sfbp

Huh? Looks like MSRP was about $800.

Welcome to the board Nicholas. It's always nice to see someone with a ton of equipment (in your case literally, heheh) chiming in with lots of experience. I want to make only one comment on what you write. MDLP is not necessarily terrible. It's all in the way the sound comes to it. You cannot record a sound source with tons of high frequencies into MDLP without making a mess. But if you have something already compressed, with a certain ceiling, it can sound really really good. For example I can record music off radio at 64 or even 128 kbps using LP4, and I have lots of tracks (and a nice thread on the board here) to prove it. But try to record 320kbps broadcast ("HD") and the deck will fall on its face - you must use LP2 (LP4 fails). Atrac 132kbps is probably equivalent to the highest rates of MP3 in common usage. A second point is that when ripping to MD (using SonicStage or SimpleBurner) that Sony does it perfectly for LP2, throwing away the bits that will simply make the recording sound bad. But if your rejection of MDLP is based on the following test scenario, all bets are off: 1. Rip a CD to some track stored on the PC (Sonic Stage uses 1411 kHz PCM in .oma format, and seems an obvious choice) 2. Blast the track to different data rates on the same (or different) MD recorders by converting to those data rates somehow. 3. Compare the sound of the compressed sound as played back, to the sound from the PC or the original CD. Why? Because unknown to you, the rip of the WAV file from CD is very poor. Deliberately. It will sound just fine for playback, but it won't compress properly. Use a proper ripper (EAC seems to be accepted, and works very well in my experience) and this won't happen. With your obvious background in audiophile gear, I think you can see why. Unfortunately I strongly suspect that the lab tests which compared the various compression codecs that got published 10 years ago (just after introduction of Atrac3 ie MDLP), were done in something like this manner (yeah, I know there was no SonicStage). The result was to seal the fate of ATRAC, in a way, except for us hardboiled nuts who just wouldn't put up with the crappy MP3's.

Depends on the input gain (ugh!). For each dB you add to the input gain you must add 1dB (ie less negative) to that -20dB. However, you will want probably about -50dB set for 0dB gain. I have mine set on -44dB when I have 6 dB gain. If I am on 3dB gain then I have to choose between -46 and -48 for that setting. This is with optical input to record. -50dB is the factory default value. It's too bad that the firmware doesn't change the LSync value (yes you should remember to turn LSync on) as the gain is adjusted. If the number is way too LOW (eg -60dB) you will probably never trigger the track mark. If it is way too high (in your case -20dB) it will give up trying to track mark. If you have it set a bit too high (say -38) you will get lots and lots of little track marks you don't want. It's pretty difficult getting it exactly right. Another complication is that a lot depends on what kind of signal you use, at least if the signal is optical. For example the signal from my Terratec Audio Aureon fun will never ever make a track mark, for some weird reason. However the same program output (via USB) to PC Link and thence to optical on the deck will TM just fine. Very odd. You'll have to experiment. There's no simple recipe - but maybe with the examples above you can start to figure it out. Once you have it, it becomes a life saver. Stephen

Having just acquired, somewhat unexpectedly, a CMT-M333NT, and still waiting to get it working, I fear I am effectively out of the market for the moment. The M333NT supports M-Crew, which increasingly I find is a key resource. The B8 unfortunately has no USB connection at all. In an ideal world I would like it but my world is not ideal at the moment. Stephen

That may be true (for you and your gear). It certainly is not true for me. If it goes up into the red, then it's distorted 0dB is, or should be, well shy of the end of the dial - only +dB numbers are considered "over" AFAIK, ie the equivalent of the red zone on analogue meters..

If the deck never registers "over" then you're ok. The 320 does not allow digital gain adjustment. So try something that looks like it exercises the full dynamic range (0 dB) without going over and see if it sounds distorted. Or, buy a deck that does have digital gain. But I think you have that licked with the MacBook volume control (you can check and see what happens, whether reducing the volume out from the mac results in lower levels at the MD - I suspect it does).

That's not strictly a model number AFAIK. Where exactly do you see this written? On the unit itself it should be 100% clear that it is for 120(115) or 240(230) Volts. I don't think these were ever made dual-voltage. There's a whole bunch of differences between the power boards. The plug is a dead giveaway. And the UK QS units typically had that red sticker saying "UK Sound Tuned" on the front somewhere. The European ones maybe did not. But you will recognize the plug easily enough. Sounds like US means USA. If you are getting one of the "wrong" ilk, it's only $30 or so for a step up or step down transformer.

At the time, yes. Note (from the Specs) that only 74 minute disks are mentioned. MD technology moved on quite a bit after that. I won't bore you with a list but Sony kept on enhancing the technology. Those enhancements are not included. A lot of nice features in the Tascam, but not some of the pure enhancements to sound quality that arose from more recent DSP chips, for example. Recent reports of Tascam's updated offerings have been a bit more lukewarm. Overall, I would be inclined to stick with Sony.

Agree with all that. The one attractive feature that the 940 (over other decks like the 980 and MXD-D400) has is 24-bit output. Some of the high end decks, and the JB920, have it too. Since MD is inherently a 24-bit format (floating, not fixed point, it should be noted) this constitutes the least damage to the bits. In this day and age, there are plenty of devices that can read 24-bit optical (or coax) input, such as AV receiver/amplifiers. The other (non-HiMD) format that uploads (from MZ-RH1, via USB) without damage is MDLP (LP2 and LP4). But copying SP via optical (or USB) and (later) back to MD will lose some of the 24-bitness.

Yes and no. If the tracks have been "liberated" by running File Conversion Tool they now are (I think and hope) equivalent to tracks that are recorded on the unit. If you transfer tracks that were always encrypted (after their transfer TO the PC) then I think they are stuck and cannot be recovered from the MD. Sony's intent was to prevent the proliferation of second generation copies by uploading of MD tracks that came from a CD which the user never actually owned. As always in these case, Your Mileage May Vary.

Thank you very much. We can move this to Personal Message (PM) or email, probably better there. Not a chance. We know pretty much exactly what the hardware does and it will never support transmission of large amounts of data from the MD. Nothing artificial about it. The MZ-RH1 solves the problem, pretty much - Sony's parting gift to MD lovers. In addition there is some heavy duty encryption used in much of the software. And I mean really heavy duty.

Turning that around, it implies that optical out from a pre-Type-S may well be "the same" as Type-S????

[Hangs head in shame]. I took the minidisc.org webpage at face value for this one but not the other unit. Sigh. 2656 is correct for the JA20ES. It makes sense that the Type-R was in at least one SP-only unit before being employed more generally. The JE630 which I own also has 2656, as does the 333ES. My impression of the MXD-D400 is that it sounds excellent when using optical output, as does the D40 (except that Sony didn't actually provide optical out from the latter, I had to add it myself). I cannot comment on the JA333ES. So (absent my ownership of the 333ES) the differences seem to me likely to be in the analog side of the unit, which is probably where Sony spent the money (heavy transformers, solid metal faceplates etc) in trying to get the best specs.

Nice work - but you missed something basic. NetMD does not, will not, has not ever, allow you to transfer FROM minidisc to the PC. Except for tracks recorded on the minidisc side and transferred up with MZ-RH1 (or MZ-M200). Do you have the CMT-M333NT install disc? (its Sony part number should be 424323712).... I have beaten the bushes for the drivers you list, to no avail. In particular I am looking for the drivers and the M-Crew install. It's on order from (indirectly) Sony, but who knows if it will ever arrive, I live in dread of the wholesaler coming back and saying "sorry, no longer in stock". If you do, I will do almost anything to help you - many many people have asked about this unit over the years. If you got transfer TO the md working with your Win64 set up, well done. The second NetMD device is probably a fluke of some kind, but we can chase that down if need be. Quick questions: 1. are you running virtual XP mode, and if so, did you install SonicStage to that rather than to the main W7 world? 2. is the NetMD showing up in the W64 world (as it should)? You can look at the details of the drivers. If you have "greyed-out" NetMD drivers showing by turning on viewing of "hidden" drivers, it's actually advisable to delete them all. But that takes serious work with Device Manager and setting an environment variable in Windows, to make them visible. If you did that, then you're already head of 95% of the class...... Nice to hear from you, hope you can help us with that missing software disk (we don't need the whole thing, just a few files from it) so we can get the files posted for download.

Interesting - I had forgotten about that third section (the one labelled Win2K). Yet I have not so far succeeded in using that driver for Windows32. Nice work, Holmes!

The key element to look at is the main DSP chip. On the JA20ES, W1, JE520 and JB920 it is the CXD2654, which is characterized as Atrac 4.5. The next major revision many devices use is the CXD2662, and this is for all pre-Type-S units that support MDLP. Type-R. The CXD2664 is the basis for all Type-S (except the included Type-S with HiMD, and the NetMD portables which have the DSP processing also folded into a larger chip, to save real estate). You may be right in your implication - that adding MDLP had some cost in the overall sound. I really don't know. My impression is that Type-R is fine for a. recording b. playback via digital out, but that Type-S is an improvement for analogue outputs.

Nah, uploading PCM is just incredibly slow because there is so much data, equivalent to about 6 "standard" MDs. For analogue non-microphone sources I remain unconvinced that PCM recording rates buy me anything. But to each his own.....

I don't understand your question. But there are couple of reasonably priced 940's on EBay UK as I type. HNY!

Take your pick: the MDS-JB940 has configurable bit length output but is "only" Type-R (and so is the MDS-JA333ES), the MDS-JB980 has NetMD and Type-S but does not allow direct 24-bit SPDIF output. If you don't care about MDLP then the JB920 will easily do, having also configurable bit length for the SPDIF out. Strangely, the JB930 manual makes no reference to this feature. Perhaps someone who has that deck can inform us whether Sony took it out, or whether they forgot to document.....

First of all you need to unpack the download from our downloads section to somewhere you can easily find on your hard drive. Let's say we put the three files (netmd760.sys/cat/inf) in c:temp. Up to you, but recommend you don't put in "My Documents" as they may be hard to find later at install time. Now extract the one file from the Sharp driver package that you need, namely mdsha031.inf, you can put it in the same directory where you have the others, if you look. You now need to copy (using copy-and-paste is better because you won't mistype anything) the lines in the ControlFlags section, to the end of the same section in the netmd760.inf file. Note that 04DD appears to be the manufacturer's tag for Sharp (Sony is 054C). ExcludeFromSelect=USBVID_04DD&PID_9013 ExcludeFromSelect=USBVID_04DD&PID_9014 Finally you need to copy the two lines that start with %NETMDUSB %NETMDUSB.DeviceDesc%=NETMDUSB.INSTALL, USBVID_04DD&PID_9013 %NETMDUSB.DeviceDesc%=NETMDUSB.INSTALL, USBVID_04DD&PID_9014 To the equivalent place in the long list of supported units in the 760 file. The only unknown part is here. You may want to put them in a separate section called [sHARP] or you may want to put them in the same section as the rest, which are all Sony. Actually I think it makes little difference because the label is only significant to one particular mode of the Windows device driver installer, the one where you can pick the devices by one manufacturer. If you don't put them in their own section you may have to pretend these are Sony devices at some point Save the file (NETMD760.INF). (keep an unmodified copy just for safety, but the modified one must have the name NETMD760.INF). Now try installing your device again. Probably a good idea to plug it in now. This may or may not mean removing stuff from the device manager. However the simplest route is probably to find the NetMD device and update it. We may have to go through this part slowly, as a lot depends on exactly what state the installer got stuck. When it comes to it, you will have to use the button which is labelled "Have disk", and then point the resulting dialog box at C:temp (or wherever you stashed the files). That's why I suggested somewhere with a simple name, not buried under the "Documents and Settings" tree that My Documents is always stored under. I realise this is a far-from-complete guide but hopefully it has enough to get you started. Azureal may be able to explain it better (hint hint). Stephen

The only reason you really need 2 is for the complication of what happens with USB timing when and if you buy a Sony MZ-RH1 and want to upload things, and your other driver still hangs around. So at least for the moment, not a problem. But you can test out W7 for us and we will try to add some sharp units in there (to our standard download) if that works. You will need to add a couple of extra lines to NETMD760.INF (it has to be in two places, also as I don't know if yours needs 9013 or 9014 probably easiest to add both those, so 2 x2 for 4 lines in all). Take a look at the package and see if you can figure out what to do. The critical information is Vendor # and Model # (VID and PID). The format of your lines is obvious from the context of the 760 driver. Note - there's no reference to any of the other stuff in your sharp .INF file. Are you good with notepad? That's all you need. Stephen

The 24-bitness is exactly why so many of us are here using (and praising) MD. 44/16 is actually a step down of sorts. However it's easier to edit after the fact than MD (Sony made sure of that, there's still no way to edit SP with a sound editor), which is probably what killed MD. Most of the high frequencies these days are taken up recording high frequency noise from fans of one sort or another, IMO. So that high frequency stuff is mainly about making the background sound realistic, rather than any real perceived sound. I suppose one could make the argument that back in the bad ol' days of analogue, we had no idea how to quantify much of this stuff. Sort of like the techniques both of recording AND performing (by singers in world class opera, for example) have continued to evolve over the last 20 years, since the introduction of digital recording. Saw Jonas Kaufmann in Tosca over the weekend - what a voice! And that had the sound track recorded in MP3. It's all in the pictures, isn't it? Stephen

My impression of these (and all) specs is that these numbers indicate the range over which the reproduction is warranted to be +/- 3dB or some such. I can assure you that a full symphony orchestra and a loud organ both sound really splendid on the 700 series. No way I would use MP3 for anything I cared about. I tried it on the 700 long ago, and immediately rejected it. Dead, wooden, whatever adjective comes to mind. I have now, perforce, acquired a series of Sony Cassette decks built into other units. Curiously as the specs went worse, the sound got better. That is, the latest machine has the worst specs and the best sound. Bizarre! And the cutoff for LPCM is just about guaranteed to be the inbuilt mics. Dollars to doughnuts putting some "proper" microphones in the mike input would extend the range. YMMV.

It has become clear that Sony goofed on this one. The firmware is broken. Even though the unit controls the devices on the Unilink (S-link) bus ("BUS") connector perfectly, the title information sent back cannot be read (see previous posting for details, it is quite predictable which items CAN be seen, short titles less than 8 characters work 100%). And it's a failure of the entire line, not just the unit I purchased. Ironic that, with upgradeable firmware, this is the only unit they ever made which did not work, at least to my experience. I suspect strongly that the addition of Bluetooth functionality somehow broke the handling of messages with text/titles incoming from the devices on the bus. Now if someone at Sony were to actually read this....... Happy New Year for 2012 Stephen

What I did not do (when I answered you before) was to go look myself 1. I suspect that in our own downloads section is the right install file. Was your NetMD driver named MDSHA031.SYS, do you perhaps remember? If so, look no further than this: 2. The other possibility (you would have to look up the PID by poking about in Windows) would be to add the VID (04DD) and PID (if it isn't 9013 or 9014, in which case step 1 worked just fine) to the NETMD052.INF file and go ahead and install NETMD052.SYS as in my post 3. If and when that works, thereby confirming that Sharp units use the standard Sony protocol, you should ALSO be able to get a 64-bit driver (for your Windows 7) going, by adding the same lines to NETMD076.INF. See and the current state of that file is in our downloads section too. Either Azureal or myself would be around to help if you decided to attempt either 2. or 3. Happy New Year! Stephen