MZ-RH1 Available on SonyStyle

[Christopher]

enriquez writes in to report that the MZ-RH1 is now selling for $349 at SonyStyle.

[RobA]

One lone Hi-MD player in the minidisc section at sony.com. It's still hard to believe sony discontinued the rh910, rh10, and dh10p. This is a bad sign that sony is giving up on competing in the market of portable music players for minidisc, and only pushing their HD and Flash players in that market.

[dewi]

Also at SonyStyle Canada now for C$399.

[himd_anxiety]

I am thoroughly unsurprised, as it seemed highly plausible that part of the thought process driving the RH-1 was releasing legacy recorders from the captivity of format about to shift gears severely. Therefore, placing the RH-1 only where professionals could get it would defeat the purpose.

[MikeRofone]

I could be wrong here, but as a professional recorder I don't think the RH1 cuts it. I mean it's certainly the best MD recorder out for quite some time, but profe3ssional applications would demand things like an external battery pack and an optical out, which this lacks. Sony won't get too far pushing this as a professional recorder. Hope I'm wrong, but really, I don't think so.

[littlecx]

professional equipments won't hide functions deeply in the menu.

[Meryl Arbing]

The Canadian SonyStyle decribes the RH1 as a "Hi-MD Walkman Field Recorder" which is fine with me because I am looking for a high quality, portable recording system and Hi-MD gives me that. But looking back at the history of recording technology we can see some interesting parallels.

When Edison developed the phonograph, his cylinder technology (which recorded vibrations as vertical peaks and valleys) was superior to the competition which used disks. Edison saw people using the new technology for home recording while the competition concentrated on providing precorded disks of famous singers. Edison never signed the big name music artists of the day because he thought that people wouldn't care about pre-recorded music if they could record their own sounds at home. Edison may have been a genius and he was dead wrong. The public couldn't be bothered making their own recordings of 'Mary Had a Little Lamb'. They WANTED to hear Caruso in their homes.

So, we have an industry that is built upon prerecorded music that the public can buy and listen to without having to do anything. It is the same with MD. Sure, it is far superior recording technology than MP3 but the public is clueless as far as recording goes...they want to be entertained with no effort on their part. This is why MP3 players dominate and MD is floundering. I think that Sony has realized that they can't compete in a market where the public could care less about the superior recording technology of MD...they just want the latest commercial fluff downloadable and sharable.

So, yes, MD might migrate to a more professional niche (with ALL of the features that people have suggested) and Sony can go back to trying to fight the iPod in their own backyard.

[Rasuogen]

I agree with Merly about MD recording becoming a very small profession market and all. With that said I will still be using my MD players and enjoining a better listening and sounding music experience. I am pointing at all you ipod people

P.S. about freaking time Sonystyle!!! I should be ordering mine in a couple of days YES!

But yet they are not offering the "LIP-4WM Lithium Ion battery" hmm looks like I am going on ebay...

[garcou]

Sony could make prerecorded himd (pcm not compressed) ,if they wanted.

Obviously it would have to be recorded not pressed like audio CD or old prerecorded Himd.

But that is not a problem, because prerecorded tapes are real time recorded and are still sold.

An industrial machine could record 100 himd discs at once, at 4x speed.So 400 prerecorded Himd / hour

Blank Himd production cost is less than 2USD for Sony (there are 3USD (3.85 AUD) himd sold on the web (australian e-shop))

Sony could build the industrial machine for 10000USD (100 x 100 USD himd drive = 10000 USD )

During a working day, the machine would product around 10000 discs (24 hours x 400/hour)

As for CD, packaging, carring is less than 4 USD/ disc.

If prercorded was sold 20 USD, in one day of production, sony's profit would be: (10000 x 20) - (10 000x 2) - ( 10000x4) -10000 = 130 000 USD!! And the machine is paid!

I 've more Than 150 prerecorded legacy MDs. Saddly, Sony Music never put their whole catalog in the format.

It was compressed music and it was impossible to make lossless copy. (Yes you need to understand this Sony, BMG, universal, EMI ,etc : people still buy CD audio, not only for quality, packaging ,... , but also because they love offering digital copies to their friends!)

I don't buy prerecorded audio CD any more(nor prerecorded Mds) because I ' have more than 250 audio CD, and I'm waiting for Prerecorded HiMD!

Sony Music, if you want my money, just make prerecorded HIMD!!

Edited August 4, 2006 by garcou

[squeezebox]

It's a helluva lot cheaper at this site ($310 shipping included). I would only buy directly from Sony if something became a clearance item or was unavailable anywhere else.

Source One Audio:

http://www.sourceoneaudio.com/index.asp?Pa...amp;ProdID=5615

Edited August 6, 2006 by Squeezebox

[MikeRofone]

garcou is completely right. It wouldn't be hard for Sony to make prerecorded Hi-MD if they wanted to. Heck, I'd still buy prerecorded "Low-MD" if they made it!

[cfellows]

I can't seem to find, or understand, the difference from the new RH-1 and my MZRH-10. If someone could sum it up for me I'd be very grateful.

Many thanks!

[The Low Volta]

I can't seem to find, or understand, the difference from the new RH-1 and my MZRH-10. If someone could sum it up for me I'd be very grateful.

Many thanks!

try reading this... it is on the RH1 versus the M100, but that is only an RH10 with added mac-compatibility so if you drop all mac-compatibility from the M100 side, you'l have an RH1 >< RH10 comparison

Edited August 5, 2006 by The Low Volta

[tekdroid]

Sony could make prerecorded himd (pcm not compressed) ,if they wanted.

Obviously it would have to be recorded not pressed like audio CD or old prerecorded Himd.

But that is not a problem, because prerecorded tapes are real time recorded and are still sold.

An industrial machine could record 100 himd discs at once, at 4x speed.So 400 prerecorded Himd / hour

Blank Himd production cost is less than 2USD for Sony (there are 3USD (3.85 AUD) himd sold on the web (australian e-shop))

Sony could build the industrial machine for 10000USD (100 x 100 USD himd drive = 10000 USD )

While I admire your enthusiasm, I can't resist but to knock it down a notch or two

Pressed discs (last I checked) are:

1) dirt cheap to make

2) Fast to pump out

For medium/big runs (frankly, only popular artists are worth releasing on Hi-MD, as the more obscure would get too few sales on CD, let alone Hi-MD), the cost prices to Sony would be a world of difference compared to the far more expensive Hi-MD - and that means a big difference in profit margin when you are pumping out thousands/millions of discs.

The time to get quantity out and fill the channel is also far faster with more efficient means of production. These things always matter (particulary the way media affects buying patterns, necessitating occasional 'bursts' of production). Shelf space in record stores also matters. I haven't seen audio cassettes (or racks dedicated to cassettes) for some time. Wholesale prices (not retail prices) Sony sell to stores is the real 'profit' for Sony. Stores making room and having proper racks (and anti-theft devices ) for the discs is another basic reality. Informing the public of the bloody format is another one It's faaaaaar to obscure. Joe luvs his iPod, tho.

We are talking about a format that was intro'd in 2004, that has only sold a few million units worldiwide (at best), to this day. Real figures for just Hi-MD (and not MiniDisc/NetMD) are probably far lower.

During a working day, the machine would product around 10000 discs (24 hours x 400/hour)

As for CD, packaging, carring is less than 4 USD/ disc.

Artist royalties, too. But we know major label artist royalties are largely insignificant in the 'cost pie', so omitting them is not a big issue here

If prercorded was sold 20 USD, in one day of production, sony's profit would be: (10000 x 20) - (10 000x 2) - ( 10000x4) -10000 = 130 000 USD!! And the machine is paid!

I 've more Than 150 prerecorded legacy MDs. Saddly, Sony Music never put their whole catalog in the format.

It was compressed music and it was impossible to make lossless copy.

In marketing terms, you might be classed as an early adopter or enthusiast or whatever. You are not indicative of the general population Not many would pay the same (or more) to get less (worse sound, smaller artwork, etc) unless they only had machines to play the small discs (and couldn't record). In other words, many won't buy it because they have no devices to play it in. CD was there first. Hi-MD is not a big enough leap to justify the extra expense of buying 'new-fangled devices'.

(Yes you need to understand this Sony, BMG, universal, EMI ,etc : people still buy CD audio, not only for quality, packaging ,... , but also because they love offering digital copies to their friends!)

Maybe that plays a part. But I think it has more to do with something simpler: compatibility. There are CD players everywhere. They are standard. Hi-MD is nowhere near that level of ubiquity. The two are probably related. Sharing is easier. Playback is easier. For other devices (iPod, walkman, etc), recording is easily done.

I don't buy prerecorded audio CD any more(nor prerecorded Mds) because I ' have more than 250 audio CD, and I'm waiting for Prerecorded HiMD!

Don't hold your breath CDs are great. Archiving to flac is better

Sony Music, if you want my money, just make prerecorded HIMD!!

They need you and the masses.

One of the reasons we see iPod toilet docks nowadays is because the units are selling like Big Macs. Companies go where the sales are. Sony had its chance. It blew it. Perceptions (bad ones) are very hard to shake. As far as the public is concerned, Hi-MD = NetMD = MiniDisc, and all that was bad or not-so-good with it (software and hardware).

Sony had a nice window of opportunity of at least 5 years - where they were still considered king - to get things right with NetMD/MiniDisc. They totally blew it. Their management fumbled, and continue to fumble. For all these reasons (production cost/time, retail presence, customer ignorance of format, low sales of format, bad perceptions, the fact that by nature the format is recordable, small artwork, etc), I think pre-recorded Hi-MDs make no sense whatsoever (economically speaking and customer desirability-wise).

In the meantime, Happy Recording

...and long live CD

[MikeRofone]

It would be easy for Sony (or anyone else) to make prerecorded Hi-MD's. Prerecorded cassettes have been available since at least the 70's and those can' be "pressed" like CD's are, yet they are still worthwhile to churn out. The problem, of course, would be that (A) being incompatable with non-Hi-MD equipment would limit the scope of the market too severely and that would mean too few potential customers, and ( it's highly likely that no company, Sony included, wants to release anything in uncompressed PCM format, where consumers could make perfect copies. It would have to include drastic anti-copying measures.

[boomklever]

enriquez writes in to report that the MZ-RH1 is now selling for $349 at SonyStyle.

I had mine on order since begin of June (in the Netherlands) at a dealer (Videopartner), but expected delivery date shifted a few times. I finally decided to call Sony Netherlands directly and they said initial market introduction would start after september (...). I was very surprised and said that I had seen the RH1 at another dealer in May already. He would check a colleque and returned with the remark 'it may be possible that your dealer can request an RH1 at Sony and we will deliver'. I said 'So you have them available now?'. He answered 'That is not for sure, but your dealer could try...'

Two days later I got a confirmation from my dealer that he received an RH1 and now I have it here!!!

I guess I will never understand Sony...

[heathenmagic]

Anybody know how things stand in the UK with the RH1? I contacted Sony a couple of times, and they moved the date twice.

Cheers

[garcou]

It would be easy for Sony (or anyone else) to make prerecorded Hi-MD's. Prerecorded cassettes have been available since at least the 70's and those can' be "pressed" like CD's are, yet they are still worthwhile to churn out. The problem, of course, would be that (A) being incompatable with non-Hi-MD equipment would limit the scope of the market too severely and that would mean too few potential customers, and ( it's highly likely that no company, Sony included, wants to release anything in uncompressed PCM format, where consumers could make perfect copies. It would have to include drastic anti-copying measures.

1)The himd market would be larger if Sony had produced himd decks and car unit...

2)Anybody can make perfect digital copies with CDs yet!!

[heathenmagic]

For those in the UK, a word from Sony on availability:-

[Roamer]

The MZ-RH1 as finally hit Paris this week (Concurrence, Alifax, FNAC ...) after Sony France was announcing it for November. Prices range from 280 Euros to 349 Euros. I just got mine yesterday.

Edited August 18, 2006 by Roamer

[Odyssey]

While I admire your enthusiasm, I can't resist but to knock it down a notch or two

Well, with some of the opinions flying here, I expected this.....

For medium/big runs (frankly, only popular artists are worth releasing on Hi-MD, as the more obscure would get too few sales on CD, let alone Hi-MD),

Any recording format ventures in ALL sound areas. Popular artists take a large chunk of the pie chart but there are many more areas that bite into that pie. nature sounds, sound books, less popular music etc.

What I find difficult or perhaps it would be a large advantage for commercial use, is how Sony, or one of thier contracted companies, would fill a disk that can record continuously for 35 hours. Where perhaps a smaller amount of time might have been more manageable, in the selling market, these HiMD disks have a huge amount of record time.

the cost prices to Sony would be a world of difference compared to the far more expensive Hi-MD - and that means a big difference in profit margin when you are pumping out thousands/millions of discs.

I think so, but remember, He who owns the disk (SONY) pays LOTS less for the blank. Profit will always be determined by the public and the areas of sounds that have been recorded for sale. Marketing is a tricky business, but only a marketing expert can understand all the ins and outs of profitability and even then they would tell you that 50% of that is a good guess.

These things always matter (particulary the way media affects buying patterns, necessitating occasional 'bursts' of production).

Absolutely

Shelf space in record stores also matters. I haven't seen audio cassettes (or racks dedicated to cassettes) for some time.

Though still straining to keep in the market, the CD did a good job of giving the Cassette the K'Bosh. The MD would have been a reasonable replacement with recording ability but I don't think the marketing was very good.

Informing the public of the bloody format is another one It's faaaaaar to obscure. Joe luvs his iPod, tho.

Yes for some reason, the marketing never has been any good. Shame to let a superior recording/play back device lay in limbo. The marketing for IPud has taken a large share of the sales and is well ibedded. I prefer to not have to suck music from a computer, especially at the encryption rate that IPud uses.

We are talking about a format that was intro'd in 2004

Real figures for just Hi-MD (and not MiniDisc/NetMD) are probably far lower.

I never cared for the Net/MD units myself. They took a lot away from them so I considered them a waste.

Not many would pay the same (or more) to get less (worse sound, smaller artwork, etc) unless they only had machines to play the small discs (and couldn't record).

Hmmm worse sound (less), this too is interesting since most people cannot tell the difference between the CD reproduction vs MD. YET, the inferior recordings of the IPud have the market awash. I still think it is all marketing.

Maybe that plays a part. But I think it has more to do with something simpler: compatibility. There are CD players everywhere. They are standard.

You need to remember that when MD first hit the market, the MD decks were available from many manufactureres. CD had just taken a good hold over vinyl records and everyone liked the new smaller size and the fact that the disk was difficult to damage. MD with its portable recording abilities came in to replace the cassette but by then, cassettes were being bought from the store and just used in car stereos. Only die hard cassette buyers were actually recording. Too, there were many types of cassette tapes to buy depending on the noise level and you had to have a compatible machine to take advantage of that recording sound ability. It had gotten messy.

CDs are great. Archiving to flac is better

What is a flac? yes, CD is great, I like them for home but I prefer to use my CD's as a master and record onto the MD for travel. What ever you care to hear, you can pop it in anytime without hooking up to anything. The MD disk is small and very transportable. And the MD sound reproduction is most like the original CD.

They need you and the masses. One of the reasons we see iPod toilet docks nowadays is because the units are selling like Big Macs.

Hmmm, I don't like Big Macs either.

Companies go where the sales are. Sony had its chance. It blew it. Perceptions (bad ones) are very hard to shake. As far as the public is concerned, Hi-MD = NetMD = MiniDisc, and all that was bad or not-so-good with it (software and hardware).

I have to agree here all the way. The MD technology is matched by none other and yet its like "our very own big secret". You are almost in a private club if you like and use the MD/HiMD technology.

Sony had a nice window of opportunity of at least 5 years - where they were still considered king - to get things right with NetMD/MiniDisc. They totally blew it.

I think pre-recorded Hi-MDs make no sense whatsoever economically speaking and customer desirability wise).

I have to think that sony has changed their perception of the market and no longer cares about the "hobbyist" recorder. Though the response to the MZ-RH1/MZ-R100 hitting the market here on this board was/is amazing, it seems everyone on here either has one, ordered one or will get one at some futrue time. I dont think Sony is looking at us as a primary consumer target anymore, at least not in the USA. Does anyone know how popular the MD/HiMD formats are in other countries??? Last I heard, you can't find them in the store in Japan, they buy them up as they are delivered.

Now that they are adding the Professional interest, the HiMD is being prepared for use as a tool rather just a musical playback device. Face it, If a reporter used it for recording reports, and it caught on with other agencies, sales might take off in a few years. Djs have always shown interest in the MD for their work and I have read where Radio stations have used them for injecting commercials, sound bits and other things that the old cart machine was becoming difficult to do.

If you think about it, the HiMD has grown to quite the machine now. Ease of use, simple change out of media (disk), long battery life, built in metering and small portable package makes this desireable for a professional market. Obviously, all consumers are welcome but Sonys sights are turning to a seemingly more profitable market. I say this because where would a consumer like you and I use a media disk capable of 35 hour recording, even 20 hour recording?? Managability comes to mind whenever I hear this amount of storage time. For long trips, I love it cause I don't have to change the disk. Hear it a couple times then come home and re-record the disk for fresh entertainments.

In the meantime, Happy Recording...and long live CD AND HiMD

[theblueraja]

professional equipments won't hide functions deeply in the menu.

Wrong there, my friend... I work in television and most of the Sony 'pro' gear as it were (like HD digital record decks, etc - up in the 15-20 thousand dollar range) have many deep, difficult to find menus & setup screens.

[tekdroid]

I think so, but remember, He who owns the disk (SONY) pays LOTS less for the blank. Profit will always be determined by the public and the areas of sounds that have been recorded for sale. Marketing is a tricky business, but only a marketing expert can understand all the ins and outs of profitability and even then they would tell you that 50% of that is a good guess.

Of course. But all things being equal, the costs of production with pressed discs versus a multi-layered disc which takes far more time to churn out (if nothing else) will still be far more expensive - again, all things being equal. Especially a disc in ultra-low demand as a pre-recorded disc. Sure, tape and recordable discs may have been used in the past (like floppy discs containing games) but the CD changed all that, and eventually reduced costs for all. No manufacturer would want to go backwards into higher-cost lower-demand territory unless there was a lucrative pot of gold kicking around there, unclaimed.

The CD has been around for many years. Many companies have had a chance to lower costs on the machines used to manufacture pressed discs. And it takes more than Sony to make a successful format (as far as content goes) - it takes the support of the industry at large. Also worth noting is that Sony/Philips basically earn a royalty on every CD sold. They 'own' this format, too. So of course things are cheaper than retail that we pay, but I think CD is still faaaaar cheaper to them per unit than a Hi-MD. Absolutely many, many times cheaper.

Yes for some reason, the marketing never has been any good. Shame to let a superior recording/play back device lay in limbo. The marketing for IPud has taken a large share of the sales and is well ibedded. I prefer to not have to suck music from a computer, especially at the encryption rate that IPud uses.

The marketing in the early ads for MiniDisc sort of mentioned recording as an "oh, by the way..." thing. The early ads were really focused on the format as a playback device primarily, recording second. Sony was trying to drum up support in the industry for the format as the IDEAL portable format. I'm glad it didn't succeed, because lossy compression is/was garbage next to the CD. Anyway, the CD was too entrenched by that time. 1991/1992 were real turning points for the CD as far as sales volume were concerned. LOTS had made the move to it by the time MD hit the market (at high prices).

I never cared for the Net/MD units myself. They took a lot away from them so I considered them a waste.

MiniDisc (pre-NetMD) was actually a good product for what it did. I abandoned it because I hated ATRAC and could never live with its limitations. The product was fine and very well thought-out overall, though. NetMD I never had annnyyyy interest in whatsoever. The software was garbage, the restrictions were too severe. Flash units were out (albeit with smaller storage capacities) with none of MDs stupid restrictions. Sony wasn't paying attention. Now they are outgunning Hi-MD capacities and for not-too-much money either, and with a hell of a lot easier use and smaller size, in many cases.

Hmmm worse sound (less), this too is interesting since most people cannot tell the difference between the CD reproduction vs MD. YET, the inferior recordings of the IPud have the market awash. I still think it is all marketing.

most people eat Big Macs too, but it dosn't mean they are better than the stuff I make myself

I think it's more than marketing, it's ease-of-use that Apple unquestionably nailed, and they deserve their success, even though personally I feel they do not make desirable products for my uses. I prefer native drag-n-drop and FLAC support and a decent recorder As far as playback and software/hardware synergy for Average Joe goes, they did a good job of it. It's no mystery to me, especially when comparing it to a friend's NetMD (gah!) or even today's SonicStage.

Anyway, sound is unquestionably worse than CD in lossy recordings. I am not constrained by space and I should have the choice to enjoy music (and my own audio experiments) without lossy compression shortcomings (and do, thankfully). I don't think it's asking too much to say "I am not constrained by space, please let me listen to CD content uncompressed and unconstrained". The problem is: lossy formats (popular formats out now anyway) lock you in to their:

1) hardware

2) Digital Rights Restrictions

3) create generational losses if u want to convert to another (lossy) format for playback in whatever else u may own in future

CD never had these problems (as long as computers and free rippers came along, that is).

9 times outta 10, I find lossy files fatiguing for extended listening, even if they are encoded very high with no immediate apparent quality shortcomings (which very few are, btw). Personally, I wouldn't dream of recording once-in-a-lifetime things with ATRAC/MP3/AAC/Ogg Vorbis, etc etc (let alone buying them). Tho I can certainly understand their utility and usefulness in some situations.

Depends on your equipment and ears - and what you're happy with in the end. The industry is saving bucketloads by offering downloads online with no packaging and virtually no distribution costs, yet with heavier restrictions and worse quality (and high prices, funnily enough). I demand more (especially from a recorder capturing once-in-a-lifetime stuff). Again, luckily I have this at very reasonable cost. Can't complain, really.

What is a flac?

FLAC is a world-class audio file format, like mp3 or Ogg Vorbis, or AAC, except with no quality loss like you get with lossy audio like mp3, AAC, Ogg Vorbis, etc (and no royalties needing to be paid for hardware or software that makes use of it). What goes in, comes out, basically. Audio is not compromised in any way. Much like ZIP files keep data intact, but make file sizes smaller. You get the idea. The advantages? is file sizes around 40-50% smaller over traditional WAVs that you might be working with. On the PC, ripping around 12CDs of content per DVD is a common thing for FLACheads to do to archive their stuff. Of course, FLACS can be tagged, allowing for easy indexing/sorting/searching, and are a more robust format compared to having things encoded as regular CDs (CDs are more sensitive to data corruption). Lossheads shake their heads and think of wasted space the larger flacs take up. FLACheads shake their heads at lossheads and think of quality loss.

http://www.cowon.com is one of the few progressive companies that make devices that play the format. Units like the iAudio U3 are fine flash devices. Arguably the finest on the market now. Native drag-n-drop, too.

yes, CD is great, I like them for home but I prefer to use my CD's as a master and record onto the MD for travel. What ever you care to hear, you can pop it in anytime without hooking up to anything. The MD disk is small and very transportable. And the MD sound reproduction is most like the original CD.

You don't have to sell me on the benefits of Hi-MD Linear PCM recording, multiple input support and removable batteries and discs are the best parts about Hi-MD, to me.

Hmmm, I don't like Big Macs either.

Big Macs were used as a reference for sales. Not quality.

I have to think that sony has changed their perception of the market and no longer cares about the "hobbyist" recorder.

Absolutely. They are a content distribution company now, first and foremost.

In the meantime, Happy Recording...and long live CD AND HiMD

Hi-MD (and any other format) can live as long as it's the best product for the job, as far as I'm concerned. I don't much care for nostalgia if something better comes along that makes things a whole lot less stressful and/or quicker - and still high quality and doesn't sacrifice too much in the way of cost/flexibility. I'm still waiting for that affordable killer SD-recorder that can record 8+ hours of continuous linear PCM CD-quality audio (or better) with maximum flexibility and relatively low price, of course While I'm at it, I'd like free accessories bundled, too.

Right now I think Sony (and Samsung, and Panasonic, and others) are faking it, hoping nobody notices. They can release a dream recorder for not too much money, if they wanted. I guess Sony are milking the lower-end recorder market for what it's worth until they get some decent competition in the field. Very few companies seem to care about high-quality (affordable) live recording. Almost all are focusing on playback... chasing the tails of the market leader.

PS.

In rare on-topicness, I'd like to express my thanks and praise that MZ-RH1 Hi-MD is available at SonyStyle

Edited September 4, 2006 by tekdroid

[WaywardTraveller]

Right now I think Sony (and Samsung, and Panasonic, and others) are faking it, hoping nobody notices. They can release a dream recorder for not too much money, if they wanted.

To me that's just the point...they DON'T want to. This is the basic philosophy of (among other things) consumer electronics: never put ALL the desirable features into ONE model! Canon has done EXACTLY the same thing with their cameras, and other companies have followed the same philosophy: why give consumers everything they want in one model when you can tempt them to buy two?

peace

WaywardTraveller

[Eljay]

Anybody know how things stand in the UK with the RH1? I contacted Sony a couple of times, and they moved the date twice.

Cheers

I phoned the UK branch of SonyStyle Europe a few days ago to find out what's going on... Initially, I was told that they don't have it in stock (which, of course, I already knew from browsing the site). When I pointed out that it's available on the *American* SonyStyle website (as well as Amazon.com and other online US retailers - none of whom will ship the product outside the US), he said that is normal, as America is usually several months ahead of the UK with most products. I then pressed him further, asking if he could please give me a UK launch date for the RH1? He put me on hold for a bit, while he asked his colleagues, and when he returned he told me... guess what? That SonyStyle Europe has no intention of ever stocking any mini-disc products (including blank media) again! Well, I was so shocked at this revelation that I didn't have the strength to protest at such a lunatic decision, but I have a good mind to phone them up again to complain! What on *earth* is the point of Sony's official online retailer in the UK not selling all of the company's current products? I'm sorry to say this, but I'm afraid the RH1 is doomed to fail, in the UK at least, what with the ridiculously high price tag (much higher than in the States), extremely limited availability and general lack of promotion from Sony. I really don't know what Sony UK are playing at - it's as if they *want* it to fail. And that's a huge shame.

Anyway, SonyStyle Europe advised me to try one of the authorised Sony Centres, as they normally stock the full Sony range. So I contacted the one nearest to me (about two hours away!), and they said they have run out and won't get their next batch in for several weeks, but they will give me a ring when they do. The man I spoke to there said he predicts that the RH1 will be the very last mini-disc recorder that Sony brings out (although he couldn't swear to this, as he said it's impossible to predict what Sony is going to do next!), and that it will probably have a very short shelf life, about 12-18 months, before being discontinued. He's probably right about the latter at least because, let's face it, this model is never going to take off, therefore it won't be popular or commercially viable enough to keep it going for long. When it does get discontinued, maybe a year from now, I imagine Sony will cite poor sales as the reason, ignoring the fact that they themselves were largely to blame for this by not marketing the machine properly!

The RH1 was touted as Sony's revival of the mini-disc format, but if it doesn't succeed (and the evidence so far is that it *isn't* succeeding), then I fear it really will be curtains for our beloved mini-disc. It doesn't look good...

Edited September 11, 2006 by Eljay

[sallymae_hogsby]

Just to restate the obvious (as many others have here), if "they said they have run out and won't get their next batch in for several weeks", something is certainly not being done right. It's amazing how poorly something sells, when it's not available...

[Eljay]

Well, if any UK people want to phone SonyStyle UK to complain about them not stocking the RH1, the number is 0207 365 2947 (the lines are open Monday to Friday from 9am-8pm and Saturday from 10am-6pm). Or you can e-mail them a complaint at this link: http://www.contact.sonystyle.co.uk/Default...?language=gb_en (click on 'Register a complaint'). Who knows, if enough people complain they might re-consider this crazy decision!!

You can also contact Sony UK, to complain about the extremely poor UK distribution of the RH1. Their number is: 08705 111 999 (open Monday to Friday, 9am to 5pm). Or use the following e-mail link: http://www2.sony.co.uk/feedback/feedbackform.asp (select 'Portable Audio Products (including HiMD)' and then 'I wish to... complain about a Sony product/service/dealer').

Edited September 11, 2006 by Eljay

[heathenmagic]

I am in the UK too. It's unbelievable how Sony operate these days. I run a business myself, by no means as big as Sony. But selling in dribs and drabs has never worked in my book. So it is a shame Sony has not stepped up its manufacture / distrubution of the RH1 to accomodate for Europe. Maybe on one hand they are scared to make a gamble and make more of these units. If so, the more they make, the cheaper they can retail them for. Well in theory anyway.

[Eljay]

I'm debating whether or not to take out an extended warranty on my RH1 when I buy it. Although the price of the unit seems to be the same at all Sony Centres across the UK (£249.99), the price of the extended warranties varies wildly from centre to centre... Today, at three different centres, I've been quoted £70, £79 and £82 for the 3-year warranty, and £81, £119 and £135 for the 5-year warranty! (According to the pricing policy on http://www.sonycentres.co.uk, "Sony Centres are independently owned & operated retailers who set their own prices," so I suppose they are perfectly entitled to do this.)

With this product being incredibly expensive anyway, I feel as though an extended warranty will bankrupt me!! So what I want to know is, is it *really* worth doing? I understand that Sony's warranties do not cover "periodic maintenance and repair or parts replacement due to wear and tear" - which I suppose means that when the product eventually packs up due to age and/or frequent use (like my Panasonic SJ-MR220 did after two years), I'll have to pay for the repairs myself anyway? In which case, surely a warranty will be useless, unless it subsidises the cost of such repairs?

Also, do I *have* to buy the extended warranty *with* the product, or can I do it 11 months down the line, as the initial 1-year (free) warranty is about to expire?

I hope someone can please advise me on this!

Edited September 13, 2006 by Eljay