million songs from 15 Japanese record labels.

In just four days, customers downloaded 1 million songs -- the fastest pace for the service's launch in any of the 20 nations it's become available, including the U.S. Most songs cost 150 yen (US$1.35; euro1) to download, and only 10 percent cost 200 yen (US$1.80; euro1.40).

But Sony Corp.'s music division has not signed up to join Apple's service. The two companies have emerged as major rivals in the portable music player business. Apple's iPod music player, which stores music on a hard drive, has hurt Sony, which its own Network Walkman, some of which have hard drives. Sony Music Entertainment and Apple say they're in talks but there's been no agreement. But wayward artists could just start averting the issue and opt to offer their music to iTunes. Rock musician Motoharu Sano, who has a recording contract with Sony, is making some of his songs available on iTunes, according to his official Web page.

"It is an individual's freedom where that person chooses to listen to music. I want to deliver my music wherever my listeners are," Sano was quoted as saying by Japan's top business daily Nihon Keizai Shimbun Wednesday.

Amuse Inc., an agent for some of Japan's most popular artists, is also thinking about joining iTunes. The company, which pushes musicians signed not only with Sony but also others, had initially decided against signing with iTunes.

"But we are considering joining in the future," Amuse spokeswoman Kyoko Ijichi said Wednesday. "We want to do what users want."

Eddy Cue, Apple vice president of applications, acknowledged earlier this week that more work is needed to sign additional record companies for the Japanese service. Tokyo-based recording company Victor Entertainment spokesman Yoshiaki Aoki said Wednesday talks are still continuing with Apple, but stressed he is interested in a deal. Still, iTunes' popularity in Japan has been stunning. The publicity campaign, including a rare personal appearance by Chief Executive Steve Jobs, has grabbed media attention here. Before iTunes' arrival, Japan's top music download service, which is backed by Sony and includes Sony recording artists, averaged about 450,000 downloads a month. By offering its service for lower prices, Apple is undercutting such online music services. Japanese are accustomed to paying twice as much as Apple is charging in Japan, which are still higher than the 99 cents charged in the U.S.

Apple has sold 21.8 million iPods worldwide since it went on sale in October 2001, and more than 500 million songs through its iTunes Music Store.

[MZ-NH1]

Ahahahah. Sucked in Sony?

I mean what can you do? Your in the business to sing, and therefore hope to make some money, and the easiest way to do that in Japn looks to go through the iTunes!

I wonder if Sony's Connect Store is any good?

[t0fler]

What would be really good is if sony and apple tried to work together. As in integrating ATRAC with the itunes software and the itunes store offering downloads in aac and atrac formats.

this however is not going to happen unless sony cedes the online music battle and agrees to play second fiddle to apple.

instead sony are probably going to fight this to the death and lose the standing they once had as music hardware innovaters, with the minidisc, atrac and anything associated with it going the way with Beta as better products that lost out to sonys incompetence.

i think that unless sony gives up soon and tries to make peace with apple, the only thing we will see in a few years are white headphones

[Syrius]

I guess that also the problem is that Sony thinks Atrac@ 132 is just as good as AAC @192 (which I think is what I-tunes uses).

Sony, start offering Hi-Sp downloads through Connect and kick Apple's arse, please.

[me]

I guess that also the problem is that Sony thinks Atrac@ 132 is just as good as AAC @192 (which I think is what I-tunes uses).

Sony, start offering Hi-Sp downloads through Connect and kick Apple's arse, please.

←

I thought iTunes used 128Kbps? Either way, all I have in NZ is "coke tunes" and that doesn't even work with my ipod. I don't think I'd pay for a .wma file either way though. I think the price is around NZ$1.80 a song. I don't know the quality.

[bug80]

I thought iTunes used 128Kbps?

←

That is correct. AAC@128 kbs sounds way better than ATRAC@132 kbs in general, trust me.

[jadeclaw]

That is correct. AAC@128 kbs sounds way better than ATRAC@132 kbs in general, trust me.

←

But only if you encode yourself with other software than iTunes, e.g. Nero6.

The downloaded stuff from the iTunes online shop sucks like a black hole.

[bug80]

But only if you encode yourself with other software than iTunes, e.g. Nero6.

The downloaded stuff from the iTunes online shop sucks like a black hole. 

←

I recently downloaded the iTunes originals album, by R.E.M., and was surprised with the quality. I can still hear some artifacts, but not as much as with ATRAC3. However, that's the only experience I have with music from the iTunes store. It may be possible that they use fast encoding algorithms which result in lower quality files.

I decided to not pay for music at this bitrate, but this album was "iTunes only", unfortunately.

[MZ-NH1]

I don't see why Sony keep pushing their ATRAC format seriously. Some might think the sound quality is better than .wav or .mp3, but seriously, who supports ATRAC? ONLY SONY! so the only way I, and I think many others can listen to our ATRAC converted songs is through SS, which is shit...

So no wonder people are turning away from Sony products. How neieve can a company really be?

If Sony wanted to increase their market share and customer base, they would surley support mp3 a whole lot more, and maybe start dwindlying down their ATRAC format, because there never going to win the audio war which is currently going on!

I can't speak for others, but I find it a great hassel to convert all my mp3 songs to ATRAC, which takes up space on my hard drive, so I have 2 lots of identical audio files, 1 lot of which is ussless to me unless I put it onto my MD! :@

Sorry. Just had to get that all off my chest

[ZosoIV]

I'd be thrilled if Sony would just drop their damn movie and music divisions and stick with making hardware. Instead of building crippled, half-assed devices that "sort of" work in order to appease their media monster, why not make the BEST devices to play other people's media? It's better to be great at one thing than mediocre at several.

If two or three years ago, Sony had offered audio and/or video players that lacked their usual DRM-paranoia and played all manner of formats (MPEG-4 AAC, Vorbis, MP3, FLAC, etc), Apple wouldn't even be an issue right now. Sony has a steep hill to climb! Apple is great at marketing, but function should precede form; I should know as a relatively unimpressed owner of one of their laptops. Next time it's a Vaio

[Dinko]

That is correct. AAC@128 kbs sounds way better than ATRAC@132 kbs in general, trust me.

That's a matter of opinion.

When I rip a CD with iTunes at 128kbps AAC, and the same tracks using SonicStage and ATRAC3 at 132 kbps, I much prefer the ATRAC3 version to the AAC version.

To my ears, the iTunes AAC tracks sound glossy, icy and just plain bad. Especially with orchestral sounds. I find ATRAC3 is much warmer and closer to the CD version.

[leonyuhanov]

I think its time we clear up a few things here:

1-Who cares what format a player uses, ie..Ipod=mp3, MinDisc=atrac etc...

at the end of the day you manage your music files in whatever way you want! How bloody hard is it to convert all your media to one uncompressed, or high wuality system and then use it where ever? All my music is encoded to 360VBR mp3 or 196k mp3. I own a Sony Net-MD that uses atrac and a JVC-MD that is analog in! My best mates have SolidState-MP3Players and Ipods and what do you knwo we all share our music without any difficulty whats so ever!

2-I think that sonys Atrac is altogether an amazing codec! Sure LP4 is crap but who the hell puts 5 hours on a 80min disc and thinks it will sound good?? Atract SP is 48khz, better then CD!!! Atrac LP2 is equal to a 160k mp3 in sound quality as long as the original has been encoded from a higher bitrate mp3!

3-if i see another idiot bying an ipod just because they think it makes them look cool!! ill stab you with a fork!!!

4-Itunes is great, the sony shop is great, if everybody would just learn a few things about the way they walkman works, none of this bickering of formats would be around! Its all because of the multitude of IDIOTS who buy an IPOD without ever even turning on a computer!!!!

Sony will always be sony, they wont die, even though minidisc may be on its way out because of point 4. Apple will always change, thats why they are so revolutionary but most of their appeal is just about point 3, it looks nice and is suposably intuitive. All up, just go out and buy a CD for g-ds sake!

Leon

www.portadisk.com

[MDX-400]

I'm curious as to the right of the musicians to do this. Surely I can imagine that some musicians have in their contract the right to go ahead and do this, but at the same time wouldn't there also be a lot (probably even more) artists that do not have such a clause in their contracts making them able to circumvent Sony and take their music right to Apple?

I'm wondering if Sony can take legal action against the artist and/or Apple for some of this "crossing the floor" that it looks like is happening.

As for iPods I absolutely hate them! Like leonyuhanov said above (point #3), I'd also like to stab (or perhaps slap in the head, lol) people that just buy an iPod because it is an iPod. Like c'mon there are so many better players out there from different makers.

[bug80]

That's a matter of opinion.

When I rip a CD with iTunes at 128kbps AAC, and the same tracks using SonicStage and ATRAC3 at 132 kbps, I much prefer the ATRAC3 version to the AAC version.

To my ears, the iTunes AAC tracks sound glossy, icy and just plain bad. Especially with orchestral sounds. I find ATRAC3 is much warmer and closer to the CD version.

←

Of course it is a matter of opinion, but after performing countless numbers of blind listening tests, I'm sure I prefer almost any format (MP3, AAC, OGG) over ATRAC3 on that bitrate.

Have you performed blind testing yet? The results can be surprising.

See this public 128 kbs listening test where ATRAC3 is chosen to be the worst codec of a set including Ogg Vorbis, MPC, MP3, AAC and (even) WMA.

[saaron]

As for iPods I absolutely hate them!  Like leonyuhanov said above (point #3), I'd also like to stab (or perhaps slap in the head, lol) people that just buy an iPod because it is an iPod.  Like c'mon there are so many better players out there from different makers.

←

I find this attitude (which seems pervasive on this board) both bizarre and a waste of energy. How little a life do you have that you:

a) hate a music playback device

feel equally strong dislike for total strangers because they buy said playback device

Personally I'm glad people are still enjoying music at all. I don't want any kind of mass-storage music playback device because I don't want to store my music on a computer, but hatred seems a bit extreme for what is a fairly benign technology.

Edited August 15, 2005 by saaron

[atrain]

i own an ipod. i own a no. of mds & a vaio pocket & prefer atrac3 to aac.

the hatred whilst a little ott is thus - do you eat at mcdonalds? out of choice? despite there being far better choices for you out there?

admittedly for those who want something homogenised & everywhere ipods & mcdonalds are easy. for others who want a strong headphone amp & a good ui ipods make sense. i'm not going to continue the analogy any further except to say some people who rail against the apple product are anti-pop - music, culture whatever. others just want people to have choice, even if they get the ipod anyway it's because they've considered it for good reasons.

[ZosoIV]

I happen to own both an iPod mini and still have nurtured my MD obsession of many years. The iPod sounds ok over my Grados, if a bit thin, but because I have a nice MD recorder, it's not my first choice when I want to relax and listen to something critically. The iPod is a repository for a ton of songs - quick and convenient for the bus, or in my assistantship office. The MD is for when I want to relax and really listen to my music; SP encodings with the Grados do the trick nicely. I'd never think of going one way or the other; both the mini and the MD do their thing really well, better than a single player would on its own.

Most people don't have MD's because they don't have a need to record, they could care less about nuances in sound, and they want to stay with the hippest trends. Music to them is just something that goes on in the background; MD is for the rest of us

[leonyuhanov]

In reply to saaron, i have to appologize about my ranting. I see allot of people, mostly friends, who go out and buy Ipods because they think it makes them:

a-look cool and

b-have a valid opinion about these kinds of devices

in my opinion it makes you look like a sheep, and the fact that you are bying it because its so bloody easy to use, look like you know nothing at all about these kind of devices!

Yes saaron, im amazed music is beeing listened to and thats great! I hope everyone on the planet has a walkman with some nice music on it. I rant becasue i'm bored and because thats what these boadrs are for, and becasue i feel strongly about a technology i have invested allot of money and effort into!

Thanks

Leon

[Christopher]

No worries, leonyuhanov, that is indeed what these boards are for. saaron's comments were quite scathing and not really welcomed here. Please be kind, helpful and always akin to honor when conversing with others; absolutely no trolling or flaming will be tolerated, and please don’t attack other members for their opinions and beliefs.

[skierMD]

Bottom line:

Audiophiles, like most of us on this board, love the fidelity of True SP, and better yet PCM of HI-MD. We are also the people that still buy vinyl and clean to grooves under a microscope before we record PCM on our Hi-MD units. I'd say the only real selling point is its portable recoding power.

I truly love recording vinyl onto my HI-MD, then uploading it to my pc(s), using Soundforge to edit a little and then being able to listen to the final product on whatever medium I choose, whether on an IPOD, NH1, CD, MP3, or on my RH10.

Maybe not exactly on topic....but I just had to share that.

[brandorf]

AAC@128kbps or ATRAC3@Whatever. It doesn't really matter which is better, neither one of them are going to be playing on my actual home stereo system. Besides, using either the free Sony or Ipod headphones that came with the units, I doubt you can tell the difference.

Personally if the Minidisc somehow became iTunes friendly, it would be an amazing thing. The connect store is almost identical to the iTunes store anyway.

I buy my music from AllofMP3.com where I can get whatever format/bitrate I want, so to hell with the other stores.

[anont]

Bottom line:

Audiophiles, like most of us on this board, love the fidelity of True SP, and better yet PCM of HI-MD.

←

Well actually, True SP and PCM offer no audiophile advantage over standard CD-audio, and a number of disadvantages. At this point, I think the only people who follow the MD format are the stubborn!

[Syrius]

^^^ Erm. Aren't PCM and CD Audio the exact same thing?

[DrSiddons]

^^^ Erm. Aren't PCM and CD Audio the exact same thing?

←

Details .... details . . . .

[anont]

Well, Minidisc PCM and Cd-Audio are bit-for-bit the same, but one is on a minidisc, and one is on a CD. I would think this obvious???

Anyway my point remains the same. There's really reason for an audiophile to prefer the MD format.

[Sparky191]

...

Anyway my point remains the same. There's really reason for an audiophile to prefer the MD format.

I assume you meant "no reason"

Unless the DAC on the MD is better than those on PCDP and DAPs.

[Deanage]

Apple is great at marketing,

Maybe they picked up a few things from when Sony was king a few years ago.

but function should precede form;

(Preacher) Can I get an amen to that? Let me hear you say it. (Audience) AMEN! Unfortunately there are a LOT of shallow people out there who honestly believe their phone/TV/etc represents who they are. They don't buy electronics, they buy "lifestyle products" (cue punch into salesman's face).

In reply to saaron, i have to appologize about my ranting. I see allot of people, mostly friends, who go out and buy Ipods because they think it makes them:

a-look cool and

b-have a valid opinion about these kinds of devices

in my opinion it makes you look like a sheep, and the fact that you are bying it because its so bloody easy to use, look like you know nothing at all about these kind of devices!

Yes saaron, im amazed music is beeing listened to and thats great! I hope everyone on the planet has a walkman with some nice music on it. I rant becasue i'm bored and because thats what these boadrs are for, and becasue i feel strongly about a technology i have invested allot of money and effort into!

Thanks

Leon

Hey, at least there's people who use phones to listen to music to hack on; nobody likes "them"

It would be nice to see Apple give some leverage to Sony, 'cos, you know, Sony only invented portable audio. But hey, that's business I guess.

Edited November 10, 2005 by PCManiac

[cyberhill]

Who cares if you hate a certain player? I don't need to hear about it. That is why there are heaps of choices out there - you can buy the one with all the fancy stuff and I can buy a simple ipod