Have any HiMD users gone BACK to MDLP?

[Avrin]

Don't forget that there's no way to transfer SP from a computer to a minidisc!

[THIS SUCKS]

only by analog means hi-md rendered is awesome.

[calpico]

Don't forget that there's no way to transfer SP from a computer to a minidisc!

i only transfer my mp3's to SP so i can use them on all of my units and alll cd's are transfered through my optical cable. I have a question though. So if i transfer a wav file through the USB, will it be as good as transfering it through an optical out on my computer?

[THIS SUCKS]

no not if you have a standard net md unit. you will get lp2 quality which is much lower than wave quality. i was burning my mp3's to cd-rw's then copying the burned disk through my optical cable to my md unit to get true sp ...

[bobzilli]

I don't transfer anything by USB anymore anyway, I go direct real time and, in my opinion, get much better quality

[calpico]

I don't transfer anything by USB anymore anyway, I go direct real time and, in my opinion, get much better quality

Really??? i had no idea that the quality was going to be better transfering through the optical cable vs the USB for mp3's using SP. So even if i were to transfer my 192k mp3's through the optical cable then they would sound better then if i were to use the USB? if this is the case then i may be getting rid of my RH1 soon.

Edited May 9, 2008 by calpico

[bobt]

Don't forget that there's no way to transfer SP from a computer to a minidisc!

Really!! I think you mean there is no unit controlled SP, but I have recorded many MD's with 4.3 that play on my car deck, and my MZ1, so the answer is yes if you want, you can record from your computer to your MD in sp, you just have to dig a bit to do it.

Bob

Really??? i had no idea that the quality was going to be better transfering through the optical cable vs the USB for mp3's using SP. So even if i were to transfer my 192k mp3's through the optical cable then they would sound better then if i were to use the USB? if this is the case then i may be getting rid of my RH1 soon.

No matter which way you record the units electronics convert to digital to go on the disc. Bet you couldn't tell the difference blinfolded, or on a double blind test.

If you really can, then I have some $500.00 a foot speaker cable that you will love

Bob

[calpico]

Really!! I think you mean there is no unit controlled SP, but I have recorded many MD's with 4.3 that play on my car deck, and my MZ1, so the answer is yes if you want, you can record from your computer to your MD in sp, you just have to dig a bit to do it.

Bob

No matter which way you record the units electronics convert to digital to go on the disc. Bet you couldn't tell the difference blinfolded, or on a double blind test.

If you really can, then I have some $500.00 a foot speaker cable that you will love

Bob

hmmm ok now this information is the exact reason for joining this forum. I don't think a manual could tell me this. thanks alot everybody.

[Riccardo]

... it seems all the Hi-MD units have some kind of strange flaw in each, some worse than others.

I don't know about all hi-md units, but my rh1 and rh10 both do. The rh1 has that wierd eject button that's always being pushed accidentally, and it has no title on the main unit display. The RH10 has quirky buttons, my volume up sometimes invokes search mode, and the next track / last track misbehaves, too. I really only use my RH10 for recording through the USB cable, which means I don't need to use the buttons at all. What a pain.

[bobt]

Really??? i had no idea that the quality was going to be better transfering through the optical cable vs the USB for mp3's using SP. So even if i were to transfer my 192k mp3's through the optical cable then they would sound better then if i were to use the USB? if this is the case then i may be getting rid of my RH1 soon.

that's the beauty of a piece of kit like the RH1, possibilities are endless, and a lot of conjecture, easiest way to test, get a piece of music you are really familiar with, record it realtime, and through SS at a couple of bitrates, put the unit on shuffle, and see what you really hear.

Enjoy your toy,

Bob

[bobzilli]

Really!! I think you mean there is no unit controlled SP, but I have recorded many MD's with 4.3 that play on my car deck, and my MZ1, so the answer is yes if you want, you can record from your computer to your MD in sp, you just have to dig a bit to do it.

Bob

No matter which way you record the units electronics convert to digital to go on the disc. Bet you couldn't tell the difference blinfolded, or on a double blind test.

If you really can, then I have some $500.00 a foot speaker cable that you will love

Bob

I record analogue real time, which I should have clarified. I spent a long time making comparisons, maybe too long, but reached this conclusion after much trial and error. For me anyway. I have a pretty good CD player with great converters-which may help, and no thanks to the 500 dollar cable-unless you will fly me to the islands to pick it up!!!

[Strungup]

He's gonna fly me there first

[sfbp]

I don't transfer anything by USB anymore anyway, I go direct real time and, in my opinion, get much better quality

I think that I finally worked it out when someone said that USB->SP is a "fake" LP2 + padding:

1. You don't get something for nothing. Fast uploads/downloads = sacrifice of quality

2. Sony didn't want to make it easy for us to author high-quality stuff

3. The Dolby codecs cannot be used on the computer, Sony never got a license to do that.

So here are the reliable options (sequence):

a. Record from analog using Sony's great electronics in any of their decks. (A->D probably better than any sound card). A new option suggested here I haven't explored (yet) is to go straight to computer from the optical out without actually making an MD.

b. Transfer from a deck at x1 for editing/noise removal on the computer, capturing on the optical sound card input.

c. Make a CD of the wave files after processing.

d. Record the CD back to SP via x1 optical link (this is relatively easy because the track marks get made for you).

One real problem in all this is that you have to keep throwing away any title information.

I have gotten into the habit (after the x1 upload) of putting the SP disk listing in the transfer screen of SonicStage, and as I extract each track from the properly processed waveform, I can cut and paste the name from the existing minidisc listing when I save the wave file. TOC cloning or something equivalent would be nice, but the contents may have changed a bit (deletion of clunks and run-in/out) so this is good enough.

As you say, it's tedious, but it works.

Hi-MD (256K) is OK, but SP is about 99.99% as good as a CD.

[Richard]

From my point of view I personally have never gone back to MDLP - I only have once legacy unit left (the E900), all my others including my bookshelf system are Hi-MD. If I am desperate (or feeling nostalgic) to listen to something on the E900 (doesn't happen a lot) I'll just make an SP dub on the bookshelf but for pretty much everything else I'll rip it direct to 352k which sounds wonderful to me...

For homemade recordings I have a few things archived in SP or occasionally LP2, but I have never felt the need to go back to the pre-Hi-MD days..

[peter_x]

I'm confused.

I got a netMD recorder to record from CD. My only interest is transferring pre-recorded CD's to MD in the highest quality possible. And it has to be legacy because I am using them on a car deck. So what is the way to do this? I don't mind doing something in real time, but what sfbp posted is a real pain.

[sfbp]

I'm confused.

I got a netMD recorder to record from CD. My only interest is transferring pre-recorded CD's to MD in the highest quality possible. And it has to be legacy because I am using them on a car deck. So what is the way to do this? I don't mind doing something in real time, but what sfbp posted is a real pain.

Peter, if you only want to record pre-recorded CD's to MD and play in your car, you are totally provided for by Sony's hardware and software.

After all, in the car, how much quality can the ear actually hear?

I suggest you compare aurally the result of playing CD x1 into the optical output of your MD (if you have such) with CD via USB. Problem - most of the NetMD's especially the cheaper ones, don't have optical input.

I've looked at the waveforms, and there really doesn't seem to be a lot of evidence one way or the other. But to me (and others, it appears) my ears tell me that the steps I outlined are the way to avoid losing any quality when uploading from MD and back to MD. That's probably Sony's intention - to allow slightly downlevel copies always, but to make it hard to make perfect bit-wise copies. That's probably why you see people all excited about the ability to copy "raw" MD on the dual minidisc deck.

But I think any high-speed copy is going to be iffy. Just my opinion.

[peter_x]

Peter, if you only want to record pre-recorded CD's to MD and play in your car, you are totally provided for by Sony's hardware and software.

After all, in the car, how much quality can the ear actually hear?

I suggest you compare aurally the result of playing CD x1 into the optical output of your MD (if you have such) with CD via USB. Problem - most of the NetMD's especially the cheaper ones, don't have optical input.

I've looked at the waveforms, and there really doesn't seem to be a lot of evidence one way or the other. But to me (and others, it appears) my ears tell me that the steps I outlined are the way to avoid losing any quality when uploading from MD and back to MD. That's probably Sony's intention - to allow slightly downlevel copies always, but to make it hard to make perfect bit-wise copies. That's probably why you see people all excited about the ability to copy "raw" MD on the dual minidisc deck.

But I think any high-speed copy is going to be iffy. Just my opinion.

Hmm, you are probably right that in a car, I couldn't tell the difference.

I am using a downloader (N420D), so I can't compare to optical-in recordings.

I was wondering if newer units make better recordings, or is this a function of SS?

Eventually I want to get a deck too so I can listen in the house.

Thanks.

[bobt]

Hmm, you are probably right that in a car, I couldn't tell the difference.

I am using a downloader (N420D), so I can't compare to optical-in recordings.

I was wondering if newer units make better recordings, or is this a function of SS?

Eventually I want to get a deck too so I can listen in the house.

Thanks.

The reality is, unless you have audiophile grade speakers, headphones, and amplificatio, you are not going to be able to hear the difference, unless you record hi demand music at ultalow bitrates.

Recording CD's to MD at SP will give you incredible recordings, don't worry about things not worth worrying about,

Bob

[JG98258]

I too record my MDs only by realtime, straight out of the CD player into the RH1, using a Monster Cable Interlink 400 RCA to stereo minplug cable. The CD player is a Denon DCM-360, analog only for the output. I record onto the MD at either HiSP 256 kbps or PCM for my really favorite stuff.

I did an extensive comparison of this method(HiSP 256 kbps) vs. Sonic Stage @352 kbps, and came to the conclusion the straight out of CD player method sounded just as good if not better than the SS method. And I compared a variety of well recorded, dynamically wide, and complex CD music that I know well. Stuff recorded onto the MD by PCM sounds even better- essentially the same as a CD.

I use SS for titling and backing up, but not for recording. I don't use LP for anything musical.

[John1951]

I'm just registered and am a bit late on this thread, but I'd comment as follows.

I've a couple of HiMD units, but because my main deck connect to the hi fi only takes the standard discs so I still tend use that format in the main, and mainly set to LP2 as I find the quality is good enough for most recordings. The HiMD has been useful for recording long (longer than 2hr 40min radio shows), and last time I found I could edit the content (via Sonic Stage) and then record the parts I did want keep, to fit a standard disc recording set at LP2.

With two HiMD units I guess I could "anchor" one to the main hi fi set up, and make more use of that format.

John

Edited May 14, 2008 by JohnR

[whatsleftofj]

I hate to say it, but I've been using my NW-A808 far more than my minidisc units since I started school again last August. I don't have a huge md library built up, and I used to just make a new day's disc each morning. Well, time doesn't permit that anymore, so this 8gb mp3 unit (which I purchased off the forums here due to it being the last ATRAC unit, I apologize to the buyer whose name I forget) has been taking the 8-hour-a-day wear-and-tear.

With regards to Hi-MD vs MDLP: I have a DH10P whose battery life sucks now, and my RH1 is a bit of a pain to use because I prefer a screen. I used to have an RH10, which I absolutely loved, but I sold it to my brother to start him off in the minidisc world.

I have appx. 5 Hi-MD discs that I change whenever I want to take my RH1 to work. I keep my E900 (my only MDLP unit) in my car, and I have tons of 'mix' discs that I keep in the car for 'just in case' purposes. Like if my mp3 player is dead, or I forget it at home, I still have that E900 for a backup.

If I had a deck I'd probably use MDLP more, actually. I would prefer a collection of high-quality albums and mixes on MDLP as opposed to choosing 'x' amount of albums to put on one Hi-MD disc. That's what my NW-A808 is for. But I really miss md, and hopefully this summer I'll have time to actually create a minidisc library. I've got >20 sealed mds and 5 sealed hi-mds just waiting for me.

Edited May 19, 2008 by whatsleftofj

[bobzilli]

The A808 is one of the best sounding players out there.If I were gonna go for one, it might well be the pick. I have an IPod touch which I barely use as the sound is so harsh. MD just sounds better than any of these players I've heard, so I keep going with discs

[PsychoPimpKiller]

I know it has been a year and a half since anyone has replied to this topic but I wanted to say my peace.

I started out with MDLP (N505) around 2003 or so and then moved to a R700 last year. I have recently (within the past year) purchased 2 Hi-MD units (RH910 & RH700). I like them both but mainly do recordings of live shows with them and I still mix discs for the MDLP units. I think that if Sony wouldn't have come out with Hi-MD as a last ditch effort (so to speak) they would be a little more popular and gotten a little more into the mainstream. Instead, they introduce it in 2004 and pretty much stop making or promoting it around 2006/2007. Doesn't sound like they had alot of faith in it. I like it alot but I feel the same way as alot of other people on here. Standard minidisc and MDLP are easier to find (I just recently got another R700 off of ebay with 9 discs for @ $40).

I'm not a minidisc expert but I love the concept and the product (despite all its flaws). But I think the "staying power" of Standard and MDLP will outlast the Hi-MD. Standard was around been around since 1992 and then almost 10 years later, they introduce MDLP. Even when the introduce Hi-MD in 2004 they made it backwards compatible with Standard and MDLP. And you can even make MDLP mixes with Hi-MD.

Don't get me wrong. This doesn't mean that I will selling my Hi-MD units anytime soon but if I have to replace them in the future it will cost me more than a Standard or MDLP. I have no use for a Standard unit though, only MDLP & Hi-MD for me. Thank you for reading.

P.S. - It would be really nice if they would come out with a newer minidisc (possibly Blu-Ray), but I'm not going to hold my breath cause if they do it will probably be short lived like the Hi-MD's were. Peoples' attention spans these days are very short and the life of electronic products these days are short. That's why they keep coming out with new products every few months. But that's a whole other topic.

[zoe25]

I use HiMD for live recordings as you can fit a concert on an 80min disc in Hi-SP mode without changing discs and the quality is great.

For home use, I still use SP as it is the most compatible, though I sometimes use LP2 if I am travelling.

I use HiMD for live recordings as you can fit a concert on an 80min disc in Hi-SP mode without changing discs and the quality is great.

For home use, I still use SP as it is the most compatible, though I sometimes use LP2 if I am travelling.

[Jimma]

I'm definitely a one album, one disc kind of guy. Both for compatibility reasons, as the head unit in my VW camper and the MDS-JE510 in my lounge are both SP only, and to have all my albums neatly labelled and arranged alphabetically (a bit anal I know) on shelves, having just one thing on each disc seems best.

I do use Hi-MD though.

When going on holiday and not wanting to carry loads of discs it comes in very handly, but mainly, if I'm out DJing I can set up a recorder in the club, warehouse, field, etc and record the whole event at quite high quality without having to stay sober enough to remember to change discs!

[PhilippeC]

Hello everybody, thanks for that reborn post !

I am completely in the subject because I am right know re-recording ALL my Mds - except my 1G MD - in SP. Most of them has been recorded previously in Hi-MD mode (352-256-192kbps).

Source

1) original CD (Cyrus dadIII player)

2) Music in my computer, optical out : Flac, Ape, even MP3 because I record in real time with WinAmp + Wincue + DFX Audio Enhancer

Monster optical cable

Recorders (all type S so type R)

Sony MZ-RH1

Sony MZ-NH900

Sony MZ-N510

to finally listening on my Sony professionnal deck MDS-B5 (SP only) which have a terrific sound.

[dms09]

Personally, I use my Sharp MD-X5 to copy CDs straight to MD, but this unit only allows SP so i'm kind of stuck. However, except on the move, I'm not sure when I'd need more than one album per disk. I do have an Hi-MD recorder (an MZ-NH600), but it only really gets used for burning mp3s to SP using sonic stage.

Maybe if my primary home MD player was capable of the later formats I'd be different, but I'm in no hurry to replace it.

[PhilippeC]

Personally, I use my Sharp MD-X5 to copy CDs straight to MD, but this unit only allows SP so i'm kind of stuck. However, except on the move, I'm not sure when I'd need more than one album per disk. I do have an Hi-MD recorder (an MZ-NH600), but it only really gets used for burning mp3s to SP using sonic stage.

Maybe if my primary home MD player was capable of the later formats I'd be different, but I'm in no hurry to replace it.

I supposed that you know that I you use SS for making SP recording you will get a MD with a sound quality similar to LP2.

Just Make a test... if you are ready to record in real time from your MP3s : use Winamp + the Wincue plugin to have separate tracks (you must export a playlist from Winamp : see Winamp Library/Playlists/Manage playlist/Export playlist...). The plugin DFX Audio Enhancer will enhance all your music, lossless and MP3 files.

[dms09]

I supposed that you know that I you use SS for making SP recording you will get a MD with a sound quality similar to LP2.

Just Make a test... if you are ready to record in real time from your MP3s : use Winamp + the Wincue plugin to have separate tracks (you must export a playlist from Winamp : see Winamp Library/Playlists/Manage playlist/Export playlist...). The plugin DFX Audio Enhancer will enhance all your music, lossless and MP3 files.

Thanks for the tip! I'll certainly give it a go. I just assumed that using SS to transfer the audio directly to the md without going through my rubbish sound card would produce a better quality recording. Any tips for what kind of volume I should play them at for recording?

[dms09]

OK I've tried it. And it truly is excellent. As for using it to record to minidisc, I'm not so sure. Maybe i'm old fashioned, but I think this kind of processing belongs on the player, not on the recording. Ideally, the music should be as "flat" (bad choice of words i admit) as possible so the quality bass enhancers, etc of the player can have the best effect.<br><br>I will be using it to play my MP3s from the computer, however <br>