Just some ramblings

[jase]

Hi,

It's one of my few posts bit I finally feel the need to ramble on (Led Zep bless them) . If you agree thats ok if you don't thats ok too!!

I've been living with my NH-900 for nearly two years!!!! I listen to it approx 5 hours a day at work. It pumps out music in my car via a FM transmitter and all along I've been thinking MP3 is the way to go I must get a harddrive MP3 player but one question sticks with me why? If i really wanted a so called MP3 player I'd have bought one ages ago. I hear all the stuff about MD is not ideal for playback. Thats all I do and I can't think of anything else that will do anything different. I've DJ'd at several parties with my MD and each time someone comes up to me and say's thats great I've been meaning to get an iPod for ages. On that note it was sat on my desk at work the other day in it's little grey pouch and someone said "..at last you've finally dropped the MD thing I've been meaning to get a MP3 player can you suggest one!!?".

It plays, records is robust those that don't know think it's a harddrive thingy!! I'm not too bothered about the future all I know is it suits a purpose for me. Play's gapless which is fantastic for mixes and live stuff. Just can't find a reason to replace well possibly space but changing those disks also makes me re-evaluate my music collection and discover those hidden gems!! I'm not aginst any other type of player one size never fit's all I just know MD is ideal for me.

Apologies to those expecting a Sony Apple rant but I'm really fed up with all the issues. At the end of the day as long as I've got music who cares.

Cheers

Edited March 10, 2006 by jase

[bobt]

Too true

Bob

[whams]

Yeah, I agree.

I use my MD units for about 75% playback and 25% recording, and I don't see anything wrong with that. I think it is great that one unit can playback and record and do both very very well.

I have absolutely no need or desire to get a mp3 player...why would I? My MD's playback is great. I love having removeable media...creating compilation disc etc. You can fit a hell of a lot of tunes on a hi-md....much more then I would need in any one 'session' so having a '20 gig' mp3 player seems crazy to me....sure you can fit a huge amount of music on that...but I have my entire music collection on an external hard drive anyway (in wav format...approx 600 cds)and I enjoy making new discs (transferring accross from sonic stage) when required. Different discs to suit different moods etc etc....works for me!

It doesn't make sense to me to have a minidisc for recording only and a mp3 player for playing back when a hi-md player/recorder does both exceptionally well

[A440]

If you're already into minidisc, then sure, it makes sense to use it for playback. Along with my MD recorders I have a NH600D unit that's my main portable music player: CD to SimpleBurner to MD, good to go.

But 1) I already have about a zillion MDs

2) I want to prolong the life of my Hi-MD recorder's head, so I use the NH600D for uploading what I've recorded, and

3) I nabbed my NH600D for $70 new on eBay. For its original list price, other gadgets were a much better deal.

When I say that the only reason to get MD is for recording, I mean that when people are considering their first "mp3 player," and don't need recording capability, MD is a non-starter. They can find units that are considerably smaller, slightly cheaper, have lighted displays and are SonicStage-free.

[danielbb90]

How about people without a computer?

Minidisc is really usefull then for optical or analog recording to discs!

Well I know people without a computer is low now but its still true!

Where would someone like that be with a MP3 player?

Edited March 11, 2006 by danielbb90

[rayzray]

i have a "nack/knack" for always buying what's best;; and i have so many MD's and hi-MD;; gee where is da MP-twee in my house;; nowheres; cause it's NOT the best; but ok for the rest. i guess!

[1kyle]

2) I want to prolong the life of my Hi-MD recorder's head, so I use the NH600D for uploading what I've recorded, and

3) I nabbed my NH600D for $70 new on eBay. For its original list price, other gadgets were a much better deal.

Actually --there's no friction on a MD "recording Head" --it won't wear out so don't worry about recording head breakdown / wear. The recording is OPTICAL --there's no physical contact between disk and laser.

The mechanical parts of a portable MD unit such as Battery levers, Jog dials, etc are much more likely to break down LONG before any problem with the laser (assuming you don't mis treat the unit severely).

Cheers

-K

[dave_bass5]

I think Hd based mp3 players are much more usefull than any MD player i have seen.

The three main letdowns for me with MD are:

1. The screen/displays on MD units are terrible compared a lot of HD based units. Apart from the RH-10

I cant remember seeing a backlit display on any portable unit, making quick track selecting dificult.

2. Although 1gb disc's hold a lot of songs its still a long way off from HD based units. you still need

to cary more discs around to match a HD unit. If im going away for a few days i would like to take as many tracks as i can for a greater selection but i dont want to be swaping discs all the time.

3. I find my RH-10 to be quite bulky. I also had a RH-900 and both were bigger than my MZ-N1.

But i dont think MD can be beaten when it comes to field recording. i havent found a MP3 player that even comes close at a decent price to MD. i record a lot of gigs and i would be lost without MD

just my thoughts of course.

Dave.

[MDGB2]

All this about capacity in comparison to HD units.

Just TWO 1Gb discs will hold 14 hours of music @ nearly lossless quality.

And up to 20 hours (per disc) decent quality at lower bitrates.

If that ain't enough for people during the day then they have far too much time on their

hands!

[poe]

Not to mention only 4 hours left in their day!POE

[danielbb90]

All this about capacity in comparison to HD units.

Just TWO 1Gb discs will hold 14 hours of music @ nearly lossless quality.

And up to 20 hours (per disc) decent quality at lower bitrates.

If that ain't enough for people during the day then they have far too much time on their

hands!

Cougth!

Well thats not why I like all my music on discs.

I use that size for putting my player on random and just rendomly getting ANY of my songs on next! lol

[dave_bass5]

All this about capacity in comparison to HD units.

Just TWO 1Gb discs will hold 14 hours of music @ nearly lossless quality.

And up to 20 hours (per disc) decent quality at lower bitrates.

If that ain't enough for people during the day then they have far too much time on their

hands!

but what about music for week away or more? and what of the inconvienence of having to decide what songs you take and what you dont. and in your example with 2x1gb discs thats 2 more things to carry around which was my point.

and why limit yourself to what you can listen to?

I use my MP3 player as background music at the gigs i do and people ask for certain songs to be played. its more convenient to be able to sroll through a large backlit display on the MP3 unit or be able to do a search for songs than it is on my RH-10.

As i said in my first post this is just where I think MD falls down and i agree that every one has different needs but you can see that MD has been around for a few years longer than MP3 players and yet its the MP3 players that have really taken off. i asume this is because they offer more to the mainstream public and are better priced.

Also a lot of MP3 players have line in so a PC is not always needed. i also think that while an optical input is nice to have why bother putting one on a protable that will be used with headphones out in the street or in noisy places.

Dave.

Edited March 13, 2006 by dave_bass5

[rayzray]

i don't care about OTHER ppl;;i care about "ME" rayzray;; and to go on a trip with al lot of inferior music is just not worth it; i rather KNOW i have the best sounding music possible; so MP3,4,5,6,&10 is out; i am only interested in "ME', and a few disks can't be a nuisance (sp). hinder; or blinder.

and, when i go into a CD/Vinyl store;; and secretly put my mic in my Hi-MD900;; and incert the mic between a pair of headphones; and "Steal" a free sample of anything they got to offer;; i an sooooo gratified, not mortified.

but i DO understand the inferior need or the masses.

Edited March 13, 2006 by rayzray

[dave_bass5]

i don't care about OTHER ppl;;i care about "ME" rayzray;; and to go on a trip with al lot of inferior music is just not worth it; i rather KNOW i have the best sounding music possible; so MP3,4,5,6,&10 is out; i am only interested in "ME', and a few disks can't be a nuisance (sp). hinder; or blinder.

and, when i go into a CD/Vinyl store;; and secretly put my mic in my Hi-MD900;; and incert the mic between a pair of headphones; and "Steal" a free sample of anything they got to offer;; i an sooooo gratified, not mortified.

but i DO understand the inferior need or the masses.

MP3 is not inferior to ATRAC. or at least it doesnt have to be.

Just as with ATRAC MP3 also comes in various samle rates.

If you want the best then .wav would be the format to use. you wont get much on a 1gb MD.

and of course a few discs can become one disc if you loose one.

but i agree with your first line. if it works for me, then its better than something that doesnt.

I wouldnt say that putting a mic between headphones is getting the best possible quality. much better to download it if your going to nick it.

Dave.

[rayzray]

it's a "Gutt" feeling i have ; after being a pro-musician for over 43 years..

we are all "right' in our own ways (shpere of me'ism).

just about every one of my friends has an MP3 player; mostly i-pods; and i leave them alone; unless they ask.

when i put the Mic in the Headphones; i record in PCM and you can't believe how great the results are.

it's only for a sample;; and for to listen for a while.

i've enen gone in Starbucks Coffee Temples and put my mic in one of those MP3 music dispensers's headphones things and just antagonized the customers.

they asked what i was doing; i said "pirating" leave me alone; lol's

then i explained; why should i pay this stupid amount of money to listen to this music; when i can record it and listen to it all day; way,, ray; say may i have another Triple Expresso Lattay?

i just use my Hi-MD in a lot more ways than a normal person does; and since i am not normal; i have the right to fight.....to P-A-R-T-Y (thought by Beastie Boys; rant and action by Rayzray).

long live Hi-MD'ing! *kissing the mirror*

Edited March 13, 2006 by rayzray

[dave_bass5]

it's a "Gutt" feeling i have ; after being a pro-musician for over 43 years..

we are all "right' in our own ways (shpere of me'ism).

just about every one of my friends has an MP3 player; mostly i-pods; and i leave them alone; unless they ask.

when i put the Mic in the Headphones; i record in PCM and you can't believe how great the results are.

it's only for a sample;; and for to listen for a while.

i've enen gone in Starbucks Coffee Temples and put my mic in one of those MP3 music dispensers's headphones things and just antagonized the customers.

they asked what i was doing; i said "pirating" leave me alone; lol's

then i explained; why should i pay this stupid amount of money to listen to this music; when i can record it and listen to it all day; way,, ray; say may i have another Triple Expresso Lattay?

i just use my Hi-MD in a lot more ways than a normal person does; and since i am not normal; i have the right to fight.....to P-A-R-T-Y (thought by Beastie Boys; rant and action by Rayzray).

long live Hi-MD'ing! *kissing the mirror*

I play in a couple of bands and record all the gigs and i am really impressed with the recording quality my RH-900 and RH-10.

with my MZ-N1 i allways had to use maual rec levels but now i just leave the RH-10 on Auto most of the time. it never seems to distort and it even picks my bass notes up clearly.

for this use there is no cheap alternitive IMHO

Even bugged the bosses office when they had a board meeting and it picked up everything

Dave.

[tekdroid]

I'm not too bothered about the future all I know is it suits a purpose for me.

That's pretty much what it comes down to - having a device that suits your wants/needs. Flash and HDs have their strengths and weaknesses, but so does MD. It's great to have the choice.

Actually --there's no friction on a MD "recording Head" --it won't wear out so don't worry about recording head breakdown / wear. The recording is OPTICAL --there's no physical contact between disk and laser.

There's friction on the magnetic head since it physically touches the disc when recording. Don't know about the nature of materials but I'm sure they're smooth and pretty robust. But it's true the laser itself (that magically heats up the spot right under the magnetic head so the magnetic orientation can be changed) never physically touches the disc (in recording or playback).

Frankly, I'm amazed it all works, just thinking about it. Especially in a low-powered portable.

[Ral-Clan]

and, when i go into a CD/Vinyl store;; and secretly put my mic in my Hi-MD900;; and insert the mic between a pair of headphones; and "Steal" a free sample of anything they got to offer;; i an sooooo gratified, not mortified.

You're kidding, right? A recording made this way can't be anything near good quality. You've just negated the hi-fi aspect of MD recording, not to mention the loss of any stereo imaging! Do you record onto minidiscs at home by holding a microphone up to the speakers of your stereo?

Please don't tell me you use PCM mode or a high bitrate to do this, as it would be pointless!

[1kyle]

and of course a few discs can become one disc if you loose one.

Dave.

Probs with these types of players (MP3 Solid State and / or Hard Disc units).

1) If you lose it, break it or it gets stolen etc. then you've LOST your library --you'll have to get another one and re-compile / re-create your library all over again -- and if you haven't got a computer near you or don't have the music available on the computer -- Re-Ripping time again.

2) When the device is full you have to decide what you want to erase so you can add more music.

3) Creating decent playlists on these types of devices is always a bit fiddly --often you want specific playlists --you don't need to sequentially listen through hours of music.

4) with larger capacity devices just managing the library is not such a simple task as you might think.

5) Hard Disks are not particularly robust --these are relatively fragile pieces of gear which won't take anything like the same wear or tear as a solid state device or a minidsic recorder.

Minidisc recorders have in particular these adavantages

1) Unlimited storage -- just take whatever complilations you want with you

2) If you lose / breeak the device or even if it gets stolen --not so likely as "the masses" haven't a clue what a MD player / recorder is anyway you've only lost the disk that's in it (one disk).

3) superb record facilities. Some Ipod thingy's have limited recording facilities but awkward to use and unless you are using something like the Marantz solid state recorder (at around 1500 USD) no PCM record mode either.

4) It's easy to manipulate music collections at a Disk level --much easier than organising 1000 tracks on a HD device.

5) Disks can be transferred between machines and devices -- AFAIK most HD / Solid state devices don't come with removable media so you are stuck with using that particular device.

I suspect that even if you could use removable media you might run into all sorts of DRM issues when transferring solid state cards between devices.

Incidentally even 1GB solid state media costs a lot more than a 1GB minidisk so if you want a music collection stored on 1GB removable solid state devices it will cost you A FORTUNE even today.

People's mood changes and it's nice to be able to stick the approriate disk into the MD for playback. It's a real pain using a Hard Disk device for manipulating loads of different playlists.

In the end use what you like best but remember your modes and tastes change over time and you might prefer the flexibilty of devices like the MD compared with Hard Disk or Solid State devices.

Cheers

-K

[rayzray]

You're kidding, right? A recording made this way can't be anything near good quality. You've just negated the hi-fi aspect of MD recording, not to mention the loss of any stereo imaging! Do you record onto minidiscs at home by holding a microphone up to the speakers of your stereo?

Please don't tell me you use PCM mode or a high bitrate to do this, as it would be pointless!

yes;; PCM sometimes but Hi-SP mostof the time;; it doesn't matter;; i am just stealing it anyways and expect to "delete" it by days end.

you'd be surprized if you wrap the mix in a handcerchief (sp) and then insert in the headphones;; it comes out decent;; and the stereo is pretty well separated (was that INXS) or (U2).?

i'll tell you what; it's a lot better than mp3's in a cheap way. * i really can't do this single punctuation crap*.

when you live as long as i did; you find a lot of shortcuts that are just "Fun" and if you can have "Fun" son,, give it up.

live is not worth all the hassle Sony puts yous through; and all the bickering over MP3's and MD's (i've alveady ventured int audio DVD'ing; just for "FUN",, son;; and am having a ball.

i still do my daily MD recording; and my Hi-mD'ing listening; and on even days; i like to throw on a vinyl (if it's good; i re-lay it into the PC or MXD-D-40 Deck.

if it's bad; it goes to the Yard Sale box. if it's really bad, i break the sucker.

you have to try putting a mic in a headset; but watch the volume; and , make soure the sourse is lagitimate and not MP3's.

[Sony_Fan]

Actually --there's no friction on a MD "recording Head" --it won't wear out so don't worry about recording head breakdown / wear. The recording is OPTICAL --there's no physical contact between disk and laser.

The mechanical parts of a portable MD unit such as Battery levers, Jog dials, etc are much more likely to break down LONG before any problem with the laser (assuming you don't mis treat the unit severely).

Cheers

-K

Recording is done through magnetic head and playback is done with the laser. But your right, the head will not wear out since the actual recording surface on the disc is protected by a clear coat substance.

[rayzray]

but, isn't it true that the MD units are notorious for burning out the Optical block? i lost a few MD-Decks and two portables that way!

bo peep lost her sheep & sony lost their sweep.

i still love the units anyhows.

[Sparky191]

The whole MP3 VS ATRAC, MD VS Everything else debate is a bit old now. Anyone thats gone to MP3 doesn't care, anyone thats "here" has a MD already.

[pfflamingo]

Hey, this is a great thread.

I have two RH-10's, this gives me great flexibility when I wish to record with one while playing the other [i time-shift a four-hour radio show M-F].

I also use my RH-10's as external hard drives with my pc/laptop, transferring files between them. I also use them for backing up small batches of critcal files. I find this to be easier all 'round than using CD disks for this task [although it is a slower process].

My favorite use is for live recording and for recording podcasts I produce. I use an Audio Technica PRO 24 stereo microphone for this purpose. The quality preseved by the RH-10 with this microphone is nothing short of astounding.

Link to the Audio Technica PRO 24:

http://www.audio-technica.com/cms/wired_mi...e6b3/index.html

I don't know how I did without my Minidisc recorders before I had them.

- pfflamingo -

[dave_bass5]

Probs with these types of players (MP3 Solid State and / or Hard Disc units).

1) If you lose it, break it or it gets stolen etc. then you've LOST your library --you'll have to get another one and re-compile / re-create your library all over again -- and if you haven't got a computer near you or don't have the music available on the computer -- Re-Ripping time again.

2) When the device is full you have to decide what you want to erase so you can add more music.

3) Creating decent playlists on these types of devices is always a bit fiddly --often you want specific playlists --you don't need to sequentially listen through hours of music.

4) with larger capacity devices just managing the library is not such a simple task as you might think.

5) Hard Disks are not particularly robust --these are relatively fragile pieces of gear which won't take anything like the same wear or tear as a solid state device or a minidsic recorder.

Minidisc recorders have in particular these adavantages

1) Unlimited storage -- just take whatever complilations you want with you

2) If you lose / breeak the device or even if it gets stolen --not so likely as "the masses" haven't a clue what a MD player / recorder is anyway you've only lost the disk that's in it (one disk).

3) superb record facilities. Some Ipod thingy's have limited recording facilities but awkward to use and unless you are using something like the Marantz solid state recorder (at around 1500 USD) no PCM record mode either.

4) It's easy to manipulate music collections at a Disk level --much easier than organising 1000 tracks on a HD device.

5) Disks can be transferred between machines and devices -- AFAIK most HD / Solid state devices don't come with removable media so you are stuck with using that particular device.

I suspect that even if you could use removable media you might run into all sorts of DRM issues when transferring solid state cards between devices.

Incidentally even 1GB solid state media costs a lot more than a 1GB minidisk so if you want a music collection stored on 1GB removable solid state devices it will cost you A FORTUNE even today.

People's mood changes and it's nice to be able to stick the approriate disk into the MD for playback. It's a real pain using a Hard Disk device for manipulating loads of different playlists.

In the end use what you like best but remember your modes and tastes change over time and you might prefer the flexibilty of devices like the MD compared with Hard Disk or Solid State devices.

Cheers

-K

I think your answers are very pro MD because it suits your needs and thats great and i wont go in to all your answers, but here is my view on a few of them

"1) If you lose it, break it or it gets stolen etc. then you've LOST your library --you'll have to get another one and re-compile / re-create your library all over again -- and if you haven't got a computer near you or don't have the music available on the computer -- Re-Ripping time again."

thats not fair because this applies to MD as well.

You say when a HD unit is full....well, 20,000 songs is more than i actualy have so no chance of that happening

"Creating decent playlists on these types of devices is always a bit fiddly --often you want specific playlists --you don't need to sequentially listen through hours of music"

I dont agree, based on the fact that HD units tend to have much bigger displays so you can see more info at one time

"1) Unlimited storage -- just take whatever complilations you want with you"

This is one of my points. either having to decide what you want to take or take a few discs.

"People's mood changes and it's nice to be able to stick the approriate disk into the MD for playback. It's a real pain using a Hard Disk device for manipulating loads of different playlists"

No its not. having to hunt down the right disc for maybe one or two tracks is a pain. plus you cant create a playlist spread over a few discs. I use my HD player to provide background music at my gigs between sets and if someone wants to hear a specific track i can dial it it without having to stop whatever is playing first. MD cant do that if the song happens to be on another disc.

"4) It's easy to manipulate music collections at a Disk level --much easier than organising 1000 tracks on a HD device."

but you cant get 1000 songs on 1gb MD can you? plus its much, much easier to transfre tracks to a HD unit than it is to use SS3.4 you can also use any PC/MAC anfd just drag and drop. its also quicker because of USB2.

"5) Disks can be transferred between machines and devices -- AFAIK most HD / Solid state devices don't come with removable media so you are stuck with using that particular device.

I suspect that even if you could use removable media you might run into all sorts of DRM issues when transferring solid state cards between devices."

As long as you have more than one Hi-MD with you then agreed. but who carries more than one player around? (ok, i guess a couple of you do)

The recording side i totaly agree on, that why i have my RH-10. nothing comes close

my arguments above are based on HD based units, not the little 2 line display SS units that are so cheap now.

In the end, as you say its what suits your needs and both HD based MP3 and my RH-10 suit mine.

[1kyle]

The bit about losing your library doesn't apply to an MD unit as the most you would lose if the device gets stolen or lost is 1 DISK, and if the MD unit gets broken then you probably still haven't even lost ONE disk (the disk will still in all probability be OK).

My inherent disklike of Hard Disk units is based on these 2 factors primarily.

First Hard disk units are relatively sensitive pieces of kit and need to be handled carefully. Unless you've hot something like a PRO TASCAM or MARANTZ unit costing over 1000 USD and probably more a much cheaper MD unit will survive a lot of knocks and bangs far better than a Hard Disk unit --certainly a Consumer grade Hard disk unit.

Secondly Hard disks consume an inordant amount of power compared with MD units, certainly for recording purposes. The payback time might be "reasonable" but recording large volumes of data (PCM mode) with an Hard Disk unit will just EAT batteries.

Hard Disks have a number of advantages such as larger capacity (of course) and much faster read / write times but they do have drawbacks when used in a small portable unit.

As for carrying more than one unit around well if you are doing a PROFESSIONAL recording session as a journalist or a musician you'd almost certainly have some backup gear as equipment can AND DOES fail usually at the most inconvenient time. OK for a lot of individuals this could be "over the top" but I think I'd still rather rely on 2 MD recorders than a single Hard Disk device.

(As a Photographer I wouldn't dream of going out on a paid assignment without at least ONE backup camera).

Of course it boils down to what you prefer in the end and as this is a MD forum it's not unnatural for a lot of users to prefer MD (if one hates MD why are they on the Forum other than for the purpose of Trolling which thankfully this board doesn't seem to have a problem with).

Whatever you use Enjoy.

Cheers

-K

Edited March 17, 2006 by 1kyle