Would you really buy a 3rd Gen HI-MD?

[lecram1971]

I love HI-MD, but how many people really use it for recording?, will be enough persons who will buy a new HI-MD or will they change to Hard Disk models?

In my opinion I don´t really think it will give so much profit a new HI-MD for Sony, only to profesional use, when the common people only use it as a player, to download from a CD or Internet.

I think HI-MD can´t compete with flash units (smaller than MD) or Hard Drivers (20gb or more).

If a 3rd generation doesn´t came with a really increidible improuvement I will keep my MZ-NH700 for recording that works fantastic, MIC, LINE IN and OPTICAL recording.

Do you really see any future, I know we all dream about but I don´t see it will give comercial benefits.

[Sparky191]

Personally I only use mine for recording. Nothing else. I have a Flash and a HD Mp3 player aswell.

[greenmachine]

I feel the same way. My NH700 does what it's supposed to do (portable high quality recording) perfectly well. I can't be bothered to upgrade anytime soon unless there will be major improvements (unlikely). For portable playback i prefer solid state devices.

[1kyle]

Depends on what it looks like and what features it has.

I'b buy one in a shot if models had most of these features.

1) Upload, download of SP in true SP mode

2) All Net-MD restrictions to be abolished (upload / download like Hi-MD)

3) Optical IN AND OUT (although provided the transfer restrictions were lifted a USB cable would do if they couldn't provide an optical out.

4) Volume restriction (EU models) only applies in France -- An easy user option to bypass the restriction outside France (EU models)

5) Nice El display like the RH10

6)Portable models --more robust construction --Battery levers that don't break easily

7) Decks which INCLUDE a built in HD -- could be useful for ripping CD's etc without needing a computer and then transfering to MD --or just as a staging post for transferring music to MD's.

8) True Drag 'n Drop support

9) Mac support

10) really wishful thinking --Linux support.

11) DRM for non downloaded purchased music to be GONE so OMA filese were really OPEN --still can't think of how they called it Open OMG --it's been the format most resistant to any sort of hacking that I've been aware of --so much so I think even the most "Geekish" hacker has long since abandoned the effort of trying to break the encryption.

We won't get all of these of course but I'd still buy a 3rd gen if some of these wishes were implemented.

Cheers

-K

[Stuge]

i will buy it if possible ...

[danielbb90]

10) really wishful thinking --Linux support.

http://www.winehq.com/ works

Just some bugs known http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?versio...&iTestingId=684 Like the small problem of OpenMG jukebox not working... Watch this space!

Anyway I want to buy it mainly if it has aa or aaa compatability!

Edited March 9, 2006 by danielbb90

[MDGB2]

If Sony built a Hi-MD DECK then yes.

Decks for recording, portables for listening

And so It was written...

Edited March 9, 2006 by MDGB2

[rayzray]

yes;

and you can always pull the portable unit apart and build it into an old Deck casing and call it a Hi-MD deck. some big ppl in this world do it all the time.

Edited March 9, 2006 by rayzray

[garcou]

If Sony built a Hi-MD DECK then yes.

Decks for recording, portables for listening

And so It was written...

Yes, and Hi-MD CAR UNIT !

Edited March 9, 2006 by garcou

[culp4684]

If Sony built a Hi-MD DECK then yes.

Decks for recording, portables for listening

And so It was written...

Won't happen. Sony tried that route back in the mid to late 90's and it didn't work. (although it got me into the format!)

[garcou]

Won't happen. Sony tried that route back in the mid to late 90's and it didn't work. (although it got me into the format!)

Do not agree: they lost Audiophiles music lovers when cd recorders came because md was lossy. HImd with pcm is different.

[danielbb90]

If Sony built a Hi-MD DECK then yes.

Decks for recording, portables for listening

And so It was written...

Yeh!, Whats the point of removiable media if you can only use them for pautable[sp?] audio!

[Zappa]

I only use my RH910 for recording. I've got a rio karma to take care of my portable player needs

I think the only way I'd buy a next gen HIMD unit is if they came out with some 2gb or greater discs.

3 hours of PCM recording would be rockin.

[peare]

Yeh!, Whats the point of removiable media if you can only use them for pautable[sp?] audio!

I would buy anything... but please Lord (here SONY)LET THERE BE A Hi-MD DECK

[pata2001]

It will be interesting, and can go either way. Assuming that this is really sony's last HiMD unit ever:

1. Many MD/HiMD users will buy it, leaving scarce inventory and high prices.

2. Nobody cares, and a couple of months later the unit can be found for cheap (eg. the DH10P, dropping from the $500 asking price to $250 online).

I just want a metal slim HiMD player only unit with MP3 capability. If this is really Sony's last HiMD unit, I might actually get it (metal, quite slim, HD-amp).

[veezhun]

lose the big fonts peare..

all in all, a wonderful development for Hi Md. i shall procure one on release.. having 2 himds would be lovely

[droalea]

i won't because i have just bought my mz-nh1 just 2 months ago

[rayzray]

we all said that when we bought our FIRST unit; and many many units after; we say we will never buy another one; LOL's!

Edited March 10, 2006 by rayzray

[mercury_in_flames]

hello no. As others are saying, ONLY if they made a himd deck WITH optical out thank you very much.

[Stuge]

we all said that when we bought out FIRST unit; and many many units after; we say we will never buy another one; LOL's!

I usually don`t buy unit after unit ..I can`t afford that much that doesn`t mean i`m LOL

[The Low Volta]

well, I honestly didn't buy any 2nd gen as I was hoping there would be a good 3rd... I was hesitating a bit with the advent of the M-models but now I'm kinda glad! I will definitely buy 3rd G HiMD, long live recording!

[rayzray]

hello no. As others are saying, ONLY if they made a himd deck WITH optical out thank you very much.

IMO; Optical (digital) has a LOT of limitations and negatives. i use it spareingly; and prefer analogue; it's like an artist painting with shades. digital is too "Fake; wait; make it "Hate". yes; in my studio i use at least ONE analoge to thither up the edges.

if this is OT; then i'll come back and change my opinion.

[minidix]

Not only me, but MILIONS would buy a 3-rd gen Hi-MD unit, which should make it an i-pod killer if:

1. It willl be MARKETED. People don't know hi-md even exists. When they know, they tend to like it.

2. It will cost less than 200$. Not having a harddisk must reflect into the retail price.

3. Will use cheaper (2-3$) and hopefully easier to find 1GB hi-md disks or 7-8$ 2GB or larger disks

4. Will play natively (and correctly) MP3, (so it can be marketed as mp3 player) and Atrac Lossless, maybe other formats too, FLAC being a must

5. Will allow to play music transfered by drag&drop (at least mp3 and FLAC)

6. Will record natively in lossless compress formats (at least Atrac Lossless)

7. Will be faster for transfering music and data, USB 2.0 worthly (at least 1.5MB/s)

8. Could be used for mobile transfer and storage from digicams and phones (so it has to be a USB hub too, or at lest use USB On-The-Go or a wireless protocol)

Another killer product will be a Hi-md digital camera (but not a joke like DH10P; why on the earth buy that when I can do the same quality photos with my cell phone?) with at least 3X optical zoom and decent (al least 640x480 NTSC and 768x514 SECAM) mpeg4 video capability with sound (Atrac quality sound). People need a good excuse to carry a music player larger than a keychain (harddisk being a bad excuse), and a photocamera which sort of doubles as a MD camcorder is a good one. It has to have a large oled flipscreen for taking images in the camcorder style (180 degrees flip better, I don't want scratches on my oled when the unit is in my pocket and I can simply use the remote (a FM radio one better). It can be aggressively marketed as camera AND multimedia jukebox at a decent price.

[mercury_in_flames]

lets all face facts, if you want qan mp3 player dont get himd, pure and simple, If however you want a RECORDER that happens to do mp3 as well, then go for it. I would never get himd to replace a hard disk mp3 player, as I never record anything outside of my home.

[Stuge]

Righty said by Greg the rotter/Mercury In Flames that if you want all those capabilities of mp3 player in HI-Md then it is better to invest in Mp3 player rather then buying Hi-MD .

minidix, Remember DH10P is just a collectors edition & nothing else .I don`t think Sony is ever going to release a Hi-Md player with camera ..(As there are rumors that RH1 will be the last Hi-md player/recoder )

[xatax]

It's a HI-MD limitation as well...HI-MD can't write faster than roughly 1MB/s... bye bye, camcorder, serious digital camera... blablabla...

[1kyle]

Once you've listened to music at really high fidelity you'll feel sick at even hearing the word MP3. Fine for youngsters (and maybe not so youngsters) on the move for their first foray into small compact portable music and provided the bit rate is high enough it can be better than the old cassette walkmans that many of us "grew up with". Remember these also could RECORD as well so MD wasn't the first cheap portable recording format

In fact if you had a unit that could record TYPE IV METAL tapes (rareish but did exist) you could actually make some quite passable recordings too -- the limitations were tape being a Sequential medium meant that it wasn't easy or quick to find a specific track and friction (Tape over the heads) would cause wear and "dropouts". MD being a Disk format meant you had Random Access so finding a track is quick and easy --also being laser / optical there's no friction between the recording medium (the disk) and the laser.

However once you start wanting better quality sounds you'll soon discover that MP3 is a pretty horrible codec for music containing large transients and above all a high dynamic range.

MD will provide you quality --the 256 and 352 will certainly satisfy all but the most discerning audiophile and a single disc will give you around 7 hours listening --so 2 disks is more than enough even for people who wear their headphones all day long.

I certainly like the look of the new unit --but like others have requested

PLEASE A HI-MD DECK with an optical Out. A car unit is not so important as I've got the AUX IN cable now.

Cheers

-K

Edited March 11, 2006 by 1kyle

[whams]

However once you start wanting better quality sounds you'll soon discover that MP3 is a pretty horrible codec for music containing large transients and above all a high dynamic range.

MD will provide you quality --the 256 and 352 will certainly satisfy all but the most discerning audiophile and a single disc will give you around 7 hours listening --so 2 disks is more than enough even for people who wear their headphones all day long.

I certainly like the look of the new unit --but like others have requested

PLEASE A HI-MD DECK with an optical Out. A car unit is not so important as I've got the AUX IN cable now.

Cheers

-K

I agree with everything you just said....nice one!

As a 'audiophile' (home audio is my first love), mp3 makes me cringe! Atrac is certainly much more dynamic! I usually transfer all my tunes @ 352

And yeah, I would only buy a Hi-MD deck if it has digital out so I can run it through a decent DAC

[oti]

Most of the items mentioned below by 1kyle I agree with.

Of great importance to me is the Optical OUT connection, just because we still have the heritage of a classic format MD collection which we might eventually might want to transfer (lossless) in HiMD format.

The ablity to disable the automatic record level permanently is also a relief when doing serious live recording. As we see the forthcoming stunning MZ-RH1 is said to have this provision.

So I also welcome the possibility to still be able to record in MD-mode, just in case you need this. For example for demo use concerning classic users.

Another thing is that it is about time to introduce a stationnary homedeck with all the facilities we already know from e.g. the Sony QS series,

PLUS of course all the in and outs of HiMD recording, transferring, editing, level normalizing etc. Important is to have a stable bridge between the old and the new world (MD vs HiMD).

This homedeck, as mentioned below could then be equipped with hard disk recording, which also might appeal to a greater audience, not nescessarily people who belong to the hard core live recording enthousiast, but it might help lesser fanatics to pinpoint their choice.

This might strengthen the installed base of HiMD users.

Thanks for paying attention,

Oti

(My first contribution to the forum)

Depends on what it looks like and what features it has.

I'b buy one in a shot if models had most of these features.

1) Upload, download of SP in true SP mode

2) All Net-MD restrictions to be abolished (upload / download like Hi-MD)

3) Optical IN AND OUT (although provided the transfer restrictions were lifted a USB cable would do if they couldn't provide an optical out.

4) Volume restriction (EU models) only applies in France -- An easy user option to bypass the restriction outside France (EU models)

5) Nice El display like the RH10

6)Portable models --more robust construction --Battery levers that don't break easily

7) Decks which INCLUDE a built in HD -- could be useful for ripping CD's etc without needing a computer and then transfering to MD --or just as a staging post for transferring music to MD's.

8) True Drag 'n Drop support

9) Mac support

10) really wishful thinking --Linux support.

11) DRM for non downloaded purchased music to be GONE so OMA filese were really OPEN --still can't think of how they called it Open OMG --it's been the format most resistant to any sort of hacking that I've been aware of --so much so I think even the most "Geekish" hacker has long since abandoned the effort of trying to break the encryption.

We won't get all of these of course but I'd still buy a 3rd gen if some of these wishes were implemented.

Cheers

-K

I would buy anything... but please Lord (here SONY)LET THERE BE A Hi-MD DECK

As I mentioned above. Let Sony do this and put a hard disk and more (e.g. CD recorder, solid state memory) in this dreamed of HiMD homedeck.

It should be the bridge between MD and HiMD. The transfer center so to speak.

GIve it more features and the big audience would hopefully buy this thing.

By the way, Sony should refrain from profits on a HiMD homedeck, just because we all were faithful to the format for more than 12 years!

12 years and now we're let down playing with a dead-end HiMD toy.

No come on with the full feature homedeck so there is a reason for the HiMD adept to live on.

[1kyle]

12 years and now we're let down playing with a dead-end HiMD toy.

No come on with the full feature homedeck so there is a reason for the HiMD adept to live on.

If the equipment still gives you the quality you want in 12 years time and continues to function perfectly why stop using it if you still enjoy it.

What on earth would you do with your solar powered 55 Trillion track device in 2018 when all you want to do is play of 7 or 8 tracks (apart from how do you even FIND them in that size device)and it's been snowing for days so no power --and no place for an "obsolete" dry battery.

Just pick up any high end audiophile magazine -- look and see how many high end amplifiers are still made using glass VALVES (or "Tubes" as I think they are called in the US).

These are really expensive pieces of kit (often over 5,000 USD) and command a loyal following --in spite of the fact that that technology (Vacuum tube technology) has been essentially obsolete for over 35 years.

People still use film even though digital cameras are the norm now

and whilst the Horse is obsolete for most travel -- people still ride them.

Don't chuck stuff just because it's "Old" == That's how some people are laughing all the way to the Bank.

Cheers

-K

Edited March 11, 2006 by 1kyle

[Sparky191]

Once you've listened to music at really high fidelity you'll feel sick at even hearing the word MP3. Fine for youngsters (and maybe not so youngsters) on the move for their first foray into small compact portable music and provided the bit rate is high enough it can be better than the old cassette walkmans that many of us "grew up with". Remember these also could RECORD as well so MD wasn't the first cheap portable recording format.....

However once you start wanting better quality sounds you'll soon discover that MP3 is a pretty horrible codec for music containing large transients and above all a high dynamic range.

If you encode your MP3's at 192kps-320kps with lame at HQ or insane most people (95%) will have a problem hearing the difference between that and a CD even through a HiFi. If you do notice it it will most likely be on demanding classical pieces. If you are playing undemanding stuff like pop, rock and dance you won't hear a difference especially if are using low end earphones and are in a noisy enviroment like a street or office. Personally I find my Shuffle and Creative Zen to sound "better" (warning subjective opinion) at comparible bitrates than my HiMD on 256kps or 352kps. Especially with classical stuff. I suspect myself that its most likely because I prefer the signature "sound" of those devices. Mind you IMO the Shuffle/Zen and HiMD are all signicantly "better" (more enjoyable to me) to listen to than any Portable CD or pre 5G iPod I've heard.

The main advantage of MP3 is that everything plays it. My PC, MP3 players, my car stereo. So its the defaco standard. For the majoirity of people its good enough. I have started switching to FLAC (Lossless) not because its better SQ. But its a better archival format because I can encode anything I want from that with no loss of SQ. If Sony had given us ATRAC Lossless (that worked) and a means to rip to other formats a lot earlier I think you'd have kept a lot of Audiophiles with HiMD. As it stands its just not a convenient format.

Most people suffer it because of the redcording abilities of the MD/HiMD.

Edited March 11, 2006 by Sparky191

[greenshank]

If the equipment still gives you the quality you want in 12 years time and continues to function perfectly why stop using it if you still enjoy it.

Sad to say, but I really don't expect my shiny new MD to be working in 12 years' time, any more than I expect my shiny new washing machine/dishwasher/video recorder/computer to be. 12? Nothing like (from bitter experience, not mere cynicism). Most (all?) manufacturers have completely abandoned any pretence at producing "quality" (i.e. long-lived) products because they know perfectly well that there is more money to be had by selling us stuff that dies just after the warranty period is up and then wooing us with a "better" (read: more bells and whistles) product.

People still use film even though digital cameras are the norm now

That's because film produces far superior results. Granted, it's not nearly so convenient and notably more expensive. But it's horses for courses. Your average MP3 player may well be perfectly ok for listening to in a noisy environment (office/car/public transport) but surely no-one in their right mind would listen to MP3s over high-fidelity equipment in the comfort of their own armchair.

Don't chuck stuff just because it's "Old" == That's how some people are laughing all the way to the Bank.

Quite. But do chuck it if it's broken.

A random sequence of responses perhaps. I neither agree nor disagree wholeheartedly with 1kyle.

[Sparky191]

... but surely no-one in their right mind would listen to MP3s over high-fidelity equipment in the comfort of their own armchair.

Quite. But do chuck it if it's broken....

Minor point. Lots of people don't have high-fidelity equipment. So MP3 is fine for them.

Edited March 11, 2006 by Sparky191

[greenshank]

The main advantage of MP3 is that everything plays it. My PC, MP3 players, my car stereo. So its the defaco standard.

Like Windows, then. A standard, but a poor one.

Your car stereo plays MP3? How? Does it have a USB port to plug your MP3 player into? Perhaps you mean MP3 CDs that you burnt yourself, then, in which case (a) the vast majority of people are driving cars whose stereos don't, and ( you had to burn it yourself. Not terribly convenient as a format then.

PCs with the right software play almost anything. MP3, WAs, WMA, FLAC, OGG, etc.

MP3 players play MP3... well they would!

I just don't think "everything plays it" is a good distinguishing factor. "Everybody's heard of it" might be closer to the mark. It comes down to marketing again. (Where have I heard that before?)

Minor point. Lots of people don't have high-fidelity equipment. So MP3 is fine for them.

Yes indeed, and not a minor point at all. There are lots of people who are happy to listen to poor reproductions of music, as indeed there are apparently burgeoning numbers who are happy to watch videos (even of films!) on their mobile phones. Is that utterly insane or what? Well, good luck to them, I say. Just don't let hoi polloi ruin it for the rest of us. Why should society always sink to satisfying the lowest common denominator and sod the rest of us? Why should economics always triumph over aesthetics?

Fortunately there are audiophiles out there (and plenty on this forum) and equally there are Windows-o-phobics a-plenty too.

Edited March 11, 2006 by greenshank

[Sparky191]

Like Windows, then. A standard, but a poor one.

I'm no MS fanboy but its good enough for the majority of people and business. Its a good product not the best no. But its no good having the "best product" if you can't sell it. Same with VHS and CD Audio aswell. There are better standards of everything. Its usually the best mix of features and cost that wins out.

Your car stereo plays MP3? How? Does it have a USB port to plug your MP3 player into? Perhaps you mean MP3 CDs that you burnt yourself, then, in which case (a) the vast majority of people are driving cars whose stereos don't, and ( you had to burn it yourself. Not terribly convenient as a format then.

Both actually. Though I just use a CDRW. Since most DAPs do not support UMS filetree for music, USB ports aren't that useful. The iPod link is better if its implemented well. (not always). But MP3/CD's are more convienent than CD's. I have about 5 or 6 abums on one CD. Obviously means I can easily swap albums without swapping CD's. You could have more with lower bitrates if you want. Beats messing around with a CD changer, and also I don't leave need original CD's in the car. It only costs $150 for a decent pionneer one. I replaced the original cassette unit (which broke) with one. I could have gone MD but really thats just a pain at this point. HiMD I would have gone with had it been available. CD isn't much better. But its a wider standard. No brainer really.

PCs with the right software play almost anything. MP3, WAs, WMA, FLAC, OGG, etc.

And?

MP3 players play MP3... well they would! I just don't think "everything plays it" is a good distinguishing factor. "Everybody's heard of it" might be closer to the mark. It comes down to marketing again. (Where have I heard that before?)

Universal support isn't a good feature? Sorry I can't agree. Its just common sense that standardisation is a good thing, most of the time. (not always).

Edited March 11, 2006 by Sparky191

[greenshank]

I'm no MS fanboy but its good enough for the majority of people and business. Its a good product not the best no. But its no good having the "best product" if you can't sell it.

Yes, as I and others have said, poor marketing kills MD.

My beef with MS is that it isn't a good product, it's an average (and often unreliable) product that wins only because people don't get offered any choice. I hate and loathe having to suffer it every minute of my working day just because the people with clout say it's a standard.

Universal support isn't a good feature? Sorry I can't agree.

Happily I didn't say that. Universal support is a good thing. I was just pointing out that (a) MP3 support is not universal (99%(?) of car stereos; heck, most people are driving round with no better recordings than cassettes to listen to, and not even chrome or metal ones at that (the younger generation will no idea what I'm rabbitting on about!)) and ( universal support in itself doesn't make for a good product.

[MDGB2]

heck, most people are driving round with no better recordings than cassettes to listen to, and not even chrome or metal ones at that (the younger generation will no idea what I'm rabbitting on about!)) and ( universal support in itself doesn't make for a good product.

Indeed. The TDK SA90 type II chrome tape is a fine bit of kit.

[1kyle]

That's because film produces far superior results.

Absolutely NOT true anymore for PROFESSIONAL Gear --like Phase 1 Medium format 40 MP digital backs @ 20,000 USD each or a Canon 1Ds MK II 16 MP 35 MM professional digital camera a bit cheaper at around 8,000 USD.

Don't compare these at ALL with the consumer point and shoots that most people confuse with "Photography" or even horror of horrors mobile phone "cameras".

Some high end fashion magazines and a lot of commercial advertising are now shot almost totally with digital equipment and almost NO press or Sports stuff is done any more on film. Even "The National Geographic" magazine -- certainly full of very serious and top notch world class photography has embraced digital submissions from its photographers. If it's good enough for that magazine then I think you can say end of argument.

If you still need more convincing just lurk on any professional photography forum where this is now a non issue --most shooters are friendly people -- they won't "bite" you for reading their forums. 3 or even 2 years ago I *might* have agreed with you but not now.

I'm a Pro shooter and I can assure people that the days of film in Professional Photography are all but gone --in 35 MM it's about 98% extinct, in Medium Format film will last a bit longer just because of the very high price (currently) of digital medium format backs and the quite considerable computing power required to process the MASSIVE files generated by these 40 MP digital backs.

The only areas where film is still a major player is in the very niche orientated LF (Large Format) work or in scientific type applications --X-Ray, medical and infra-red.

However to get back to the topic Hi-MD etc.

--I think you'll also find that some of the high end decks around (MDS980 etc) are more than likely to last 12 years or more if used properly.

Portable players aren't built to quite the same set of Engineering standards unfortunately but you should be able to get 4 or 5 years use out of them without too much problem.

My past experience with portable players shows this to be a reasonable expectation.

Cheers

-K

Edited March 11, 2006 by 1kyle

[MDGB2]

Absolutely NOT true anymore for PROFESSIONAL Gear --like Phase 1 Medium format 40 MP digital backs @ 20,000 USD each or a Canon 1Ds MK II 16 MP 35 MM professional digital camera a bit cheaper at around 8,000 USD.

Don't compare these at ALL with the consumer point and shoots that most people confuse with "Photography" or even horror of horrors mobile phone "cameras".

Some high end fashion magazines and a lot of commercial advertising are now shot almost totally with digital equipment and almost NO press or Sports stuff is done any more on film. Even "The National Geographic" magazine -- certainly full of very serious and top notch world class photography has embraced digital submissions from its photographers. If it's good enough for that magazine then I think you can say end of argument.

If you still need more convincing just lurk on any professional photography forum where this is now a non issue --most shooters are friendly people -- they won't "bite" you for reading their forums. 3 or even 2 years ago I *might* have agreed with you but not now.

I'm a Pro shooter and I can assure people that the days of film in Professional Photography are all but gone --in 35 MM it's about 98% extinct, in Medium Format film will last a bit longer just because of the very high price (currently) of digital medium format backs and the quite considerable computing power required to process the MASSIVE files generated by these 40 MP digital backs.

The only areas where film is still a major player is in the very niche orientated LF (Large Format) work or in scientific type applications --X-Ray, medical and infra-red.

However to get back to the topic Hi-MD etc.

--I think you'll also find that some of the high end decks around (MDS980 etc) are more than likely to last 12 years or more if used properly.

Portable players aren't built to quite the same set of Engineering standards unfortunately but you should be able to get 4 or 5 years use out of them without too much problem.

My past experience with portable players shows this to be a reasonable expectation.

Cheers

-K

Kodak estimate that around 26MP is equivalent to current 35mm film.

Oh yeh, MD....

Yeah, units should last a long time. My '97 vintage MZF-40 and the JB920 (now 8 years old) still kicking!

[1kyle]

Kodak estimate that around 26MP is equivalent to current 35mm film.

Oh yeh, MD....

Yeah, units should last a long time. My '97 vintage MZF-40 and the JB920 (now 8 years old) still kicking!

Without turning this into a Photography debate -- there are Pixels and Pixels --they have different sizes depending on the equipment and sensor size so "resolution" is a hard concept to quantify.

Kodak have exited Professional level digital photography --their last professional attempt (14N) was a total disaster and a joke amongst pro shooters. They now concentrate on "Consumer" gear and sensor manufacturing.

The main limitation in 35 MM digital photography is not the number of MP (mega pixels) but the limitation in current Lens design.

A top notch 35 MM lens has a resolving power of around 50 -60 Lp/mm --line pairs per mm.

This is a limiting factor in increasing the number of pixels in a digital camera. With film you get problems of "Grain" long before you get any where near the "potential number of MP" you need to compete with digital. --Even an expensive DRUM scanned image (100 USD for a SINGLE SCAN --no B/S as any Pro shooters here will know what I mean about Drum Scans) won't give you anything like the "Grainless" 16 MP digital image you can get from Canon's flagship 1Ds2 35 MM digital camera --these pics are often blown up to over 6 Feet X 4 Feet or even bigger.

The 26 MP Kodak talks about is not sensibly useable --Grain as I've stated above will rear it's ugly head LONG LONG before that with film.

The 40 MP of the Phase 1 Digital backs far exceed this --but you'd better have a FAST computer and a HUGE wallet -- Medium Format Lenses are again another order of magnitude more expensive than even the best 35 MM lens --but their resolving power is better as well --120 - 150 lp / mm --but if you are buying a schneider you'll need to win the lottery TWICE or mortgage 3 houses.

And yes I hope to be still using my JB980 in 12 years time.

Cheers

-K

Edited March 11, 2006 by 1kyle